Any Upcoming Detours on CZ?

[Amy in TX]

I took a round trip ride last September from San Antonio to Chicago on the TE then Chicago to Emeryville on the CZ and back specifically for the ride through the Colorado Rockies. About an hour out of Chicago, I discovered that we were doing a bypass through Wyoming from Denver to Salt Lake City, due to work on the Moffatt Tunnel, both ways as it turns out. I was devastated! I spent quite a bit of money on the trip. I wasn't taking the train to get to San Francisco, I was going to San Francisco to ride through the Colorado Rockies. If I had known even a few days before I left home, I could have rescheduled it with minimal cancellation costs. Apparently Amtrak knew it was going to happen several weeks ahead but did not put any notice of it on their web site.

Overall I enjoyed the trip but I really still wanted to do the trip through the Rockies so I decided to rebook just part of the trip, to see what I missed. Anyway, I'm scheduled to fly to Denver in a couple of weeks, spend a night there, the take the CZ from there to Davis, CA, spend a night there, then take the CZ back to Denver and fly home.

So my question is, have any of you, especially those who are Amtrak employees heard anything about scheduled track/tunnel work that would result in any detours/disruptions between Denver and Salt Lake City? in the next month? I really don't want to have the same surprise this time!

 

[cpotisch]

I took a round trip ride last September from San Antonio to Chicago on the TE then Chicago to Emeryville on the CZ and back specifically for the ride through the Colorado Rockies. About an hour out of Chicago, I discovered that we were doing a bypass through Wyoming from Denver to Salt Lake City, due to work on the Moffatt Tunnel, both ways as it turns out. I was devastated! I spent quite a bit of money on the trip. I wasn't taking the train to get to San Francisco, I was going to San Francisco to ride through the Colorado Rockies. If I had known even a few days before I left home, I could have rescheduled it with minimal cancellation costs. Apparently Amtrak knew it was going to happen several weeks ahead but did not put any notice of it on their web site.

Overall I enjoyed the trip but I really still wanted to do the trip through the Rockies so I decided to rebook just part of the trip, to see what I missed. Anyway, I'm scheduled to fly to Denver in a couple of weeks, spend a night there, the take the CZ from there to Davis, CA, spend a night there, then take the CZ back to Denver and fly home.

So my question is, have any of you, especially those who are Amtrak employees heard anything about scheduled track/tunnel work that would result in any detours/disruptions between Denver and Salt Lake City? in the next month? I really don't want to have the same surprise this time!

While I can't offer any firsthand knowledge on this, I would recommend calling Amtrak a few times between now and your trip. An agent should be able to tell you about any planned detours.

 

[Lonestar648]

Keep an eye on the Service Alerts Amtrak posts on its web site. Some detours are know well in advance but others are not.

 

[Amy in TX]

Keep an eye on the Service Alerts Amtrak posts on its web site. Some detours are know well in advance but others are not.

I've been doing that but last fall, there was nothing on the Amtrak website about the bypass until several days after it started. Apparently, I wasn't the only one angry about not getting any notice. Well, I know many of the passengers on my train were very unhappy, especially after it became clear the service crew knew about it a month in advance.

 

[Lonestar648]

Unfortunately, Amtrak is not very good about informing customers in advance. Though the staff may have known, it may have been a possibility, so until confirmed dates were received from the host, they did not post anything. On AU, occasionally, the rumor is reported, though everyone cautions against rumor verses actual facts. There are also the unexpected detours from rail accidents. Some people here want to know ahead if the CZ is doing a detour because they want the ride experience through Wyoming.

 

[Thirdrail7]

So far, so good. However, that doesn't mean much. I remember that detour/schedule change and not a lot of notice was given. I believe it was around two weeks.

Unfortunately, Amtrak is not very good about informing customers in advance.

The problem is telling and it shows that there isn't an awareness as to why people are on the train (other than apparently taking a tax subsidized vacation...classic.)

That plan required the Zephyr to operate on different schedules on certain days and detour on other days. Assuming you were on one of the detoured trains (which had the same departure/arrival times since I believe the detour is quicker), customer service would reach out but ten would get you a twenty that they only reached out to passengers impacted by the detour...which would be the passengers with missed stops. An end to end passenger would not be notified since in their minds, nothing about the ride has changed, except the scenery....and who is riding for that, right?

This is an example of failing to understand your product....and it is getting worse.

 

[KmH]

IIRC there was discussion here on AU regarding the dates of that detour before it started.

Unfortunately the forum search feature seems to have limited functionality.

 

[Thirdrail7]

Zephyr (5&6) Schedule Changes Sept/Oct 2017

The thread beat the posting on the website...and it still only came out just a week prior to the changes.

