National Dining Car Specials/New Menus (April '17)

[neroden]

Ingredient lists are STARTING to be included on the Food Facts site.

http://www.amtrakfoodfacts.com/restimg2/force/template/1/Amtrak__Food_Facts/w432/h340/AMFF-SPRING-2017-39.pdf

Ken

OH MY GOD. THANK YOU.

You have no idea what this means to me. While I can't actually eat that particular dish (I can't tolerate serrano chiles), if they did this on every dish, I'd have a much wider selection of food to choose from on Amtrak and I'd be *very* pleased.

This is what I've been asking for for the last several years.

Unfortunately, I just went and checked the LSL menu and so far none of them have ingredients lists, so I guess it'll be a while...

They probably still won't detail the bread ingredients, sadly (and that's where the worst allergen for me usually is -- guar gum is a common bread additive). But I can hope. And even without bread it still gives me a lot more options.

 

[MARC Rider]

Just had dinner on the Meteor. Had the surf and turf. I liked the shrimp, they weren't overcooked and had a good oceanic taste that shellfish should have. The steak was cooked excellently, just like I like it. Baked potato was Ok. Veggie medley was fine, not overcooked, but it cake waswas a bit heavy on the starches with corn and edamame (soybeans). Salad was tolerable, at least they use romaine lettuce, but I wish they'd have a wider choice of dressings. Cheesecake was good, but the presentation is terrible.

Definitely an uptick in food quality. Service was also good.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

Just had dinner on the Meteor. Had the surf and turf. I liked the shrimp, they weren't overcooked and had a good oceanic taste that shellfish should have. The steak was cooked excellently, just like I like it. Baked potato was Ok. Veggie medley was fine, not overcooked, but it cake waswas a bit heavy on the starches with corn and edamame (soybeans). Salad was tolerable, at least they use romaine lettuce, but I wish they'd have a wider choice of dressings. Cheesecake was good, but the presentation is terrible.

Definitely an uptick in food quality. Service was also good.

It's good to hear a personal report, and I'm glad you thought it was good, and great to hear the service was good. But why do you say the food is an uptick in quality? Salad, Cheesecake, Baked Potato, Veggies, and Steak all sound exactly as they were before... and I'm guessing the Shrimp is the same quality as the previous Seafood Dishes.. which was pretty decent. So what changed in quality?

 

[bretton88]

Definitely Moorman starting to make good on his vow to upgrade food service. These are much better options than when I took the EB in January.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

Definitely Moorman starting to make good on his vow to upgrade food service. These are much better options than when I took the EB in January.

How so? I see some additional options which may or may not be good quality. But everything looks the same to me. I rode the Empire Builder in November (same menu cycle) and had good food options.

I'm all for actual improvements... but I see none yet.

 

[Thirdrail7]

I'm pleased to see menu upgrades, but my problem is the combination of what is listed below:

When I think of Amtrak food, I recall an article from the student newspaper about our campus dining hall at the university I was attending. All I remember was the last (and bottom) line. The gist of it was "It (the food) may not be like mom makes at home, but mom didn't have to cook for 5,000 people." And that's how I feel about Amtrak food too.

Fair enough, but if that's the case why do we use IHOP or Applebees or Chili's as comparisons when in reality Amtrak is much closer to generic school cafeterias? Even the local Denny's is easily a full step or two above Amtrak's breakfast offerings.

That includes the new Field & Sea Combo for $36.

I understand the attempt to recover costs. However, I would resent being charged premium "fresh cooked" prices for pre-plated meals. For those prices, I want something cooked to my liking.

Well, at least grits are on some of the menus.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I understand the attempt to recover costs. However, I would resent being charged premium "fresh cooked" prices for pre-plated meals. For those prices, I want something cooked to my liking. Well, at least grits are on some of the menus.

