CZ and SWC sleepers removed (downgraded to coach)

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No, we had 4 people booked in 2 bedrooms. My in-laws arriving from the UK will stay in the bedroom and hubby and I will be riding coach. Cancellation was an option, but the trip was for the folks benefit, so since they still have a bedroom, we'll press on as planned.
Do board with as much documentation as possible... check in with the station staff, and do connect with the conductor as soon as you board... with docs in hand. Most importantly be flexible and know if anything doesn't line up as it should... but if you have been promised meals u should be ok. If not ok when you board... purchase from cafe and save receipts.

1 you will again call upon getting off the train
2 be prepared to purchase your own meals with receipts to show customer relations.
3 customer relations does understand that there is a disconnect ... which will add to your compensation at arrival

It is my personal experience that all of this does become rectified until after the trip is concluded... so don't let intermittent snafu's interfere with as much enjoyment as you can get from the trip.

Just enjoy your trip and focus on the trip itself for the joy of rail travel
 
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Do board with as much documentation as possible... check in with the station staff, and do connect with the conductor as soon as you board... with docs in hand. Most importantly be flexible and know if anything doesn't line up as it should... but if you have been promised meals u should be ok. If not ok when you board... purchase from cafe and save receipts.

1 you will again call upon getting off the train
2 be prepared to purchase your own meals with receipts to show customer relations.
3 customer relations does understand that there is a disconnect ... which will add to your compensation at arrival

It is my personal experience that all of this does become rectified until after the trip is concluded... so don't let intermittent snafu's interfere with as much enjoyment as you can get from the trip.

Just enjoy your trip and focus on the trip itself for the joy of rail travel
Great guidance, thank you! I plan to enjoy the trip no matter what. I'm glad I found this site because I had no idea about the compensation options. I'll be sure to speak to customer relations after arriving in EMY.
 

pennyk

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Great guidance, thank you! I plan to enjoy the trip no matter what. I'm glad I found this site because I had no idea about the compensation options. I'll be sure to speak to customer relations after arriving in EMY.
Please note that Customer Relations does not always provide compensation in addition to refunding your fare for a downgraded reservation. I would not count on additional compensation.
 

amtrakp42

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I am no pro but the 640 car sounds like a transdorm sleeper where crew and passengers share the top level and bottom is generally reserved for crew (noted by the use of "40" in the car #). The 330 on the SWC is the base consist sleeper car, most likely won't see that disappear unless they sub in a transdorm sleeper and boot bedroom folks. Most likely won't happen but seems to have been observed recently in this thread.
They probably wouldn't sub a dorm car if one already on as it would have to be the rear car as the front door has stops that goes to the single level baggage car?
 

zephyr17

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They probably wouldn't sub a dorm car if one already on as it would have to be the rear car as the front door has stops that goes to the single level baggage car?
My thinking was they dropped to a single sleeper, a transdorm, but run it as the 30 car line rather than the 40 car line usual for transdorm, perhaps only on a single consist. I am well aware of the physical attributes of transdorms.

It is a stretch, but I am reaching for an explanation of why bedroom passengers would be booted but not roomette passengers. There are not a lot of plausible ones, but that is one.
 

zephyr17

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The lack of transdorm in the fleet would put a dent in your theory.
They used one as a baggage car on the Portland Builder in the spring, lack of serviceable transdorms notwithstanding,so anything is possible.

There are very, very few plausible explanations for booting out bedroom passengers due to "the sleeper was cut" and leaving the roomette passengers. Cutting the standard sleeper and running the transdorm (which the SW Chief already has) under the 30 car line is one if the few that at least partly fits the facts as presented. The fact that doesn't fit is the roomette pax on that car didn't get their rooms reassigned.
 

pennyk

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I was told by the agent that my sleeper was removed and the only space on the train is in coach. Yes, I will miss the Gathering.

