Last week was probably our last LD trip on Amtrak

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C855B

Service Attendant
Joined
Jun 13, 2015
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148
First of all, this is not an "I hate Amtrak!" rant. We're both railfans, we love LD train travel and what Amtrak tries to be, but it's becoming clearer train travel in its current incarnation doesn't love us back.

After our experiences last week are taken in combination with numerous similar trips over the past several years, I'd say the odds of our taking another cross-country trip on Amtrak are slim. Not zero, but still unlikely. In a way, it's about Amtrak service, but mostly in relation with how it fits with how we live our lives. There are two issues, really. And a contributing third problem.

First issue is that the sleeper bunks are fairly uncomfortable. I hadn't previously processed just how uncomfortable they were until we got back home and I crashed on our sofa - which is also too short and narrow for me to stretch out - but I slept really well given the softer, thicker cushions. It's that simple. At any rate, neither of us were sleeping well on the train and by the end of three days we were both tired and grouchy (and therefore my sleeping on the sofa!). My wife commented that the sleeper beds are just shy of a sleeping bag. I disagreed, but probably only because she's never experienced a sleeping bag on rocks without an air mattress.

But the second issue is likely the biggest one - the regimented dining car schedule, and the officious and surly DCA who enforces it. We don't eat three big meals a day on a strict timetable, and, being retired, we sure as hell don't get up at 6:00am just so we don't miss the breakfast service. By day two we feel bloated and lethargic, and no amount of walking the length of the train at service and crew-change stops mitigates it. Uncomfortable, again. I know we can't change the dining car management culture, but, rather, if the sleeping car passenger had the option of using their pre-paid meal allowance in the lounge car for lighter meals on their schedule, not the DCA's, I'm sure we would have a much more enjoyable experience. Or, offer discounted sleeping accommodations without meals (but that would break their system, too).

Third, and well-documented on AU, the new points redemption system sucks for the LD customer. At least twice as many points for the same trips, and that's after shopping around for fare "buckets". It's still sort of a deal, but we are having serious conversations over breakfast over how good a deal it really is considering the time it takes for us to recover from each leg of a trip.

So... it looks like we're returning to car trips for our annual West Coast outings. Not happy about that, either, because it takes more time and is still very stressful and tiring, but in different ways. We were hoping the train would be a relaxing way to get from here to there and back, but after multiple tries it's just not working out that way.

[sigh]
 
Quote:

“the sleeper bunks are fairly uncomfortable ... also too short and narrow for me to stretch out”

Just speaking for myself, I'm a BIG guy at 6' 2". The roomette 'berth' for me was large enough for me to lay full length,

and wide enough for me to flip over from side to side (not roll over).

I see on the Amtrak website that the length of the lower ‘bunk’ is 6' 6“ and the upper is 6' 2“.
They are narrow, so you can’t spread out. But then, you are riding on a train.
https://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?c=AM_Accommodation_C&pagename=am%2FLayout&cid=1241210576173

I actually commented several times to friends I was visiting in San Diego how impressed I was with comfort of the roomette bunk bed.

Again, just my experience and opinion.
 
One thing that might help on the meal front is inform the Sleeper car attendant that you want your meal in your room. This may give you a little more control over when (or less, depending on how on top of things they are.)
 
While I would agree that the AGR points required for TWO people to travel LD in a sleeper may have increased substantially this year, I have found so far that ALL of my trips in a sleeper traveling alone have required FEWER points in the 2.0 system than they did in prior years.
 
Yeah I'm 6'3, slim build, and I fit fine. How tall/big are you that you don't fit? If you don't fit on those bunks, there is no train system in the world, save for a private car which has a king size bed, in which you can sleep.
 
One thing that might help on the meal front is inform the Sleeper car attendant that you want your meal in your room. This may give you a little more control over when (or less, depending on how on top of things they are.)
Considered that, but the issue is the limited service hours, and then the heaviness of the fare. Given the limited resources on the train, I'm completely sympathetic that the dining car crew can't be open-ended on either menu or hours. Plus we try to be as small a burden to the SCA as possible, especially this last trip with a lot of particularly "needy" folks pressing the call button constantly.

Anyway, on a "normal" day for us whether at home or traveling, we awaken 7-8 a.m., dawdle over coffee and tea, and have a light-to-medium breakfast around 9 or so. We break for lunch at 2-3, then catch a very light nosh mid-evening. None of that fits with dining car hours, nor does the menu.

That the evening selections are consistently (OMG!) heavy doesn't help. Tasty, yes, most of the time, but still really heavy. Once we figured out this was part of our gastric discomfort problem, it was a real feat convincing the server that all we wanted was salad, something to drink and then a light dessert. That the lunch full salad is not served for dinner was annoying, plus one supper I wanted "just a hamburger" (supposedly a lunch item available for dinner) and was rebuffed that they weren't doing burgers that evening. Crimeny!

