New Siemens Charger locomotive

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me_little_me

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Adam - like the idea of keeping P-42s. But a big that is "IF" spare parts and trucks especially can be had to keep them running without cannibalizing's the fleet.
They can scrap them or extend the life of many of them using the cannibalized engines. I'd vote for the latter. Still leaves a lot of available engines for increasing the number of routes, reducing the number of Charge spares needed, and going back to running specials.
 

NSC1109

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I agree with you. Just because Amtrak is contracted to run a service does not make it an Amtrak service. Different liveries for different service is standard practice all over the world even when run by the same outfit. It is mostly done for differential branding identities.
I disagree...if Amtrak is contracted to run a service and it says AMTRAK and it’s marketed as AMTRAK then its an Amtrak service.

You don’t see regional airlines operating their jets in their own paint normally because there are branding standards. The times you do are for aircraft to float between contracts to pick up extra demand.
 
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rickycourtney

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I disagree...if Amtrak is contracted to run a service and it says AMTRAK and it’s marketed as AMTRAK then its an Amtrak service.

You don’t see regional airlines operating their jets in their own paint normally because there are branding standards. The times you do are for aircraft to float between contracts to pick up extra demand.
That’s an imperfect comparison.

Try this one...
When Delta pays SkyWest to operate a route... SkyWest is happy to brand it how Delta wants.
When a state pays Amtrak to operate a route... Amtrak should be happy to brand it how the state wants... especially when the state buys the equipment.
 

adamj023

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The P-42 are approaching over 30 years of service. The new locomotives will probably be required by Government regulations due to safety and environmental reasons not to mention the new cars will be more reliable and cost less to maintain so the P-42 will probably be phased out. But before that time when there is a mix of P-42 and new Locomotives they could use them to test service additions to see if they make sense rather than immediately phase them out. I have taken Amtrak trains when a headlight was cracked and we had to wait for a replacement locomotive though I don’t know if it was a P-42 or the earlier version at the time. But hopefully the new locomotives will be a lot easier to service and headlamps could be easily replaced in route by the crew as they schedule a place to stop the train. They should keep routine parts on hand such as windshield wipers, headlamps and the like so they can easily be serviced. The specifications for the Siemens indicate it should be easier to service and maintain.

The ones before the GE were the EMD apparently and I definitely remember those as well. I think when I had used Amtrak they were the EMD’s mostly and the GE were more reliable but hopefully Siemens will be even better. The new locomotives should have a ton of improvements from safety to environmental and everything else.

They say the P-42 will stay on the NEC routes. I guess that is for non electrified sections so it seems like they will need replacements for those eventually.
 
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jis

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That’s an imperfect comparison.

Try this one...
When Delta pays SkyWest to operate a route... SkyWest is happy to brand it how Delta wants.
When a state pays Amtrak to operate a route... Amtrak should be happy to brand it how the state wants... especially when the state buys the equipment.
That is indeed the way it has worked in the past and will continue in the future.

Amtrak has never had a problem painting state owned equipment in whatever livery the states want (Amtrak California, Cascade Talgos etc.), including equipment on long term lease from Amtrak that are for dedicated use on the state funded state service e.g. Superliners long term leased for use on Amtrak California service, Empire Corridor P32ACDMs. That is not going to change no matter how many convoluted arguments show up here at AU. Money talks and well you know the rest ;)
 

Devil's Advocate

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Eventually AA found a way for the A300 to have a metallic finish.
The composite surfaces were simply painted gray. AA's A300s performed well as a niche sub-fleet catering to the South American market ferrying larger/heavier luggage than the rest of the network. Then questionable training and excessive rudder correction resulted in a major crash and a new fleet structure. Or at least that's how I remember it.

I disagree...if Amtrak is contracted to run a service and it says AMTRAK and it’s marketed as AMTRAK then its an Amtrak service. You don’t see regional airlines operating their jets in their own paint normally because there are branding standards. The times you do are for aircraft to float between contracts to pick up extra demand.
A negotiated contract determines what liveries are possible rather than some circular logic puzzle.
 

frequentflyer

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American was not happy with the grey and polished the metal themselves, so the story goes. Airbus did not want to do it.
 

Ziv

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I worked in the hospitality industry in a few different locations, but one of the stranger ones was at the Hyatt Regency Miami. We had people from Brazil mostly, but some other South American countries that would check in with one very light but large soft side suitcase. And 3 days later when they checked out they would have the large suitcase completely full of newly purchased clothes and items. Plus they had filled a medium and small soft side suitcase that had been nested inside the larger one full too. It was like Russian Matryoshka dolls, one inside the other, but now they were filled chockablock full of clothes. And car parts. And lawn sprinklers. And blenders. And, yes, one day, a kitchen sink. Well actually, it was a bathroom vanity sink, but kitchen sounded better.
The composite surfaces were simply painted gray. AA's A300s performed well as a niche sub-fleet catering to the South American market ferrying larger/heavier luggage than the rest of the network.
....
 