 

[Train2104]

Just had dinner on the Meteor. Had the surf and turf. I liked the shrimp, they weren't overcooked and had a good oceanic taste that shellfish should have. The steak was cooked excellently, just like I like it. Baked potato was Ok. Veggie medley was fine, not overcooked, but it cake waswas a bit heavy on the starches with corn and edamame (soybeans). Salad was tolerable, at least they use romaine lettuce, but I wish they'd have a wider choice of dressings. Cheesecake was good, but the presentation is terrible.

Am I the only one who doesn't like romaine lettuce? I like the new dinner choices, but looking at the lunch menu, I may be stuck between burger and pork sliders on my next LD trip (if this is still the menu)

Ugh fancification.

 

[niemi24s]

I agree with you. I'm not a food snoot and was surprised to read a Cruise Critic staff review of one ship's salads grumbling because they had too much iceberg lettuce. That's my favorite kind! But, I suppose, others may turn up their noses at it.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I agree with you. I'm not a food snoot and was surprised to read a Cruise Critic staff review of one ship's salads grumbling because they had too much iceberg lettuce. That's my favorite kind! But, I suppose, others may turn up their noses at it.

I've always wondered if anyone actually preferred iceberg over actual other lettuce. It's neither nutritious nor flavorful so I never really understood the appeal myself. I guess the primary benefits are that it's crunchy and cheap and you can eat the whole head in one sitting without worrying about empty calories (or vitamins). It's also the only lettuce I've seen that you can easily cut into a wedge or any number of other shapes without falling apart. Iceberg lettuce is something like 96% water and 4% cellulose, which is similar to a cucumber, but without the flavor or nutrition.

 

[keelhauled]

It's also the only lettuce I've seen that you can easily cut into a wedge or any number of other shapes without falling apart.

I have a deepseated dislike for iceberg lettuce because the first (and to date only) time I ordered a "blue cheese wedge salad" I was under the impression that the wedge was of cheese. You can imagine my disappointment.

 

[Dakota 400]

Just a personal opinion, but the fact that Amtrak is changing the menus is encouraging to me. Quality restaurants in my area change their menus to attract more guests as well as repeat diners who enjoy that restaurant. I think Amtrak is trying to do the same. And, if so, that is a good business model, I think.

 

[RSG]

Am I the only one who doesn't like romaine lettuce? I like the new dinner choices, but looking at the lunch menu, I may be stuck between burger and pork sliders on my next LD trip (if this is still the menu)

Ugh fancification.

I agree with you. I'm not a food snoot and was surprised to read a Cruise Critic staff review of one ship's salads grumbling because they had too much iceberg lettuce. That's my favorite kind! But, I suppose, others may turn up their noses at it.

I personally don't mind Romaine lettuce, but it has to be in good condition (and I still like a lettuce blend over straight Romaine). The problem with Romaine is that it wilts quickly and has to be stored under just the right circumstances in order to remain "fresh". This is why I'm surprised that Amtrak is using it for food service. I can't imagine a supply of Romaine salad mix staying un-wilted from Emeryville or Los Angeles to Chicago in July, particularly when it may not always stay at or around 40°F (especially when pre-plated). I predict this will be one of the first items to change before the next new menus come out.

The Romaine-vs-Iceberg debate is the food equivalent of the "does the toilet paper roll go so the end is under or over" debate. There are people like DA & Oprah Winfrey who think Iceberg is barely lettuce at all. Then there are those who consider people who want only Romaine or a 'spring mix' to be food snobs. Currently in the world of foodservice, it seems the Romaine side is winning, as I notice more and more restaurants either using it either exclusively or in an Iceberg blend. I do notice that in cases where Romaine is used, about half the time I end up picking a piece or two out because it has already wilted and started to liquefy.

Another reason Amtrak may have gone to Romaine is because it tends to be "fluffier" (ie, less dense) and therefore takes up more space on a bowl or plate, thus presumably enabling an equivalent amount to go farther. Whether that would be a true economical advantage would depend of course on the actual cost of the product (as well as any losses from spoiled product unable to be served).