Edit to add that I looked at the website for that date 10/4 and sleepers are sold out and coach is 80% full.
After numerous phone calls, I think I found out what really happened in my downgrade from bedroom to coach on car 330. I called AGR again this morning, hoping to make a new reservation (to NYC for a couple of days). After my reservation was made, I explained to her what happened with my downgrade. The first note the agent read on the reservation was that Amtrak phoned and left a voice mail. That was not true. The agent then spoke to her supervisor and then her supervisor spoke to someone else.

It appears that a car, other than 330, was removed and the bedroom passengers in that car were moved to the 330 car based on when their reservation was made. I got dumped, and my reservation was made 11 months in advance - so that did not seem correct. The only thing I can think of is that my reservation had been modified not too long ago when Amtrak changed the start date for the Meteor to 10/3 (instead of September as originally planned). My reservation included travel on the Meteor on 10/2, which was not running, so that part of the reservation was canceled and I had to modify the reservation to travel on the Star on 10/1 (a day earlier because the Star does not connect with the LSL same day) causing me to spend a night in NYC at my expense. The only thing I could think of was that the modification changed the reservation date in the system and instead of having the first reservation (car 330 room E), I was considered to have a much later reservation.

At least I think I know what happend. I am disappointed that it happened and pretty ticked that 2 agents either lied to me or provided me inaccurate information (including a customer relations agent who was condescending and rude. She even assured me that my friends in roomettes in car 330 would be downgraded).
 

zephyr17

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On Track On Line - Amtrak Passenger Equipment Roster - Rolling Stock says there are 40 TransDorms available. Seems like a lot. Are all of those assigned to trainsets?
OTOL says 40 are active. It really only tracks wrecked and retired cars, not cars unservicable due to lack of inspection and maintenance since COVID. Many cars of all types that are "active" are not servicable due to neglect. Transdorms are not exempt. I doubt anywhere near 40 of those "active" cars are actually available.
 
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zephyr17

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After numerous phone calls, I think I found out what really happened in my downgrade from bedroom to coach on car 330. I called AGR again this morning, hoping to make a new reservation (to NYC for a couple of days). After my resesrvation was made, I explained to her what happened with my downgrade. The first note the agent read on the reservation was that Amtrak phoned and left a voice mail. That was not true. The agent then spoke to her supervisor and then her supervisor spoke to someone else.

It appears that a car, other than 330, was removed and the bedroom passengers in that car were moved to the 330 car based on when their reservation was made. I got dumped, and my reservation was made 11 months in advance - so that did not seem correct. The only thing I can think of is that my reservation had been modified not too long ago when Amtrak changed the start date for the Meteor to 10/3 (instead of September as originally planned). My reservation included travel on the Meteor on 10/2, which was not running, so that part of the reservation was canceled and I had to modify the reservation to travel on the Star on 10/1 (a day earlier because the Star does not connect with the LSL same day) causing me to spend a night in NYC at my expense. The only thing I could think of was that the modification changed the reservation date in the system and instead of having the first reservation (car 330 room E), I was considered to have a much later reservation.

At least I think I know what happend. I am disappointed that it happened and pretty ticked that 2 agents either lied to me or provided me inaccurate information (including a customer relations agent who was condescending and rude. She even assured me that my friends in roomettes in car 330 would be downgraded).
Hmm, that means they changed their methodology of just hitting those in the cut car.

Sorry that happened to you.
 

joelkfla

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After numerous phone calls, I think I found out what really happened in my downgrade from bedroom to coach on car 330. I called AGR again this morning, hoping to make a new reservation (to NYC for a couple of days). After my resesrvation was made, I explained to her what happened with my downgrade. The first note the agent read on the reservation was that Amtrak phoned and left a voice mail. That was not true. The agent then spoke to her supervisor and then her supervisor spoke to someone else.

