MBTA discussion

[Fenway]

The T says Orange Line work is 50% done



and then announced they have approved the purchase of 102 new Green Line 'supercars' to be made by CAF USA Inc.

https://cdn.mbta.com/sites/default/files/2022-08/RFP%20No%20367F-19%20Type%2010%20Supercar%20Update%20and%20Procurement%20AwardNP%20%28002%29.pdf

 

[PaTrainFan]

and then announced they have approved the purchase of 102 new Green Line 'supercars' to be made by CAF USA Inc.

https://cdn.mbta.com/sites/default/files/2022-08/RFP%20No%20367F-19%20Type%2010%20Supercar%20Update%20and%20Procurement%20AwardNP%20%28002%29.pdf

My goodness those are ugly.

 

[Trollopian]

My goodness those are ugly.

Am I the only one who thought of the Very Hungry Caterpillar?

 

[AmtrakMaineiac]

I have heard mixed reviews of the CAF built Type 9s I hope these Type 10s will be better.

 

[Fenway]

The Orange Line WILL reopen tomorrow (9/19)

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

Am I the only one who thought of the Very Hungry Caterpillar?

Hahahaha, I just learned about Codzilla - maybe there could be cod themed LRT vehicles?

 

[Fenway]

Tuesday's evening rush hour didn't go well.

A new Orange Line train was pulled out of service Tuesday night, just one day after the entire line reopened after a 30-day shutdown.

 

[Tlcooper93]

Usually, public complaints are best ignored as they don’t really convey truth because they are often too tainted with politics, personal feelings and other like things.

But it seems the MBTA is having real trouble making good on promises and actually running decent service.

 

[Fenway]

Usually, public complaints are best ignored as they don’t really convey truth because they are often too tainted with politics, personal feelings and other like things.

But it seems the MBTA is having real trouble making good on promises and actually running decent service.

It seems obvious they have effectively retired the Hawker Siddeley cars built between 1979-1981 and are just using the 74 CRRC cars they currently have available and they are blaming longer headway times on the dispatcher shortage.

My hunch is the feds told them the cars numbered 01200 – 01319 were done.

The CBS Boston website offers more info than the video

The Orange Line Shutdown: Was it worth it? Riders say commute is no faster

Two weeks after the reopening of the Orange Line, reviews are mixed.

www.cbsnews.com

Everybody knows the new Governor is going to clean house at the MBTA on January 1st - She appears to be more transit-friendly as she has done photo ops at transit stations in South Attleboro, Springfield, and Lynn in the past month but can't really do anything until formally elected in November which appears to be a certainty.

 

[GDRRiley]

the car issues they have having are 100% on CRRC, LA metro canceled their order from then after a few months back the confirmed 0 options.

 

[Fenway]

the car issues they have having are 100% on CRRC, LA metro canceled their order from then after a few months back the confirmed 0 options.

the car issues they have having are 100% on CRRC, LA metro canceled their order from then after a few months back the confirmed 0 options.

I can't find any link that the order was canceled

LACMTA HR4000 Heavy Rail Vehicle Project - CRRC

In December 2016, the Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority’s (Metro) awarded a contract to CRRC MA to design and manufacture 64 new subway cars for the Red and Purple Lines with a consideration for an additional 218 subway cars totaling $647m. CRRC had the overall best value...

www.crrcma.com

The MBTA's rolling stock is to be kind fragile.

The Red Line in particular has been neglected over decades which defies logic given the political clout the line should have had in South Boston, Dorchester and Cambridge.

http://roster.transithistory.org/

Orange Line Fleet (174 cars + 76 on order)​

Series​	Car type​	Built By​	Electrical​	Year Built​	Width​	Length​	Seats​	Cars Active​	Cars Out of Service​
01200-01319​	#12 Main Line​	Hawker-Siddeley​	General Electric​	1979-81	111”​	65’​	58​	66​	32​
1400-1551​	#14 Orange​	CRRC​	MELCO​	2018-2023	111”​	65’​	44 A-car/ 50 B-car​	74​	2+76 additional on order​

