Disobedience on Amtrak

[JoeBas]

Respect is not given. It is earned, and lost, through actions.

 

[Eric in East County]

One of the reasons that we refuse to fly is because of the many inconveniences and indignities associated with having to undergo TSA screenings before being allowed to board.

Within the TSA bureaucracy there are probably those who would welcome TSA’s authority being broadened to include screening passengers boarding Amtrak trains. Although doing so might sound highly impractical, when did that stop the Government from implementing any new policy?

Should this ever happen (God forbid) will you submit meekly to these screenings like airline passengers do, or will you attempt to resist them?

 

[Nick Farr]

Within the TSA bureaucracy there are probably those who would welcome TSA’s authority being broadened to include screening passengers boarding Amtrak trains.

This would be impossible to implement and provide very little added benefit. TSA already has some jurisdiction over train safety but they'd never want a headache like trying to make trains and platforms an entirely sterile area.

The largest group of LD travelers are probably people who can't or won't fly for whatever reason, and TSA is often a lot of that reason.

Planes can wreak huge amounts of destruction if hijacked. Trains can't really do a whole lot of damage, they're much harder to hijack AND you can call in support when you need it on the ground.

 

[Eric in East County]

While we agree that doing TSA screenings of Amtrak passengers appears almost impossible to implement, all it would take is some high-profile event to occur such as the discovery of a WMD onboard an Amtrak train to bring about drastic changes to how we travel by train.

 

[toddinde]

Ejecting someone in the middle of nowhere, with no shelter or other accommodation available, is prohibited by Company regulation's, as it could subject the Company to high liability. If the perpetrator's behavior was so egregious to warrant this extreme measure, the train would have to wait at the scene until law enforcement arrived, at least.

That has always been the rule from my old Consolidated Rules book.

 

[toddinde]

so am I .

if somebody is inebriated with alcohol and then just dumped somewhere hours or even days from any place they could get food or assistance, and something happens to them , Amtrak might well risk being charged in some way . So they would make sure there is somebody to take custody .

No matter how awful their previous behavior .

It would be a very viable lawsuit. But the rules don’t allow for it, so I’m sure they’re more careful than that.

 

[toddinde]

I wonder what Amtrak does if a passenger commits a crime in one state but the next stop is in another state?

For example, a passenger assaults a conductor after the eastbound Empire Builder leaves Wolf Point, Montana but before it reaches the North Dakota Border. If they kick the passenger off at Williston, North Dakota, I don't see how the local police in Williston would have any authority to detain the passenger for breaking a Montana state law - assuming (safely) that Montana has not issued an arrest warrant in that short a period of time.

The train can always stop prior to the border and meet local police in the state where the crime occurred.

If they can't do that, local police are usually able to arrest someone for committing a federal crime, so I assume that the local police in North Dakota would be able to make an arrest based on that authority. Presumably there is a federal law that makes it a federal crime to engage in a criminal act on Amtrak.

There is comity between states. Extradition is used all the time. It’s not an issue.

 

[Dakota 400]

Except there were reports a few years ago about TSA or Customs picking every tenth person

Flying a few days after 9/11, I experienced this by the airline when I checked in. Except, it was every third person. Each piece of luggage had to be opened in the lobby of DAY and was thoroughly examined, messing up my nicely packed clothes in the process.

One year later, flying from LAX and late arriving at the gate, I was the chosen one to be re-examined at the gate just before boarding my flight. Only had one carry-on and its contents were thoroughly examined, including opening some of my 35 mm film canisters to see what was in them! Literally, I was the last one on the plane with the door being closed before I even got to my seat.

 

[JoeBas]

A legitimate authority figure ought to be respected until, as you say, they loose that respect through their actions.

And to tie this back to the original thread, if a LEO threatens me with a hassle, delay, or any other "Beat the rap but not the ride" bull for properly asserting my 4th amendment rights... they lost any respect by their actions.

 

[Eric in East County]

Are we in agreement that the conductor of an Amtrak train is entitled to our respect and whatever he or she says goes?

 

[zephyr17]

Are we in agreement that the conductor of an Amtrak train is entitled to our respect and what he says goes?

Yes, although a few suffer from a little tin god complex. In any case, they have the authority to boot you off, so that has to be factored in.

 

[Nick Farr]

Are we in agreement that the conductor of an Amtrak train is entitled to our respect and what he says goes?

I think all of us agree that we're obligated to follow their instructions.

Maybe it's semantics, but I don't believe anyone is entitled to automatic respect. However, based on my experiences with Amtrak conductors, they're probably the closest I ever come to automatic respect having earned it as a class of employees.

 

[Exvalley]

Are we in agreement that the conductor of an Amtrak train is entitled to our respect and what he says goes?

Being a Conductor is a hard job - and the Conductor needs to deal with some very difficult people. My default position in regard to the Conductor, or any other staff member on the train, is to be respectful and follow their orders. If they break that trust with an unreasonable request, I would politely explain my position. If that didn't change anything I would take it up with customer service after the fact.

The vast majority of employees are good people just trying to make an honest living. I don't want to make their day any harder than it needs to be.

 

[jis]

Yes, although a few suffer from a little tin god complex. In any case, they have the authority to boot you off, so that has to be factored in.

Indeed! But obedience and respect are two different things. I do obey a lot of people because of the power that is vested in them to cause me harm, should they so choose. I quite often do not respect them much, nor disrespect them, mind you - just neutral on the matter, since I don't know them well enough to form an opinion on the matter.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Indeed! But obedience and respect are two different things. I do obey a lot of people because of the power that is vested in them to cause me harm, should they so choose. I quite often do not respect them much, nor disrespect them, mind you - just neutral on the matter, since I don't know them well enough to form an opinion on the matter.

Having traveled the world, I totally agree with jis on this, especially when it comes to armed persons in Uniform that can jeopardize my freedom or even my life, whether LE or Military.
( and I don't exempt those in the US based on what I've seen in my 70+ years of Life!)

 

[Steve4031]

Are we in agreement that the conductor of an Amtrak train is entitled to our respect and whatever he or she says goes?

Yes. Especially if you want to remain on the train. Lol.