 

[PVD]

Romaine keeps pretty well when kept in the sealed bags for salad mixes that are common in supermarkets. Once opened not so great. I have a bag of Dole Romaine mix in my refrigerator I opened tonight. I'll get 3 days out of it before it is either finished or "finished"

 

[Green Maned Lion]

Iceberg has a certain cool wateryness and a certain crispness (assuming it's properly served) that adds texture and such to certain things- like sandwhiches and salad. It doesn't have much flavor, and it isn't particularly nutritionally useful, but it does have its place.

It also provides for stomach filling without calories, which is nice for people with large appetites and a desire for a smaller waste size. For instance, if one likes to take bite out of a large burger, replacing some of the sandwhiches thickness with ice burg can make the burger more satisfying to bite into, and make it feel solid in ones hands, feeling like one has eaten more, while in fact substantially reducing its calorie and fat content.

So I do have a preference for ice burg here and there. But an all iceberg salad is not an example.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Iceberg has a certain cool wateryness and a certain crispness (assuming it's properly served) that adds texture and such to certain things- like sandwhiches and salad.

If crispness is the primary appeal then cabbage, carrots, and radishes are substantially crispier than iceberg.

It doesn't have much flavor, and it isn't particularly nutritionally useful, but it does have its place.

Yeah, as a dirt cheap vegetable-like filler that was bred to survive long trips in a rail car. As ice based transport was replaced with refrigerated trucks iceberg was reemployed as an easy way to make fatty heart clogging meals look healthier.

It also provides for stomach filling without calories, which is nice for people with large appetites and a desire for a smaller waste size. For instance, if one likes to take bite out of a large burger, replacing some of the sandwhiches thickness with ice burg can make the burger more satisfying to bite into, and make it feel solid in ones hands, feeling like one has eaten more, while in fact substantially reducing its calorie and fat content.

In my experience the vast majority of iceberg lettuce is served lathered with mayonnaise or drenched in ranch or bleu cheese or thousand island dressing. People who are health conscious enough to eat lettuce plain or with a low calorie topping wouldn't choose iceberg in the first place.

 

[MikefromCrete]

All right, GML vs. The Devil. This is the matchup faithful AU followers have been awaiting.

 

[zephyr17]

Lettuce Wars? Really?

 

[PVD]

Both have a point. Iceberg has a legit purpose for which it is well suited. Most of the disdain seems to arise from folks using it for things it is not well suited for, usually driven by cost considerations, or ignorance.

 

[A Voice]

It doesn't have much flavor, and it isn't particularly nutritionally useful, but it does have its place.

In my experience the vast majority of iceberg lettuce is served lathered with mayonnaise or drenched in ranch or bleu cheese or thousand island dressing. People who are health conscious enough to eat lettuce plain or with a low calorie topping wouldn't choose iceberg in the first place.

Just because you don't like something, or wouldn't make that choice (and when there is nothing wrong with a different opinion) doesn't mean everyone else feels the same way. Most of my salads consist of a bowl of Iceberg lettuce with the fat-free version of Italian dressing - because its just 20 calories a serving; A big bowl of Iceberg even smothered in dressing is a filling, low calorie part of the meal. I've tried Romaine and leaf lettuces but prefer Iceberg.

Lettuce Wars? Really?

Well, what do expect people to talk about on the "Make Vegetables Great Again" forums? Trains or something?

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Lettuce Wars? Really?

Yes. Really.



Or, alternatively, how about something more like this...



They look like some weird grownup version of the cabbage patch kids.

 

[A Voice]

Or, alternatively, how about something more like this...

There, that's better.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

I'm not here to start wars on lettuce. Wars over a different kinds of lettuce (the type with dead presidents thereon) maybe.

You asked if anyone ever had a preference for iceberg. I am giving you some places that I do. And overall actually agreeing- it is not my general preference for salad lettuce.