Red Line Fleet (226 cars + 242 on order)​

Series​	Car type​	Built By​	Electrical​	Year Built​	Year Rebuilt​	Carbody Material​	Width​	Length​	Seats​	Cars Active​	Out of Service​
01500-01523​	#1 Red Line​	Pullman-Standard​	Westinghouse​	1969-70​	1985-88​	Aluminum​	122”​	69’06”​	63​	24​	0​
01600-01651​	#1 Red Line​	Pullman-Standard​	Westinghouse​	1969-70​	1985-88​	Aluminum​	122”​	69’06”​	64​	44​	6​
01700-01757​	#2 Red Line​	UTDC​	Westinghouse​	1987-89​	2011-2016​	Aluminum​	120”​	69’09”​	62​	56​	2​
01800-01885​	#3 Red Line​	Bombardier​	General Electric​	1993-94​	​	Stainless-Steel​	120”​	69’06”​	50​	82​	2​
1900-2151​	#4 Red Line​	CRRC​	MELCO​	2019-2024​	​	Stainless-Steel​	120”​	69’06”​	43 A-car/ 50 B-car​	10​	242 on order​

Blue Line Fleet (94 cars)​

Series​	Car type​	Built By​	Electrical​	Year Built​	Width​	Length​	Seats​	Cars Active​	Cars Out of Service​
0700-0793​	#5 East Boston​	Siemens​	Siemens​	2007-2009	111”​	48’06”​	35​	94​	0​

Green Line (Riverside, Reservoir, and Inner Belt Carhouses) and Mattapan-Ashmont Line (Mattapan Yard)​

Green Line Fleet (221 Green Line cars + 10 cars for Mattapan-Ashmont)​

Series​	Car type​	Built By​	Electrical​	Year Built​	Width​	Length​	Seats​	Cars Active​	Out of Service​
3072-3096, 3222-3271​	PCC (“Wartime” class)​	Pullman-Standard​	Westinghouse​	1945-46 (rebuilt 1978-83 and again 1999-2005)	100”​	46’​	41​	4​	4 ​
3234, 3265​	PCC (“Wartime” class)​	Pullman-Standard​	Brookville Equipment​	1945-1946 (rebuilt 2021-2024)​	100’​	46’​	41​	1​	1​
3600-3699​	Type 7​	Kinki-Sharyo​	Westinghouse​	3600-3649: 1986-87 3650-3699:1987-88 Overhauled Alstom 2015-2019​	104”​	72’​	46​	82​	4​
3700-3719​	Type 7​	Kinki-Sharyo​	Adtranz​	1997 Overhauled Alstom 2018-2019​	104”​	72’​	46​	14​	3​
3800-3894​	Type 8​	Breda​	Adtranz/Bombardier​	1999-2007​	104”​	74’​	44​	81​	13​
3900-3923​	Type 9​	CAF​	MELCO​	2018-2020​	104”​	74”​	44​	24​	0​

 

[Fenway]

On Friday, October 14th current T management was grilled by 2 US senators



These managers all know the next Governor will fire them.

I wonder why the T didn't extend the shutdown for another 2 weeks when it became apparent more work needed to be done.



The Red Line needs an overhaul between Alewife and Harvard and JFK/Umass to Braintree. The core line from Harvard to Andrew seems fine as does the original extension to Ashmont.

The Orange Line 'Haymarket North' line was built on the cheap back in the 70s and we are paying for it today.

 

[Tlcooper93]

On Friday, October 14th current T management was grilled by 2 US senators



These managers all know the next Governor will fire them.

I wonder why the T didn't extend the shutdown for another 2 weeks when it became apparent more work needed to be done.



The Red Line needs an overhaul between Alewife and Harvard and JFK/Umass to Braintree. The core line from Harvard to Andrew seems fine as does the original extension to Ashmont.

The Orange Line 'Haymarket North' line was built on the cheap back in the 70s and we are paying for it today.

You mention the next governor cleaning house at the T a lot. Your faith in the next governor and in her ability to “fix” the T, in my opinion, is misplaced. I think the T’s problems go beyond political leadership and management. That said, I do hope I’m wrong , and that we do get meaningful change.

