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crescent2

Conductor
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Sep 15, 2012
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a little south of normal
Which months (if any) in the first part of 2016 are normally pretty unlikely to experience a detour or major delay on the wb CZ west of Denver (also possibly the sb CS)?

From another thread, Oct., Nov., and perhaps Sept. seem to be the safest months re detours on the CZ, but my friend(s?) and I cannot travel that soon this year, and Oct. 2016 is a long way off. We're now considering a winter 2016 trip, if unpleasant surprises are not likely. We're thinking all the snow in the Rockies would really be beautiful. (But not if we bypass the Rockies!)

It's my understanding that spring often has rock slides, summer has track work, and winter weather can cause problems. What about maybe March? Is April too near rock slide time? The scenery is our purpose for the trip, so we want to choose a time unlikely to experience major problems. I know there are no guarantees, but we'd like the odds on our side as this will probably be our only train trip out west. (You can guess why.) Any other pros and cons re month of travel or other avoidable factors?

We are aware that the coastal scenery is iffy re daylight on the sb CS, and we might just omit that segment in favor of spending an extra night in SF. Thoughts on that?

We could wait until Oct. 2016 if that's advisable, but would rather travel sooner if the odds are almost as good. We're a little concerned that something might necessitate a change of dates booking that far out, which would not be good.

I've recently made two new converts to Amtrak, and now some wishlist trips are out the window for us :( , but that's getting OT. We want to make this one work well if we can. Thanks much for any advice you can offer!
 
When I started planning my recent trip on the CZ, I spent a good deal of time trying to figure out the best months to travel (with regard to both possible delays along the route and what it would be like at my ultimate destination, San Francisco).

What I learned about the CZ route was basically what you've outlined above. Basically, the consensus seemed to be that March through May is when you're most likely to get blocked track delays as the winter weather transitions to spring and all the snow starts melting. A lot of it depends on the elevation, of course...you might still have just snow in one place, but get a bit lower and the water is running (and eroding). Early March *might* be feasible, but then of course you're looking at higher odds of delays due to winter weather.

I ended up choosing early- to mid-August because it was well past all of that and was a time that most of the major track work would probably be done. This year, UP had a lot going on in late May and early June, so much so that the CZ was rerouted from Denver to Salt Lake City via Wyoming. I also liked still having longer daylight hours. The biggest downside, though, was that it was peak travel time and the train was absolutely packed both ways, so I had to be sure I booked early. My second choice would've been September or maybe early October because of the lower likelihood of delays due to blocked tracks, track work, etc.

I hope that is at least somewhat helpful. Whenever you and your friends end up choosing to go, I'm sure you'll enjoy it. It is a great trip, and the scenery is fantastic. (And if for some reason you didn't beat the odds and got rerouted, say, via Wyoming, I've seen a few people say that is still a nice ride even if it's not as picturesque as the Colorado mountains and canyons.)

Good luck!
 
From mid-feb to mid-march usually has the most snow in Colorado. January has less likelihood of snow delays but greater chance for bitter cold and broken rails. April can miss the heavy snow, and if spring is cool the rock slides might not yet have started up
 
I ended up choosing early- to mid-August because it was well past all of that and was a time that most of the major track work would probably be done. This year, UP had a lot going on in late May and early June, so much so that the CZ was rerouted from Denver to Salt Lake City via Wyoming. I also liked still having longer daylight hours. The biggest downside, though, was that it was peak travel time and the train was absolutely packed both ways, so I had to be sure I booked early.
How early did you need to book a summer trip on the CZ? I'm somewhat used to the EB's crowds & have often tracked how fast it sells out, but I'm not very familiar with the CZ. I know that sooner is always better, but I'm trying to balance that with some fluidity in our plans.

It seems like most of the Wyoming reroutes have happened in May and June, at least from what I've been able to find from the last few years. What are the odds of a reroute in early July?
 
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I ended up choosing early- to mid-August because it was well past all of that and was a time that most of the major track work would probably be done. This year, UP had a lot going on in late May and early June, so much so that the CZ was rerouted from Denver to Salt Lake City via Wyoming. I also liked still having longer daylight hours. The biggest downside, though, was that it was peak travel time and the train was absolutely packed both ways, so I had to be sure I booked early.
How early did you need to book a summer trip on the CZ? I'm somewhat used to the EB's crowds & have often tracked how fast it sells out, but I'm not very familiar with the CZ. I know that sooner is always better, but I'm trying to balance that with some fluidity in our plans.

It seems like most of the Wyoming reroutes have happened in May and June, at least from what I've been able to find from the last few years. What are the odds of a reroute in early July?
After watching the prices bounce around for a while, I finally booked in mid-February (about 5-6 months) when I was able to get what seemed like good prices on the sleeper in both directions. Just out of curiosity I did check after that, and they still had tickets and rooms available even as we got a lot closer to the departure date (just more expensive).

