UP and Amtrak

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Oreius

OBS Chief
Joined
Jun 5, 2012
Messages
696
It seems to me UP and Amtrak don’t have good relations. My Coast Starlight train was over 3 hours late getting into LAUS. My SCA explained that just two days prior, #11 was 6 hours late. What do you think?
 
It's no mystery that UP is generally not passenger-rail friendly. They are not known for treating Amtrak well (although I think they've been generally decent in the past few years).
 
Other railroads do the same sometimes.
On the Southwest Chief (mostly BNSF the entire route) at the end of July, we had an on-time departure from LAX and were 1:18 late at Riverside (third stop); 4:36 late into Chicago.
On the Sunset Limited mid-August we departed NOL on time and were 2:14 late at Lake Charles (4th stop) before we even reached UP track! Arrival in LAX after mostly UP track, we were 4:53 late.
It happens!
 
UP is probably no better or no worse than the other big freight systems, although BNSF at least seem to try and NS is just awful on the Cleveland-Chicago line. CP actually has the best record, basically because of the 90percent or better OTP of the Hiawathas.
 
UP is one of the bad ones. BNSF generally is decent, but sh*t happens.

Hey, about 10 years ago, maybe more, UP seldom delivered the Starlight less than 8 hours late. Amtrak had to cut connections from the Starlight to the Builder at PDX because of the way UP was dispatching it.

I remember one time during that period we were already some hours late and the UP put some peddler out ahead of us through the southern Salinas valley. The Coast Line was very lightly trafficked with no through freights and they couldn't have held the peddler for us?
 
joelkfla said:
Seems contradictory that UP has a bad rep for passenger trains, yet they seem to be so interested in preserving their steam history (as in Big Boy).
Click to expand...

Why is it inconsistent? UP uses its steam program to improve its public image and put the railroad in a positive spotlight. How it handles Amtrak is basically an economic decision.
 
While UP is not the easiest railroad for Amtrak to deal with today, they have gotten better from where they were in the late 1990's/early 2000s. For example, the reason the Crescent Star proposal from 2001 never started up is because of the inability to negotiate an agreement with UP to add another train to the Marshall to Ft. Worth, TX route. Of course, this was planned to be a mail and express train, a program that would eventually be dropped by Amtrak due to opposition to the program by ALL freight railroads.
 
zephyr17 said:
UP is one of the bad ones. BNSF generally is decent, but sh*t happens.

Hey, about 10 years ago, maybe more, UP seldom delivered the Starlight less than 8 hours late. Amtrak had to cut connections from the Starlight to the Builder at PDX because of the way UP was dispatching it.

I remember one time during that period we were already some hours late and the UP put some peddler out ahead of us through the southern Salinas valley. The Coast Line was very lightly trafficked with no through freights and they couldn't have held the peddler for us?
Click to expand...

Sorry for not knowing, but what is a 'peddler?'
 
zephyr17 said:
UP is one of the bad ones. BNSF generally is decent, but sh*t happens.

Hey, about 10 years ago, maybe more, UP seldom delivered the Starlight less than 8 hours late. Amtrak had to cut connections from the Starlight to the Builder at PDX because of the way UP was dispatching it.

I remember one time during that period we were already some hours late and the UP put some peddler out ahead of us through the southern Salinas valley. The Coast Line was very lightly trafficked with no through freights and they couldn't have held the peddler for us?
Click to expand...
One long trip we got pitched off and bused to PDX from KFS to connect with the EB as the CS was late. Will say it is a nice bus ride though the Umpqua National Forest.
 
Interestingly, the Coast Line is welded rail. Given that it is a lightly used line, I was surprised. The Starlight traveled over all welded rail.

The line north of San Luis Obispo is spectacular! A couple horseshoe curves and a trestle! I took a video of one of the curves.
 
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zephyr17 said:
They are paying for rail and signal improvements. Doubt they will do anything more.

It hosted a lot more trains in the past and could again, curves and all.
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I don't think it's about the capacity, but about the journey time. I don't know how they would increase service with the current eight hour schedule from San Diego to SLO, they can't really leave SAN earlier than 5:55 AM, which is when 763 leaves (it arrives at 2:30 if on time). and I don't see a point a train arriving past 777, which arrives at 8:30 if on time. Between there they could probably extend (1)767 to SLO and 782 from SLO, but not much more than that.
 
joelkfla said:
Seems contradictory that UP has a bad rep for passenger trains, yet they seem to be so interested in preserving their steam history (as in Big Boy).
Click to expand...
MikefromCrete said:
Why is it inconsistent? UP uses its steam program to improve its public image and put the railroad in a positive spotlight. How it handles Amtrak is basically an economic decision.
Click to expand...
The UP steam program carries many passenger cars with it and their whistle stop press events often talk about how great it was to ride the rails as a passenger. Except that they say nothing about how we can still ride the very same rails today. Maybe they want to avoid talking about how they treat passenger trains like a commodity freight or why basic requests for minor improvements are usually met with demands for big taxpayer handouts. In any case it's jarring to hear them wax poetic about the pleasures of passenger rail only to bite their tongue when it comes to actually using it.
 
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Cal said:
Do you think they'd ever fund the coast line getting straightened? It needs it if they want to increase service.
Click to expand...
I mean, they're trying, but buying property is always a process with lots of NIMBY complaints.

Look at how much trouble there has been trying to build the tunnel in Del Mar, to get the line off the unstable bluffs. Constant delays due to really inappropriate complaints by random local residents and anti-train extremists That tunnel relocation should have been done THIRTY YEARS AGO and has been delayed by one thing after another. They're expecting it to take 20 more years to get past all the NIMBY complaints, anti-train extremists, and bogus objections to paying for the relocation.

https://www.delmartimes.net/news/story/2021-03-20/del-mar-bluff-repairs-to-cost-10-5-million
 

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