It appears that a car, other than 330, was removed and the bedroom passengers in that car were moved to the 330 car based on when their reservation was made. I got dumped, and my reservation was made 11 months in advance - so that did not seem correct. The only thing I can think of is that my reservation had been modified not too long ago when Amtrak changed the start date for the Meteor to 10/3 (instead of September as originally planned). My reservation included travel on the Meteor on 10/2, which was not running, so that part of the reservation was canceled and I had to modify the reservation to travel on the Star on 10/1 (a day earlier because the Star does not connect with the LSL same day) causing me to spend a night in NYC at my expense. The only thing I could think of was that the modification changed the reservation date in the system and instead of having the first reservation (car 330 room E), I was considered to have a much later reservation.

At least I think I know what happend. I am disappointed that it happened and pretty ticked that 2 agents either lied to me or provided me inaccurate information (including a customer relations agent who was condescending and rude. She even assured me that my friends in roomettes in car 330 would be downgraded).
They might still be lying. Maybe the passenger who bumped you wasn't just someone who booked earlier, but rather someone with a lot of pull -- like a congressman, or a big donor to a congressman.

Seems very strange that all other reports have been that people in the dropped cars were downgraded, not those with the most recent bookings.
 

coalman

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Downgrading your highly anticipated trip reservation from sleeper to coach is way worse than no flex meals being boarded. You have my sympathy.
We are charged a fee for changes/cancelation of our reservations. Amtrak should pay us a change/downgrade fee in points for changes they make. It would help soothe the inconvenience/disruption of plans.
 

Bob Dylan

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After numerous phone calls, I think I found out what really happened in my downgrade from bedroom to coach on car 330. I called AGR again this morning, hoping to make a new reservation (to NYC for a couple of days). After my reservation was made, I explained to her what happened with my downgrade. The first note the agent read on the reservation was that Amtrak phoned and left a voice mail. That was not true. The agent then spoke to her supervisor and then her supervisor spoke to someone else.

It appears that a car, other than 330, was removed and the bedroom passengers in that car were moved to the 330 car based on when their reservation was made. I got dumped, and my reservation was made 11 months in advance - so that did not seem correct. The only thing I can think of is that my reservation had been modified not too long ago when Amtrak changed the start date for the Meteor to 10/3 (instead of September as originally planned). My reservation included travel on the Meteor on 10/2, which was not running, so that part of the reservation was canceled and I had to modify the reservation to travel on the Star on 10/1 (a day earlier because the Star does not connect with the LSL same day) causing me to spend a night in NYC at my expense. The only thing I could think of was that the modification changed the reservation date in the system and instead of having the first reservation (car 330 room E), I was considered to have a much later reservation.

At least I think I know what happend. I am disappointed that it happened and pretty ticked that 2 agents either lied to me or provided me inaccurate information (including a customer relations agent who was condescending and rude. She even assured me that my friends in roomettes in car 330 would be downgraded).
More proof that Amtraks Management is dysfunctional in ALL Areas of the Company.

Lying to Customers seems to have become SOP @ lots of Companies, so Sad it's reached Amtrak!🤥🥺

Someone has to make decisions like this, even if a Computer did the dirty deed!🤬

Have you decided yet if you're going to make the Get-a-Way trip to NYC!( as you know, October is a Great time to be in the Apple!🥰)

Well miss you @ the Gathering IF we too don't get Bumped!🤪🤔
 

jsp

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My thinking was they dropped to a single sleeper, a transdorm, but run it as the 30 car line rather than the 40 car line usual for transdorm, perhaps only on a single consist. I am well aware of the physical attributes of transdorms.

It is a stretch, but I am reaching for an explanation of why bedroom passengers would be booted but not roomette passengers. There are not a lot of plausible ones, but that is one.
Looks like bedrooms are available on the 5th from Flagstaff to LA, so one explanation might be that there are group/Amtrak vacation Grand Canyon bookings that got bump priority
 

jebr

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They might still be lying. Maybe the passenger who bumped you wasn't just someone who booked earlier, but rather someone with a lot of pull -- like a congressman, or a big donor to a congressman.

Seems very strange that all other reports have been that people in the dropped cars were downgraded, not those with the most recent bookings.