Not sure on the odds of a July reroute. I figured that with all the work in May and June, there was an outside chance they'd need to do it again in July if they didn't wrap everything up, which was also a factor that pushed me to an August trip. I'll let someone else more knowledgeable speak to the odds of that, though.
 
This topic has made me a little nervous. I'm planning one way CZ DEN>SLC, SLC>SFW and CS OKJ>LAX in mid-July. I was unaware that delays or diversions may be common. My dates (16-22 July) are fairly inflexible.

If diversions occur what is the normal arrangement? Do they arrange alternative transport or accommodations?

I was waitng for possible discounts to appear before booking. Is there a danger of those legs booking out early? I have also noticed quite significant price differences for roomettes SLC>SFW on 19th ($260.00) and 20th ($302.00) July. Is that normal?

TIA
 
Further to my question on prices. I discovered amsnag on another topic. It shows much cheaper prices for both days:

Tue 07/19/16 Details 5 California Zephyr $97.00 $162.00 $514.00 $349.00 NA

Wed 07/20/16 Details 5 California Zephyr $97.00 $204.00 $514.00 $444.00 NA

The roomette prices of $162.00 and $204.00 compare with 19th July ($260.00) and 20th ($302.00) July on the AMTRAK site. Is there a way to book via amsnag to obtain those prices?
 
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Further to my question on prices. I discovered amsnag on another topic. It shows much cheaper prices for both days:

Tue 07/19/16 Details 5 California Zephyr $97.00 $162.00 $514.00 $349.00 NA

Wed 07/20/16 Details 5 California Zephyr $97.00 $204.00 $514.00 $444.00 NA

The roomette prices of $162.00 and $204.00 compare with 19th July ($260.00) and 20th ($302.00) July on the AMTRAK site. Is there a way to book via amsnag to obtain those prices?
Amsnag just scrapes Amtrak's website. What you are seeing is the ACCOMODATION CHARGE ONLY for the roomette column, not inclusive of the rail fare. When Amtrak redesigned their website, they are showing the top-line fare on the regular point-to-point screen, although I think using multi-city, Amtrak still shows roomette separately. So if you add the rail fare, first column, and the roomette accomodation charge, the second column, you get pretty much what you got on Amtrak's site, one dollar off. You can't always take the rail fare quoted on Amsnag as the base, though, since it is showing the coach fare being offered at the time, and a sleeper automatically drops the rail portion of the fare to the lowest bucket, regardless of what bucket an actual coach seat is in.

Since you didn't specify your endpoints, I was unable to recreate with a dummy booking on Amtrak.com, the prices were obviously too low for CHI-EMY on the westbound CZ

Saw your earlier post and assumed the roomette was SLC-SFW. I got the same numbers, except the coach fare was $98, which explains the $1 discrepency.

If you would click through on a test reservation for 7/19 you would have gotten to:

  • 1 Adult$98.00
  • 1 Superliner Roomette$162.00
  • 1 Reserved Thruway Seat
  • Subtotal $260.00
 
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Further to my question on prices. I discovered amsnag on another topic. It shows much cheaper prices for both days:

Tue 07/19/16 Details 5 California Zephyr $97.00 $162.00 $514.00 $349.00 NA

Wed 07/20/16 Details 5 California Zephyr $97.00 $204.00 $514.00 $444.00 NA

The roomette prices of $162.00 and $204.00 compare with 19th July ($260.00) and 20th ($302.00) July on the AMTRAK site. Is there a way to book via amsnag to obtain those prices?
Amsnag just scrapes Amtrak's website. What you are seeing is the ACCOMODATION CHARGE ONLY for the roomette column, not inclusive of the rail fare. When Amtrak redesigned their website, they are showing the top-line fare on the regular point-to-point screen, although I think using multi-city, Amtrak still shows roomette separately. So if you add the rail fare, first column, and the roomette accomodation charge, the second column, you get pretty much what you got on Amtrak's site, one dollar off. You can't always take the rail fare quoted on Amsnag as the base, though, since it is showing the coach fare being offered at the time, and a sleeper automatically drops the rail portion of the fare to the lowest bucket, regardless of what bucket an actual coach seat is in.

Since you didn't specify your endpoints, I was unable to recreate with a dummy booking on Amtrak.com, the prices were obviously too low for CHI-EMY on the westbound CZ

Saw your earlier post and assumed the roomette was SLC-SFW. I got the same numbers, except the coach fare was $98, which explains the $1 discrepency.

If you would click through on a test reservation for 7/19 you would have gotten to:

  • 1 Adult$98.00
  • 1 Superliner Roomette$162.00
  • 1 Reserved Thruway Seat
  • Subtotal $260.00
Thank you for the clarification. Much appreciated.
 
Based on the fact that Amtrak is no longer opening inventory in the lower buckets in almost all cases, but based on anticipated demand and your dates are the very high season, it is probably too early to take this as the best price. They'll adjust it as they see the actual demand. For summer, about 6-9 months out would be the time to really check.