Secondly, everyone always mentions the ride between Alewife and Harvard being in need of overhaul. What about it needs to change? Thats one of the sections of the Red Line I ride regularly as I live a short walk from Alewife. It always seems fast and reliable to me, but of course, I do hear this a lot.

 

[Fenway]

You mention the next governor cleaning house at the T a lot. Your faith in the next governor and in her ability to “fix” the T, in my opinion, is misplaced. I think the T’s problems go beyond political leadership and management. That said, I do hope I’m wrong , and that we do get meaningful change.

Secondly, everyone always mentions the ride between Alewife and Harvard being in need of overhaul. What about it needs to change? Thats one of the sections of the Red Line I ride regularly as I live a short walk from Alewife. It always seems fast and reliable to me, but of course, I do hear this a lot.

I don't think my faith in Maura Healy is misplaced as she lives in the city of Boston.

Harvard/Alewife after 40 years has seen a lot of water damage, by comparison, Harvard/Kendall built 110 years ago is dry as a bone.

Media is finally looking hard at CRRC MA - What nobody in Boston media has been able to pin down is how CRRC MA is doing with the LA Metro contract.

More delays for new Orange and Red line cars - CommonWealth Magazine

STATE HOUSE NEWS SERVICE THE OUTLOOK FOR the already-delayed transition to entirely new Orange and Red line fleets continues to grow worse. After previously delaying the project’s targeted end date by at least a year, Chinese firm CRRC now expects it will need several more months to finish...

commonwealthmagazine.org

CRRC IL seems to be producing cars to the CTA's satisfaction.

 

[Rambling Robert]

The female T EMPLOYEE WAS RUDE and grabbed my phone from me because the QR code didn’t work at the new fare validation gates at North Station. She was one of very few gate attendants. After all they can’t lose money / or more money on another T debacle- but I think it’s another loss.

She could see the QR. and that I was on the DownEaster. She did not over ride the gate and I asked for my hone back. After about a minute I got the QR to work.

Imagine if the gate attendant had dropped and cracked my iPhone screen. Not a fun way to start a nine segment trip.

 

[AmtrakMaineiac]

You mention the next governor cleaning house at the T a lot. Your faith in the next governor and in her ability to “fix” the T, in my opinion, is misplaced. I think the T’s problems go beyond political leadership and management. That said, I do hope I’m wrong , and that we do get meaningful change.

Changing the management is like appointing a new captain for the Titanic to prevent the ship from sinking. The underlying problem is the fact that the state will not fund the T adequately and saddled it with the Big Dig debt. Nothing will be resolved until this is addressed

 

[Fenway]

I have been told by friends at the T that since the reopening of the Orange Line they have been told they can not run Hawker-Siddeley cars in revenue service unless it is absolutely necessary and they are using the 74 available CRRC cars. They are still waiting for 78 cars.

The Red Line needs to retire the 68 Pullman-Standard cars that are 50 years old but can't as they only have 10 CRRC cars available.

The scuttlebutt is the next Governor has decided on making Rick Leary currently running the TTC in Toronto to become the next transit czar in Massachusetts.

 

[UserNameRequired]

The female T EMPLOYEE WAS RUDE and grabbed my phone from me because the QR code didn’t work at the new fare validation gates at North Station. She was one of very few gate attendants. After all they can’t lose money / or more money on another T debacle- but I think it’s another loss.

She could see the QR. and that I was on the DownEaster. She did not over ride the gate and I asked for my hone back. After about a minute I got the QR to work.

Imagine if the gate attendant had dropped and cracked my iPhone screen. Not a fun way to start a nine segment trip.

Do you use dark mode? I have had dark mode change colors enough that QR codes had trouble getting read from the screen (for other purpose, not MBTA related).

 

[GDRRiley]

Media is finally looking hard at CRRC MA - What nobody in Boston media has been able to pin down is how CRRC MA is doing with the LA Metro contract.

cars are extremely late and LA metro isn't happy. so far all additional orders have been canceled. whats not cleared based on some recent language is if LA metro outright canceled them all.
That would leave LA metro extremely short cars and the quickest supplier would be Hitachi as they already are making compatible cars for Miami and Baltimore

 

[Tlcooper93]

Changing the management is like appointing a new captain for the Titanic to prevent the ship from sinking. The underlying problem is the fact that the state will not fund the T adequately and saddled it with the Big Dig debt. Nothing will be resolved until this is addressed

Summed up very nicely.

