The problem is that the roads were engineered to handle less traffic and fewer bikes and pedestrians than they carry today. In the past year, traffic fatalities in Seattle were higher than they have been in many years--mostly pedestrians and bicyclists, apparently. Unfortunately, when the roads were put in, no sidewalks were installed north of what was then the city limits, so pedestrians have to walk on the narrow shoulders of the road, as do bicyclists. So, the City Council passed an ordinance limiting the top speed on all non-freeway roads to 25 mph. I have to admit, it does seem really slow on four lane streets compared to what I'm accustomed to. It will take some time to get used to, but I suspect in time we'll wonder why we were in such a rush to get from A to B, at the cost of too many lives.
Railroad crossing accidents
- Thread starter MIrailfan
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Highways, bike paths, walkways. Hard to make them synonymous, not to mention throwing in a railroad track.
AFS1970
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My state and city has further complicated things with something called a Hawk Signal. These are put in at crosswalks located in the middle of a long block. They are traditional traffic lights but are tied to the walk buttons for pedestrians. They are dark completely when not in use, when you press the button for the walk light they turn on yellow, then go to solid red when the walk light comes on. So far so good, as red means stop. However after a few seconds the lights go to flashing red, this now means proceed if there are no pedestrians in the crosswalk, but stay stopped if there are pedestrians crossing. This was so confusing that they had to put up signs on the poles to tell motorists what the new rules were.
We have three of these in town now and more are coming. One Assistant Police Chief called it the most confusing system he had seen, because the only other place we have flashing red traffic lights are railroad crossings and school busses and they both mean stop. Here they may or may not mean stop. So while these are not specifically railroad related, I can see them causing confusion at crossings.
We have three of these in town now and more are coming. One Assistant Police Chief called it the most confusing system he had seen, because the only other place we have flashing red traffic lights are railroad crossings and school busses and they both mean stop. Here they may or may not mean stop. So while these are not specifically railroad related, I can see them causing confusion at crossings.
We have the same crosswalks. One can never tell when someone will cross without pushing the button. They cross a street that has a parking median in the center, people get out of their car and just start crossing. You never know which way to look, for the light, the sidewalk, the center of the street. It's a free for all at times so it seems. Oh yeah, a bike path on both sides of the street.
I totally agree about that "Hawk" signal. The first and only one I ever encountered was on Beacon Street near Boston College. I and every other driver had no idea what to do. The alternating flashing red lights mean what exactly? Just a completely stupid idea that never should have reached fruition.
Perhaps the answer can be found somewhere in here? (Good luck!)
https://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/pdfs/2009r1r2/mutcd2009r1r2edition.pdf
Austin is putting these in everywhere( along with Bike Lanes)and lots of our so called Drivers DON'T Stop!
Siegmund
Lead Service Attendant
An IMO better version of these is in widespread use in western Canada. The signal is flashing green, not dark, when not in use. When a pedestrian pushes the button they first turn solid green, then yellow and red for the normal length of time. I don't believe the Canadian version uses flashing red at the end of the cycle -- and having flashing red mean anything other than stop-and-proceed does seem very confusing. (If flashing red still meant stop and proceed, maybe it would save a few seconds for drivers at these.) Flashing green has the merit of not being in widespread use in the US.
I still had to ask what they were, the first time I drove in BC after several years living well away from the border.
They had their own version of confusion because eastern Canada used to use flashing green rather than green arrow for left turn signals.
trainman74
Conductor
Perhaps the answer can be found somewhere in here? (Good luck!)
https://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/pdfs/2009r1r2/mutcd2009r1r2edition.pdf
Here's the section that describes "HAWK" signals (under their official name, Pedestrian Hybrid Beacons): Chapter 4F
A flashing red traffic signal being the equivalent of a stop sign should be basic stuff. I assume people are just confused because instead of one red light flashing on and off, it's two red lights flashing back and forth.