jiml

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I worked in the hospitality industry in a few different locations, but one of the stranger ones was at the Hyatt Regency Miami. We had people from Brazil mostly, but some other South American countries that would check in with one very light but large soft side suitcase. And 3 days later when they checked out they would have the large suitcase completely full of newly purchased clothes and items. Plus they had filled a medium and small soft side suitcase that had been nested inside the larger one full too. It was like Russian Matryoshka dolls, one inside the other, but now they were filled chockablock full of clothes. And car parts. And lawn sprinklers. And blenders. And, yes, one day, a kitchen sink. Well actually, it was a bathroom vanity sink, but kitchen sounded better.
I'm laughing at your post. Without getting into too much of a tangent this is how many Canadians travelled to the US not that many years ago. I may have even been guilty. Possibly not as extreme as your example, but trust me - there are reasons.
 

railiner

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I worked in the hospitality industry in a few different locations, but one of the stranger ones was at the Hyatt Regency Miami. We had people from Brazil mostly, but some other South American countries that would check in with one very light but large soft side suitcase. And 3 days later when they checked out they would have the large suitcase completely full of newly purchased clothes and items. Plus they had filled a medium and small soft side suitcase that had been nested inside the larger one full too. It was like Russian Matryoshka dolls, one inside the other, but now they were filled chockablock full of clothes. And car parts. And lawn sprinklers. And blenders. And, yes, one day, a kitchen sink. Well actually, it was a bathroom vanity sink, but kitchen sounded better.
It was like that at the old AA terminal at JFK, too. It got so bad, that AA installed these large shrink wrap machines for passengers to reinforce their overpacked baggage, prior to checking them. That was prior to 9-11, and TSA inspection...
During the busier times of year, AA placed an embargo on checking excessive baggage, even for extra fees, to certain Caribbean destinations...
 

west point

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The A-300 series had a large difference between Max zero weight and max landing weights . That allowed for the reserve fuel margins needed for South American operation especially in inclement weather at destination and alternate(s). Then all you had to worry about was can you add enough fuel for enroute from origin to destination but not exceed max take off weight.
 

Bob Dylan

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I'm laughing at your post. Without getting into too much of a tangent this is how many Canadians travelled to the US not that many years ago. I may have even been guilty. Possibly not as extreme as your example, but trust me - there are reasons.
Yep, they're called Duties and Taxes!
 

frequentflyer

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Ok, I think I get it now, Phase IV.........errrrr..........Phase VI is mostly blue with then red stripe cheatline on cars, so a locomotive with mostly blue with a little bit of red, is the same thing. Hence, the locomotive is in Phase IV...........arggghhh..........I mean Phase VI.

Looking forward to Phase VII when it debuts fleet wide which will probably be when the Siemens mega coach order is announced.
 

CSXfoamer1997

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I've heard before that the Chargers don't perform very well in cold weather. What exactly is wrong with them in cold weather? And whatever the problems are, could it be a design flaw or something?
 
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frequentflyer

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I've heard before that the Chargers don't perform very well in cold weather. What exactly is wrong with them in cold weather? And whatever the problems are, could it be a design flaw or something?
Teething problems, you can't simulate everything on a computer. The Genesis have been around for almost thirty years and they had plenty of teething problems when they debuted.
 

NSC1109

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I've heard before that the Chargers don't perform very well in cold weather. What exactly is wrong with them in cold weather? And whatever the problems are, could it be a design flaw or something?
frequentflyer hit it right on the head. Any new piece of equipment is gonna have teething issues. That’s why the Navy does shakedown cruises with new ships and after refits: to find and repair defects.
 

MikeM

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The P-42 are approaching over 30 years of service. The new locomotives will probably be required by Government regulations due to safety and environmental reasons not to mention the new cars will be more reliable and cost less to maintain so the P-42 will probably be phased out. But before that time when there is a mix of P-42 and new Locomotives they could use them to test service additions to see if they make sense rather than immediately phase them out. I have taken Amtrak trains when a headlight was cracked and we had to wait for a replacement locomotive though I don’t know if it was a P-42 or the earlier version at the time. But hopefully the new locomotives will be a lot easier to service and headlamps could be easily replaced in route by the crew as they schedule a place to stop the train. They should keep routine parts on hand such as windshield wipers, headlamps and the like so they can easily be serviced. The specifications for the Siemens indicate it should be easier to service and maintain.

The ones before the GE were the EMD apparently and I definitely remember those as well. I think when I had used Amtrak they were the EMD’s mostly and the GE were more reliable but hopefully Siemens will be even better. The new locomotives should have a ton of improvements from safety to environmental and everything else.

They say the P-42 will stay on the NEC routes. I guess that is for non electrified sections so it seems like they will need replacements for those eventually.
I'd love to see Amtrak retain some surge capacity of older equipment that could be pulled into service with new routes, seasonal expansion (think Christmas and Thanksgiving, sporting events, etc), much as the legacy railroads used to do in the pre-amtrak years. Older equipment that is fully depreciated could be stored in a decent climate, maybe even in a pole barn at the main shops, and pulled out for service as required. Less frequent use would prolong it's life and being paid for makes it a cheap expansion option for intermittent use.
 
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