Does the governor have the power to unburden the T of Big Dig debt? If so, then I will be more of board with this "new governor, new T" business.

The scuttlebutt is the next Governor has decided on making Rick Leary currently running the TTC in Toronto to become the next transit czar in Massachusetts.

I don't think my faith in Maura Healy is misplaced as she lives in the city of Boston.

Someone living in Boston is the only prerequisite for ability to fix the T? Sorry, you're going to have to explain that one.

Didn't Rick Leary get naturalized as a canadian citizen in 2019, and his position was made permanent in 2018?
That said, he is promising to me. Given he's lived in Boston extensively, and he did especially good work for Toronto, I am more sold by that than any of this Maura Healy stuff.

 

[Fenway]

The MBTA's GM announced his resignation today

 

[joelkfla]

The MBTA's GM announced his resignation today

Does "mixed emotions" mean "Thank G I'm outta here!"?

 

[Brian Battuello]

Interesting timing. Resigning now gives Gov Baker a chance to pick the new leader before leaving office. I don't know if Baker really cares, or if he will let the new administration do the search. I wouldn't be surprised if they don't already have someone in mind.

I just hope he doesn't pull an Udoka and turn up as the head of the MTA. Google Udoka if you don't keep up on east coast basketball news...

 

[Fenway]

Boston's Channel 5 sent a reporter to Philadelphia to see if SEPTA had similar issues.

Can MBTA learn lessons from Philadelphia's transit system?

It's a sports-crazed city in the Northeast, home to universities and rich with history. And they have really old transit systems.

www.wcvb.com

5 Investigates visited the city of Brotherly Love for two days last month to see how SEPTA runs its system. The similarities are clear:

• SEPTA is the sixth-largest transit system in the country, similar to the T, which is the 5th largest
• SEPTA's infrastructure dates to the early 1900s; the T dates back to 1897

 

[AmtrakMaineiac]

Boston's Channel 5 sent a reporter to Philadelphia to see if SEPTA had similar issues.

Can MBTA learn lessons from Philadelphia's transit system?

It's a sports-crazed city in the Northeast, home to universities and rich with history. And they have really old transit systems.

www.wcvb.com

5 Investigates visited the city of Brotherly Love for two days last month to see how SEPTA runs its system. The similarities are clear:

• SEPTA is the sixth-largest transit system in the country, similar to the T, which is the 5th largest
• SEPTA's infrastructure dates to the early 1900s; the T dates back to 1897

Having lived and used transit in both cities, I think the report glossed over some issues with SEPTA and made it seem better than it really is. Of course it is true SEPTA has not had some of the glaring problems that MBTA has had recently such as Orange Line trains catching fire, etc.

However I think the systems are different in a number of ways which makes it a bit more of an apples to oranges comparison.

For one thing Philadelphia is a much bigger city than Boston yet the rapid transit portion of the system (Broad St Subway, Market Frankford El, subway surface trolley tunnel, and PATCO line) is if anything smaller than Boston's equivalent. One might even question whether the subway surface trolleys can be called rapid transit since the surface portions are conventional streetcars running in the street with traffic whereas the majority of Boston's Green Line is separated from traffic (except the extreme end of the E line). Another factor somewhat glossed over in the report was the perception of crime on the SEPTA transit system. I know when I lived there a lot of people would not even go on the Broad St. line even in the daytime. I never saw this kind of attitude in Boston.

On the other hand SEPTA has an extensive electrified Regional Rail system much more extensive and with better service frequency than Boston's commuter rail, which seems more oriented towards bringing commuters into the city. SEPTA also has the tunnel so that trips can be made suburb to suburb from the western to the Northern suburbs which is more difficult in Boston due to the lack of the North South Rail Link.

I would summarize by saying for a suburban commuter SEPTA is superior but for someone living in the city Boston probably has the better system even with its well publicized problems.