Or Amtrak has changed their process for the latest round of cuts, possibly even based on (gasp!) customer feedback. Complaints are always going to skew towards those most negatively affected, so if Amtrak was getting a lot of complaints from people who booked many months out, they may have modified their process to try and minimize impact to those customers. If so, they seem to have not done it well enough, but that seems far more plausible than a conspiracy theory that a Congressional member has enough pull to kick someone out of an Amtrak bedroom, that they want to ride Amtrak enough to do so, and that Amtrak was willing to go along with it and kicked out someone who booked quite far in advance.

As for the other agents lying, it could be partly that the agents haven't learned of the new process yet, or that they just didn't care and wanted to get to the next call as quickly as possible and so made something up that sounded plausible. Especially with Amtrak management being how it is, it wouldn't surprise me if Amtrak just never has told agents about how exactly they determine whose rooms get cut, or that they told them how it used to work but never updated them.

I truly believe that most of Amtrak's problems come from a mix of decades of underinvestment, and often relative incompetence from many higher-ups in how to run a passenger railroad, which permeates into lower-level management and ultimately into the policies that front-line workers get and have to abide by. Incompetence is far more common than malice, and when the systems aren't in place (due to underinvestment) to counteract some of the incompetence it's easy for things to go haywire fast.
 

Bob Dylan

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Good points Jeb! And like all Government Operations, once the Culture reaches a Comfortable Level for the Execs and the Office Pogs, the Front Line Workers,who have to deal with the Public, become the Scape Goats for the Incompetence of Management!

Most of us who were career Government hands learned early in our careers to do what you could to help people, but also realized that changing things for the better was mostly tilting @ Wind Mills.

I can't see anything changing @ Amtrak until there is a total housecleaning of the Board and Top Management,, and that they are replaced by Expiierinced Executives with actual Railroad Operations experience, not Political Hacks,Airline Types and MBAs!
 

joelkfla

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Or Amtrak has changed their process for the latest round of cuts, possibly even based on (gasp!) customer feedback. Complaints are always going to skew towards those most negatively affected, so if Amtrak was getting a lot of complaints from people who booked many months out, they may have modified their process to try and minimize impact to those customers. If so, they seem to have not done it well enough, but that seems far more plausible than a conspiracy theory that a Congressional member has enough pull to kick someone out of an Amtrak bedroom, that they want to ride Amtrak enough to do so, and that Amtrak was willing to go along with it and kicked out someone who booked quite far in advance.

As for the other agents lying, it could be partly that the agents haven't learned of the new process yet, or that they just didn't care and wanted to get to the next call as quickly as possible and so made something up that sounded plausible. Especially with Amtrak management being how it is, it wouldn't surprise me if Amtrak just never has told agents about how exactly they determine whose rooms get cut, or that they told them how it used to work but never updated them.

I truly believe that most of Amtrak's problems come from a mix of decades of underinvestment, and often relative incompetence from many higher-ups in how to run a passenger railroad, which permeates into lower-level management and ultimately into the policies that front-line workers get and have to abide by. Incompetence is far more common than malice, and when the systems aren't in place (due to underinvestment) to counteract some of the incompetence it's easy for things to go haywire fast.
I would agree that the first story may have been made up to close the call quickly, or just an assumption based on what has been happening.

But I'll wait until we see more reports of people being bumped from the lowest numbered sleepers before believing that it's a change of procedure. I've worked in customer service in a large corporation in a service industry, and there were a couple of senior agents assigned to "congressional cases", where a customer got their congressperson's office to intervene on their behalf. This was back in the days of paper files, and those cases had a special red folder to identify them. It's essentially part of lobbying -- keeping congresspeople happy in case you need their support on something.
 

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Maybe the passenger who bumped you wasn't just someone who booked earlier, but rather someone with a lot of pull -- like a congressman, or a big donor to a congressman. Seems very strange that all other reports have been that people in the dropped cars were downgraded, not those with the most recent bookings.
This makes no sense to me. If someone with that much power wants to travel on Amtrak they can charter their own car or train. No need to bump anyone.
 
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