From the California driver's handbook:
I think it would be much better, if they just installed standard traffic signal's, pedestrian activated, at the crosswalk...the 'hawk' is just too unusual to be readily understood...Here's the section that describes "HAWK" signals (under their official name, Pedestrian Hybrid Beacons): Chapter 4F
A flashing red traffic signal being the equivalent of a stop sign should be basic stuff. I assume people are just confused because instead of one red light flashing on and off, it's two red lights flashing back and forth.
From the California driver's handbook:
Devil's Advocate
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If a HAWK beacon is just too complicated to understand then maybe it's time to hang up the car keys. 
Disagree. There is no reason for such a weird signal.
There are still a few. They're called "Advanced Green" and are usually accompanied by an explanatory sign. The main reason they've fallen into disfavor and are gradually being replaced is not actually confusion, but that they've outlived their original purpose - to provide both left turn and forward motion to one direction only. More and more intersections are requiring multiple left turn options and that requires arrows.
Qapla
Engineer
I have found that many drivers only look at the lights - they do not read the "explanatory signs" that explain the signals.
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The whole purpose of lights is to be self explanatory so if they cause confusion instead of eliminating it, they are not very useful. The idea is that the color alone with a built-in arrow to tell you what direction it refers to, is enough for you to make a decision. Witness the use of the flashing yellow arrow. When it came out not too many years ago and became ubiquitous in no time at all, it apparently was obvious to most people because they followed it correctly. A few were confused but not once did I ever see an explanatory sign.
jis
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Florida DOT has invented an innovative HAWK where flashing Green apparently means someone may be walking across the street. It is actuated in a mid block pedestrian crossing when someone pushes the walk request button. If not actuated the signal is dark. Go figure. 
A whole slew of them have recently been installed on A1A on the Barrier Island across Indian River here in Melbourne.
A whole slew of them have recently been installed on A1A on the Barrier Island across Indian River here in Melbourne.
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That doesn't sound very intelligent to me. "According to the California Department of Motor Vehicles, a blinking or flashing yellow light means that drivers should proceed with caution. Unlike a blinking red light, a blinking yellow light does not require drivers to stop, but it does suggest that they slow down and remain particularly alert."Florida DOT has invented an innovative HAWK where flashing Green apparently means someone may be walking across the street. It is actuated in a mid block pedestrian crossing when someone pushes the walk request button. If not actuated the signal is dark. Go figure.
A whole slew of them have recently been installed on A1A on the Barrier Island across Indian River here in Melbourne.
So if a blinking yellow light means you can proceed and "suggests" you slow down, who would consider a blinking green light means you better be prepared to stop for a pedestrian?
But then nobody has suggested that there is intelligent life in Florida.
Devil's Advocate
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For my entire life and in every location I have ever traveled flashing red has meant "stop and proceed when clear."
Alternate flashing red means a train is coming to me, not stop and proceed
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Devil's Advocate
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Today I was watching a video of someone driving in Canada and they passed several flashing green lights without explanation. After doing a bit of digging it sounds like depending on the province it either means you have a protected turn or to be prepared for pedestrian cross traffic. You don't actually stop on flashing green but are supposed to be prepared for the light to change upon activation. Where I live protected travel is solid green while unprotected travel is flashing yellow and prohibited travel is solid red. I guess flashing green is used to keep traffic moving at full speed?
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Protected turn in most cases. Flashing green at an intersection indicates Go to both through traffic and those making a left turn. The signal would be red coming the opposite way. They are being phased out in favor of arrows, since fewer intersections still require left turns in only one direction and drivers aren't as smart as they used to be.
caravanman
Engineer
Gosh, I have enough trouble with driving on the wrong side of the road and lack of roundabouts over there, don't confuse me even more!
Devil's Advocate
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I can switch sides so long as the steering wheel is at the correct orientation to remind me which rules to follow. I've also driven in countries where they seem to shove five lanes of traffic into 1½ lanes of pavement, but the UK's multi-lane highway style roundabouts are genuinely difficult for me. I never grew up with anything like that and find the process rather tedious with several turnoffs passing in rapid succession at high speed. It's probably a more efficient design but I'm just not wired for that sort of layout and really have to think about it when I encounter one.
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