If crispness is the primary appeal then cabbage, carrots, and radishes are substantially crispier than iceberg.

I said "cool wateryness" and a "certain crispness"; cabbage, carrots, and radishes have different sorts of crispnesses and are certainly not watery.

It doesn't have much flavor, and it isn't particularly nutritionally useful, but it does have its place.

Yeah, as a dirt cheap vegetable-like filler that was bred to survive long trips in a rail car. As ice based transport was replaced with refrigerated trucks iceberg was reemployed as an easy way to make fatty heart clogging meals look healthier.

I won't dispute you that this is mainly how it's used.

In my experience the vast majority of iceberg lettuce is served lathered with mayonnaise or drenched in ranch or bleu cheese or thousand island dressing. People who are health conscious enough to eat lettuce plain or with a low calorie topping wouldn't choose iceberg in the first place.

I do not dispute that this is often the way it is served. That is the fault of the food preparer, not the lettuce.

If I order a burger with 1/2 lb of meat, slathered with sauces, Swiss cheese, goat cheese, and bacon, it will have more calories than if I order burger with 1/3lb of the same meat, sauces, Swiss cheese, goat cheese, bacon, and a chunk of iceberg. True or false?

As I said, it can be used to replace more caloric bulk in a food dish. So it does have uses. If we ever break bread, DA, I can assure you that iceberg is not something found in my kitchen. But I am tired of your one-size-fits-all generalizations.

Personally my favorite low cal bulk up is sauerkraut, which I've heard most people hate. It's actually quite healthy for you because of the active biological components of its fermentation.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

You asked if anyone ever had a preference for iceberg. I am giving you some places that I do. And overall actually agreeing- it is not my general preference for salad lettuce.

Fair enough, point taken.

In my experience the vast majority of iceberg lettuce is served lathered with mayonnaise or drenched in ranch or bleu cheese or thousand island dressing. People who are health conscious enough to eat lettuce plain or with a low calorie topping wouldn't choose iceberg in the first place.

I do not dispute that this is often the way it is served. That is the fault of the food preparer, not the lettuce. If I order a burger with 1/2 lb of meat, slathered with sauces, Swiss cheese, goat cheese, and bacon, it will have more calories than if I order burger with 1/3lb of the same meat, sauces, Swiss cheese, goat cheese, bacon, and a chunk of iceberg. True or false? As I said, it can be used to replace more caloric bulk in a food dish. So it does have uses.

I think the difference between our positions boils down to a matter of practical vs theoretical. You can make a reasonable case that iceberg could be used as a low calorie replacement for less healthy ingredients. Meanwhile I can make a reasonable case that, from a practical standpoint, iceberg lettuce is very rarely used in such a manner.

If we ever break bread, DA, I can assure you that iceberg is not something found in my kitchen. But I am tired of your one-size-fits-all generalizations.

Generalizing may not be infallible it's a lot faster than always being right. :lol:

Or, alternatively, how about something more like this...

There, that's better.

Not really the same thing though. I did once see women wearing raw beef as a joke in a magazine once and... Let's just say it didn't have nearly the same appeal as lettuce bikinis.

 

[WoodyinNYC]

I'm not here to start wars on lettuce.

... my favorite low cal bulk up is sauerkraut, which ... is actually quite healthy because of the active biological components of its fermentation.

Where were you when the lights went out?

Down in the cellar eating sauerkraut!

It is a probiotic food. And I love it.

But sauerkraut does have unpleasant side effects. Glad it's not served in the confined spaces of rail cars. (Let's keep this thread On Topic, please. LOL.)

The side effects can usually be prevented with a capsule or two of Beano, the branded product which could as easily be named CabbageO, and in a store brand version of alpha-galactosidase from every major drugstore chain. The vegetable-derived enzyme breaks down complex carbohydrates in the gut and ends the production of excess gas.