I guess the meal plan is OK for a single overnighter. An overindulgent dinner later than we normally eat, a hearty if too early breakfast, and then resuming our life out in the real world would work. But two nights and three days on the train, this gets to be a bit much. I wish there were lighter meal options, but I'm not ready yet to spend extra cash on lounge car snacks as meals when we've already paid the equivalent of $200 or so (Amtrak prices) for full sit-down meal service.

Crabby, you must sleep on plywood at home. ;) As much as I will the bedroom bunks to be tolerable when we're riding, the contrast on getting into a real bed at our destinations (either hotel or home) was really apparent this time around. BTW, I'm not that tall, so bed length is not the issue. It's the narrowness that bothers me, even in the lower bunk in a bedroom, which is the largest bed available.
 
I do agree that 2-3 days on the train you'll be eating hearty.

And yeah, I'd be very annoyed by the lack of a burger (btw, for lunch, the veggie burger is delicious!)

As for the bunks, I don't mind them (though 90% of the time it's just me and I get them to put both mattresses on one bunk so it's even better) but I can see that.

I think a bit thicker wouldn't be too bad.
 
We always find the crew very accomdating.... sorry you ran in to a surly LSA but when I was recovering from my nightmare flu, they were really great. They served me only rice with ginger ale.... they even said " You're first class.... you can order whatever you want." We also enjoyed the Parlour Car, which seems to serve a lighter menu....

While my husband prefers the bunks on Via, we both love train travel and the leisurely pace... and naps.... and we definitely don't miss those long car trips although since I would like to go to Monument Valley, we will probably have to rent or borrow a motor home... but I know how much more work it will be - with the worries, the traffic.....the parking....
 
Hey OP what I relate to most in your posts is having to relax AFTER a LD trip. For sure almost always the case for me. Ironic how Amtrak promotes train travel as a relaxing way to go. Not much mention of rocking side to side, noisy halls and neighbors, train whistles, and announcements starting at 6 AM. And this is in a sleeper. (I realize for some, none of the above are a problem.)

Where I part company is on the dining front. Working with Amtrak menus and limited hours of service, I still find there are lots of techniques for customizing and personalizing what is offered. You always have the option of ordering less than what is offered. I have never ordered sausage or meat with my breakfast, although it is invariably offered. For lunch, a salad is always an option. For dinner, one could have a salad as well (admittedly, a small one.) Think about the steak dinner without the steak--you have a vegetarian meal of salad, baked potato and veggies. I've often wondered why Amtrak doesn't offer this as an official option.

The same applies to time of meals. I often ask for breakfast to be delivered to my roomette during "last call for breakfast" and then eat it an hour later when I get up. With dinner, I might have it delivered early and eat it whenever I'm hungry. I found the majority of attendants I've encountered to be good on all these points. And my LD trips are better this way.
 
To the OP---please don't misinterpret my comments as negating or minimizing your issues, but i do have some thoughts.

As to the meal issue, I agree with Manny T; I attempt to customize my meals in the dining car as much as possible. I also try to replicate what I would eat off the train. I avoid white flour and white rice and so don't have any pasta items and forego the dinner rolls and the buns that come with the burgers. I notice that many people make the observation about how stuffed they are after dinner, often after eating one or more rolls, as if they have to partake of whatever is served and how it is served. I usually have the steak, but usually with the rice pilaf, and never a baked potato. In addition to ordering a steakless steak dinner, another option might be to forgo the starch altogether and just have it served with the vegetables. All in all, it sounds like what you're really asking for is a "senior menu" (which would be a rather easy task to accomplish, if mix-and-matched from existing menu items).

When at home, I tend to eat a light breakfast (a protein/nutrition bar & coffee) and then a large dinner plus a snack or two during the day. I also tend to wake up late and have breakfast (and consequently dinner) late. Though I try to make all the dining car meals offered, at times I have missed one simply because I'm already full from the previous one (usually that would be lunch). I've observed quite a few people who say that they either skipped lunch or breakfast because they weren't up and/or hungry. Since I prefer to eat late meals, I usually make last call for lunch and attempt to get the latest dinner reservation possible (usually it works okay, since I tend to board trains in the middle of their runs, save for departing from Chicago). I consider the onboard meal service somewhat of a treat, since there is no way I would eat three meals of that nature at home, or even once I've reached my travel destination, as I'm usually busy doing other things.