 

[Amy in TX]

So far, so good. However, that doesn't mean much. I remember that detour/schedule change and not a lot of notice was given. I believe it was around two weeks.

Unfortunately, Amtrak is not very good about informing customers in advance.

The problem is telling and it shows that there isn't an awareness as to why people are on the train (other than apparently taking a tax subsidized vacation...classic.)

That plan required the Zephyr to operate on different schedules on certain days and detour on other days. Assuming you were on one of the detoured trains (which had the same departure/arrival times since I believe the detour is quicker), customer service would reach out but ten would get you a twenty that they only reached out to passengers impacted by the detour...which would be the passengers with missed stops. An end to end passenger would not be notified since in their minds, nothing about the ride has changed, except the scenery....and who is riding for that, right?

This is an example of failing to understand your product....and it is getting worse.

Two weeks notice would have been great. And yes, I rode both ways on the days it ran on schedule but did the detour through Wyoming. It was nice in spots, but mostly high plains desert, which isn't what I was hoping for. At least I have experienced more rare mileage. I've been on Texas Eagle re-routes several times both in Illinois and Texas, including an impromptu one through Western Illinois northbound after severe storms left the tracks in Missouri blocked between Poplar Bluff & St. Louis.

I'm trying now to check daily on Amtrak.com, here and what little I'm allowed to read on Train Orders.

Thanks, everybody, for all your input! I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

 

[railiner]

So far, so good. However, that doesn't mean much. I remember that detour/schedule change and not a lot of notice was given. I believe it was around two weeks.

Unfortunately, Amtrak is not very good about informing customers in advance.

The problem is telling and it shows that there isn't an awareness as to why people are on the train (other than apparently taking a tax subsidized vacation...classic.)

That plan required the Zephyr to operate on different schedules on certain days and detour on other days. Assuming you were on one of the detoured trains (which had the same departure/arrival times since I believe the detour is quicker), customer service would reach out but ten would get you a twenty that they only reached out to passengers impacted by the detour...which would be the passengers with missed stops. An end to end passenger would not be notified since in their minds, nothing about the ride has changed, except the scenery....and who is riding for that, right?

This is an example of failing to understand your product....and it is getting worse.

Zephyr (5&6) Schedule Changes Sept/Oct 2017

The thread beat the posting on the website...and it still only came out just a week prior to the changes.

The same thing happened on my trip on the Coast Starlight (yesterday)....

I first was alerted about the detour over Tehachapi thanks to the AU thread on 13 April. I looked for an alert on Amtrak's site, but saw no mention. The only indication was that you could book it on the affected dates if you were not destined to one of the bypassed stations, but even that is no guarantee, since sometimes "short" segments are blocked by yield management.

It was only a day or so before the detour that Amtrak notified thru passengers of the detour.

Of course in my case, I specifically booked and rode it to get the rare mileage, but when I checked in at the station to receive my seat assignment, I overheard a couple that were very disappointed that they would not see the coast scenery. They too, had come a long way just for that intended scenery.

I ran into several local railfans on board, that did not hear of the detour until a day or two before...they were amazed that I heard about it so early. Of course, I advised them to become regular members of AU....

 

[oregon pioneer]

... ten would get you a twenty that they only reached out to passengers impacted by the detour...which would be the passengers with missed stops. An end to end passenger would not be notified since in their minds, nothing about the ride has changed, except the scenery....and who is riding for that, right?

So this brings up the question: If you REALLY want to ride a certain segment, would it be worth planning an overnight right in the middle of that segment, for example in Glenwood Springs, in order to ensure you'll be notified in case of a service change? Just wondering...

 

[spinnaker]

... ten would get you a twenty that they only reached out to passengers impacted by the detour...which would be the passengers with missed stops. An end to end passenger would not be notified since in their minds, nothing about the ride has changed, except the scenery....and who is riding for that, right?

So this brings up the question: If you REALLY want to ride a certain segment, would it be worth planning an overnight right in the middle of that segment, for example in Glenwood Springs, in order to ensure you'll be notified in case of a service change? Just wondering...

Depending on the station, you might be leaving or arriving at some ungodly hour.

I wonder if you could just do the trip as a multiple segment trip? Could you book to arrive and then depart on the same train same station?

 

[chakk]

Yes, you can. But the fare is probably higher than for the “thru” jouney

 

[railiner]

... ten would get you a twenty that they only reached out to passengers impacted by the detour...which would be the passengers with missed stops. An end to end passenger would not be notified since in their minds, nothing about the ride has changed, except the scenery....and who is riding for that, right?

So this brings up the question: If you REALLY want to ride a certain segment, would it be worth planning an overnight right in the middle of that segment, for example in Glenwood Springs, in order to ensure you'll be notified in case of a service change? Just wondering...