I ran Amsnag for February, a very low demand time, and also for the first 1/2 of November, another low demand time, but not very far away. Based on that, it looks to me like the low bucket the roomette accomodation charge SLC-EMY (which is really what it is) is $118, which seems about right to me. You lowest possible fare, then, is $215.00. The chances of that bucket becoming available in July are slim to none, though. A couple of dates in February show an accomodation charge of $162. From that it looks to me like $162 is the second lowest bucket, so $260 looks to me looks like the best fare you are likely to get.
 
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Based on the fact that Amtrak is no longer opening inventory in the lower buckets in almost all cases, but based on anticipated demand and your dates are the very high season, it is probably too early to take this as the best price. They'll adjust it as they see the actual demand. For summer, about 6-9 months out would be the time to really check.

I ran Amsnag for February, a very low demand time, and also for the first 1/2 of November, another low demand time, but not very far away. Based on that, it looks to me like the low bucket the roomette accomodation charge SLC-EMY (which is really what it is) is $118, which seems about right to me. You lowest possible fare, then, is $215.00. The chances of that bucket becoming available in July are slim to none, though. A couple of dates in February show an accomodation charge of $162. From that it looks to me like $162 is the second lowest bucket, so $260 looks to me looks like the best fare you are likely to get.
Based on your analysis I may as well book now to be sure of getting the roomette. I don't have much flexibility for dates and it appears the discount if I wait would be marginal.

I will get a slight discount as I am 68 and can get the senior's price; I presume that applies despite not being a US citizen.

I understand the bus from EMY to various suburbs of San Francisco and Oakland is included in the fare. If I only book SLC>EMY at this time can I amend later for the bus after I know which hotel I have booked?
 
Based on the fact that Amtrak is no longer opening inventory in the lower buckets in almost all cases, but based on anticipated demand and your dates are the very high season, it is probably too early to take this as the best price. They'll adjust it as they see the actual demand. For summer, about 6-9 months out would be the time to really check.

I ran Amsnag for February, a very low demand time, and also for the first 1/2 of November, another low demand time, but not very far away. Based on that, it looks to me like the low bucket the roomette accomodation charge SLC-EMY (which is really what it is) is $118, which seems about right to me. You lowest possible fare, then, is $215.00. The chances of that bucket becoming available in July are slim to none, though. A couple of dates in February show an accomodation charge of $162. From that it looks to me like $162 is the second lowest bucket, so $260 looks to me looks like the best fare you are likely to get.
Based on your analysis I may as well book now to be sure of getting the roomette. I don't have much flexibility for dates and it appears the discount if I wait would be marginal.

I will get a slight discount as I am 68 and can get the senior's price; I presume that applies despite not being a US citizen.

I understand the bus from EMY to various suburbs of San Francisco and Oakland is included in the fare. If I only book SLC>EMY at this time can I amend later for the bus after I know which hotel I have booked?
You should actually book SLC-SFW (or whatever SF stop you want). The bus to SF is included in the fare. I'd book to some SF stop since you know you will be going there and Fisherman's Wharf is a good bet as there are lots of hotels in the area. You will be able to amend it, but you will probably have to call.

You will be able to get a senior discount, but remember that discount will only apply to the RAIL portion ($98) of the fare. They don't discount the accomodation charge. It'll knock off about $15, bringing the fare to around $245.
 
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You should actually book SLC-SFW (or whatever SF stop you want). The bus to SF is included in the fare.

You will be able to get a senior discount, but remember that discount will only apply to the RAIL portion ($98) of the fare. They don't discount the accomodation charge. It'll knock off about $15, bringing the fare to $200.45 (just ran it).
If I book SLC-SFW can the final leg be amended later if I book a hotel in a different locality? You're correct about the discount; I discovered that earlier :)
 
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Yes, but you would have to call to do it, I don't think you'd be able to do that on the website without impacting the price. If an agent can't do it, call back. Not all agents are equally skilled and knowledgeable.

As I am thinking about it, you don't even have to bother with that. The bus to San Francisco makes the round of all the stops, just get off at another one, no one will care. The important thing is to have a ticket for the bus.
 
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Yes, but you would have to call to do it, I don't think you'd be able to do that on the website without impacting the price. If an agent can't do it, call back. Not all agents are equally skilled and knowledgeable.
OK, thanks. It looks like I need to find an agent and polish up my skype skills, as i am in Australia. I'm heading off to look at hotel prices near OKJ.
 
You will want to be in San Francisco, trust me. That is where all the interesting tourist stuff is, there is not much to Jack London Square and parts of Oakland are quite bad. If the reason you want to be near OKJ because you are taking the Starlight, just take a connecting bus for the Starlight from SF.

I meant the Amtrak phone agent you get, not a travel agent. Call back and get another one if you get one that says the price will change. Most travel agents are famously clueless about Amtrak, don't bother with one.

Besides, as I edited the prior post, you really just need a ticket for the SF Thruway bus. It makes all the stops, just get off at the one nearest your hotel, it doesn't really matter what the ticket says.
 
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