As for the sleeping issue, I've found that I really don't sleep well at all on trains---3-4 hours, at most; with a couple of naps during the day if on the same train. But I no longer sleep well on airplanes, either; compared to when I was younger and could fall asleep even before the beverage cart rolled around. However, I also don't sleep as well--or for as long as periods--at home as I once did. I chalk it up to officially having reached middle age. I do agree with those who use the double-mattress system. I've realized that I prefer sleeping on the upper bunk of a roomette, and so will often just use the bottom bunk mattress on top of the upper bunk, as long as I have an SCA who isn't too anal about things. I've also found that this creates an upslope towards the inside of the car, so there is not as much fear about falling off or hanging outside the bunk. This also enables me to take an after-breakfast nap, as I find I'm usually awake even before the time the sun comes up and so I take advantage of the lightly-populated dining car around the time of first service. (For those who are bothered by the train noises including the announcements by apparently frustrated DJs, I have one word of advice: earplugs!)

It seems the best solution to your rail travails (aside from the automotive [SIZE=11pt]alternative[/SIZE]) would be to schedule in a layover of a night (or possibly more) for each overnight on a train. This is one of the frequently mentioned tips in both the rail travel guides, as well as some of the AU traveler tips. I have yet to spend more than two consecutive nights on a train, but am not sure I would want to do that, either. It's kind of a stimulus overload in more ways than one; not unlike spending several days in a Vegas casino.
 
I view train travel as an adventure. One that I enjoy. It's not comparable to a hotel stay.

Similarly, when I fly, I just accept that I'll be packed in like a sardine. ^_^
 
Sleeping in the upper bunk of a Superliner roomette is already cramped. Even if the mattress for the lower bunk is only an inch thick, that is an inch of vertical space that I would hate to give up. In a Viewliner, I have done it.

I guess I'm one of the unlucky ones when it comes to AGR redemptions. With no records to back me up, I would guess that over 15% of the itineraries that I check have a redemption rate requiring more than 34.5 points per dollar. I am remembering to calculate the ratio using the adult fare rather than a discounted fare, and that is not including the minimum points per leg issue that wreaks havoc on journeys that include a bus leg. Combined with the lack of any bonus points for sleeping accommodations (compared to business class), paying for the second passenger, the minimum points per leg, and basing the points on the Adult fare rather than the cash fare for which the passenger is otherwise eligible, I am sure feeling the depreciation of AGR 2.

Train travel, at least for me, is not about collecting points, so AGR 2 is a disappointment but not a reason to stop riding Amtrak. The reduction of menu choices and the standardization of the menu on long distance trains do represent a loss of Amtrak's competitive advantage. Also, the reduction of amenities, such as the removal of Pepsi products from the sleepers, indicate a trend that is not good. I mentioned the Pepsi products because I did drink them. Of less concern to me personally but indicating a declining experience are the (erratic) limitation on water bottles, the reduced availability of coffee and juice, and the removal of pillows (and blankets?) from coach.

Still, I'm not quite ready to abandon Amtrak. But I do recognize the problems that C855B mentioned at the start of the thread, and I expect that my average miles per year will not be what I would have anticipated just a few years ago.
 
I like the bunks myself, but I have also had serious problems with the dining cars; I now can't eat anything but the eggs and the salad, due to lack of documentation of ingredients. Amtrak really needs to get the dining cars straightened out.
 
I noticed on the new menus it no longer says "Lunch / Dinner" - I guess Amtrak gave up offering the lunch items for dinner since the crews were inconsistent about it? That's a real shame, having the burger, Veggie Burger, and Entree Salad available at dinner offered simple and picky eaters a few more choices.

Can anyone here confirm if the burgers are ever offered for dinner anymore?
 
Multiple crews refused to implement the change. I don't think much of the dining car crews as a whole at this point... I've seen some good ones, but I've seen so many terrible ones...
 
I have still had 457 more bad trips on airlines than I have on Amtrak,,,,,,gonna take a while to even out,,, sorry you had a bad experience, life is like a pendulum, yours just swung the wrong way
 
Amtrak needs to be good irrespective of what airlines do. And frankly in the last six months I have not had a single bad experience in First Class in airline, which I get into rather frequently due to status based complementary upgrades, something unheard of at Amtrak. So YMMV as Bob Dylan would say.
 
Multiple crews refused to implement the change. I don't think much of the dining car crews as a whole at this point... I've seen some good ones, but I've seen so many terrible ones...
The underlying problem seems to be Amtrak makes a change for the better (in this case making menu changes that give passengers more options for dinner) and the crews refuse, so Amtrak just changes it back and says "That didn't work." No.... Amtrak announces mystery riders or spot checks by management and if a crew is not serving the menu as instructed the LSA gets in serious trouble. The Amtrak train managers need to be out doing their jobs and insisting on a certain level of consistency. Of course knowing Amtrak that would backfire and the good LSA's would get in trouble for giving someone an extra can of Pepsi or something.

That being said... I've been very happy with most of the dining car crews I've encountered in the last couple of years. The good ones are out there, if you can be lucky enough to avoid the bad ones.
 