But even then...who knows when they would notify you that you (might be) "bustituted" from Denver to Glenwood Springs? And/or from GSC to Salt Lake City?

 

[GregL]

I hope no detours are in line for CZ, we will be on it May8

 

[GBNorman]

If you REALLY want to ride a certain segment, would it be worth planning an overnight right in the middle of that segment, for example in Glenwood Springs, in order to ensure you'll be notified in case of a service change?

The same can be accomplished with a periodic query of the Website. If on the desired day of travel of, say, Chicago to Glenwood Springs shows a change at Denver to a bus that has been numbered 3005, then that is a strong suggestion there will be a "Bustetoot" that day.

Even if I have not ridden the Overland Route since 1969 (but have driven along it on I-80 several times since), I can only describe the experience as "awesome".

 

[Lonestar648]

You could can just try making reservations to some intermediate stops every few days. If the system suddenly stops allowing the normal reservation, you know there could be a problem.

 

[Amy in TX]

If you REALLY want to ride a certain segment, would it be worth planning an overnight right in the middle of that segment, for example in Glenwood Springs, in order to ensure you'll be notified in case of a service change?

The same can be accomplished with a periodic query of the Website. If on the desired day of travel of, say, Chicago to Glenwood Springs shows a change at Denver to a bus that has been numbered 3005, then that is a strong suggestion there will be a "Bustetoot" that day.

Even if I have not ridden the Overland Route since 1969 (but have driven along it on I-80 several times since), I can only describe the experience as "awesome".

You could can just try making reservations to some intermediate stops every few days. If the system suddenly stops allowing the normal reservation, you know there could be a problem.

That's a great idea. I will do that daily until I leave.

 

[KmH]

As I mentioned in last years detour thread, if I could shuffle my schedule I would be really pleased to be on the CZ for the detour.

 

[oregon pioneer]

Some excellent suggestions! I like the idea to just check on the availability of booking to an intermediate stop, while there is still time to change or cancel your reservation.

And yes, some of us (who have already seen the CZ scenery several times) would welcome the "rare mileage" of the WY detour. Different strokes for different folks.

 

[spinnaker]

As I mentioned in last years detour thread, if I could shuffle my schedule I would be really pleased to be on the CZ for the detour.

You might actually get a good deal as people will likely be avoiding the train if they know there is a detour.

 

[Thirdrail7]

If you REALLY want to ride a certain segment, would it be worth planning an overnight right in the middle of that segment, for example in Glenwood Springs, in order to ensure you'll be notified in case of a service change?

The same can be accomplished with a periodic query of the Website. If on the desired day of travel of, say, Chicago to Glenwood Springs shows a change at Denver to a bus that has been numbered 3005, then that is a strong suggestion there will be a "Bustetoot" that day.

Even if I have not ridden the Overland Route since 1969 (but have driven along it on I-80 several times since), I can only describe the experience as "awesome".

You could can just try making reservations to some intermediate stops every few days. If the system suddenly stops allowing the normal reservation, you know there could be a problem.

That's a great idea. I will do that daily until I leave.

While this has some merit, it will only work under limited conditions. First, you have to assume that Amtrak will indeed blank the space (they may not), show the actual substitution on the website (they may not especially if it is a last minute plan) and/or the intermediate space isn't reserved out. like in the CONO bedrooms sold out for 3/23/2019! thread. It is almost 11 months out and large portions of that train are already reserved between intermediate points. If the train is already reserved out, checking won't accomplish much.

A host announced a project several weeks ago which required a detour, literally three days before the scheduled departure. A couple of stops were going to require bustitution, but it the stops were not zeroed out nor did the substitution appear on the website since it was a one day affair.

 

[WindyCityTexan]

The WY detour was discussed weeks in advance in several Amtrak groups on another social media platform. I booked my CZ trip in late September, return in early October specifically for the reroute. I got the regular albeit delayed route to EMY, and the WY reroute back to CHI.

While everyone knew about the delayed/altered schedule on #5, many didn't know about the reroute on #6. Many grumpy passengers on that train, and rightly so.

 

[Lonestar648]

Technically, Amtrak is a transportation company, transporting people between point A and B irregardless of the territory the train normally passes, so if they are getting you to your destination they are fulfilling they contract. Now, Amtrak know that trains like the CZ draw a large number of passengers due to the scenery, reason on a couple detours they marketed the opportunity to experience seldom traveled territory. Last minute reroutes are difficult to manage logistically let alone handling the people traveling for the scenery. Just like massive delays due to a derail, you may not see what was expected. A known, several day, week detour can and usually is posted. I see this frequently on the TE either in Illinois or in Texas.