This thread reminds me of the old retort to a young GI's complaint - "Go tell the Chaplain and get your TS card punched!" ;)
 
I view train travel as an adventure. One that I enjoy. It's not comparable to a hotel stay.

Similarly, when I fly, I just accept that I'll be packed in like a sardine. ^_^
I'm with you, Crabby. Our train travel is the focal point of any vacation we take.
Same here. OP, you can drive, I'll take your spot on the train!
I'm totally with you guys. Travel is an adventure, and rail travel is a part of that. Oftentimes it's good, sometimes it's mediocre, and occasionally it's bad (though I find, in retrospect, that my attitude is a fair part of the negative experiences). Also, after decades of driving (and having to do so in order to get anywhere locally), I like to limit my road trips to the distance it takes to get to the most convenient Amtrak station!
 
I agree with RSG that attitude plays a big part. Sometimes a cross country or any Amtrak trip is a head game. I have learned over the years to compromise and adjust as need be. I don't travel as much as some but do cross country every summer back to Florida and shorter overnight trips here and there. When I do travel I'm fortunate to get a bedroom each time and traveling single I avoid neighbor noise by being in bedroom A in superliners. It works for me. Noise? I use ear plugs if necessary. I sleep with four pillows and an extra blanket. I stay up at night with curtains open and watch it all go by till I'm tired and manage to usually get decent nights sleep. I find the bed to be just fine. I am a little over 6 feet tall.

I don't usually eat three meals a day on the train. I'm usually up for breakfast 730-800 ish and have a good size one. A snack for lunch and then dinner. Ive done the steak less dinner and a dessert to go. Ive also skipped breakfast and went to café car for something small and had a lunch and dinner. On trains Ive taken that leave 6-7pm like the Cap out of Chicago I bring my dinner on the train, have my bed made when the sca introduces him/herself and I don't have to worry about a late dinner.

So for me its been a series of adjustments over the years. And I enjoy the adventure like others.
 
First issue is that the sleeper bunks are fairly uncomfortable. I hadn't previously processed just how uncomfortable they were until we got back home and I crashed on our sofa - which is also too short and narrow for me to stretch out - but I slept really well given the softer, thicker cushions.
Now we just need to find a way to merge Amtrak with a sofa. Hmm.

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One thing that might help on the meal front is inform the Sleeper car attendant that you want your meal in your room. This may give you a little more control over when (or less, depending on how on top of things they are.)
This is the most relevant and most helpful advice in the thread, at least in my view. I can confirm that using your SCA can improve your dining experience dramatically. SCA's tend to be less regimented and more accommodating than the dining staff. They still have to work within the broader limitations of the chef's options, but at least they try to honor reasonable requests without much trouble. Or at least that's been my experience.

We always find the crew very accomdating.... sorry you ran in to a surly LSA but when I was recovering from my nightmare flu, they were really great. They served me only rice with ginger ale.... they even said " You're first class.... you can order whatever you want." We also enjoyed the Parlour Car, which seems to serve a lighter menu.
That really hasn't been my experience at all. In fact the majority of my disappointment with Amtrak has come from interacting with the dining car crews and especially seeing how they chose to treat new passengers who weren't aware of that specific crew's expectations and idiosyncrasies. Amtrak's dining car crews can be amazingly bossy to customers and yet extremely sloppy at managing their own tasks. That kind of blind hypocrisy really grates on my nerves. I'm generally satisfied with my experience at conventional restaurants but Amtrak dining disappoints me on a regular basis. Even In-N-Out Burger's silly "secret menu" offers more meaningful modifications than anything I've seen on Amtrak. I think it's more honest to say that compared to virtually any other restaurant Amtrak doesn't really support any changes besides trivial "hold the pickle" type alterations.

I don't have any pasta items and forego the dinner rolls and the buns that come with the burgers. I usually have the steak, but with the rice pilaf and never a baked potato. In addition to ordering a steakless steak dinner, another option might be to forgo the starch altogether and just have it served with the vegetables.
I think this thread officially jumped the shark when folks started advocating for a "steakless steak dinner" as some sort of improvement. There are so many tasty meals out there that don't require massive carbs and calorie counts but Amtrak either isn't aware of them or simply doesn't care to explore such options. At least during the "Chef Inspired" phase the meals were tasty and interesting enough to make the empty calorie count less of an issue.

This thread reminds me of the old retort to a young GI's complaint - "Go tell the Chaplain and get your TS card punched!"
If riding an Amtrak sleeper compartment with fares in the hundreds or even thousands of dollars reminds you of being paid to work as a grunt in the armed forces then maybe that says more about Amtrak than it does about the passengers.
 
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Try sleeping on the floor for a few nights before a train trip and that roomette bunk will feel pretty good. As far as feeling stuffed from too much food try cutting back a tad. ☺
 
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