Quantcast

Please Mr. Anderson (sleeping suites in coach?)

Help Support Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum:

cocojacoby

Lead Service Attendant
Joined
May 13, 2014
Messages
394
Dear Mr. Anderson,

Before you go please initiate a Delta One Suite program on Amtrak. We need this.
I will not sleep next to a stranger on a train ever again.
Thank you.

Delta One.jpg
 
Last edited by a moderator:

MikefromCrete

Conductor
Joined
Mar 24, 2009
Messages
2,631
Location
Crete, IL
Anderson is on his way out, he's long gone from Delta, so he's not in a position to do anything. While nice, this seating would probably cut the seating capacity of a coach in half, requiring a doubling of fares and doubling the size of the fleet. I kinda doubt we'll see anything like this on a system-wide basis.
 

cocojacoby

Lead Service Attendant
Joined
May 13, 2014
Messages
394
Not everyone has hundreds of dollars to buy a sleeper room. This is an enhanced overnight business class between coach and sleeper. It's a missing link in the accommodation chain. Amtrak's current business class is rather inconsistent and lacking in many ways. In my last Amtrak voyage I checked out the business class on the Auto Train* and really found no reason to pay extra for nothing. If this type of accommodation was available I would not have hesitated.

*No longer available.
 

jiml

Conductor
Joined
Feb 27, 2019
Messages
1,912
Location
Somewhere in Southern Ontario
If you looked at it as a "niche" product, it would be perfect for whatever they call the Night Owl now and the LSL. I don't see a fit on a larger scale vs. a roomette.
 

zephyr17

Conductor
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
4,050
Location
Washington State
Not everyone has hundreds of dollars to buy a sleeper room. This is an enhanced overnight business class between coach and sleeper. It's a missing link in the accommodation chain. Amtrak's current business class is rather inconsistent and lacking in many ways. In my last Amtrak voyage I checked out the business class on the Auto Train* and really found no reason to pay extra for nothing. If this type of accommodation was available I would not have hesitated.

*No longer available.
It appears to take up about the same space as a roomette with half the capacity. Since ultimately pricing is a reflection of capacity, in what way do you think something like this could be priced more cheaply?
 

brianpmcdonnell17

Conductor
Joined
Mar 5, 2016
Messages
1,416
Location
Chicago, Illinois
I like the idea of an intermediate between coach and a roomette, but this design isn't it as it takes up to much space. Returning to something similar to slumbercoaches with an open section design (allowing each bed to be sold) and meals not included could work, although I'm not confident it will ever happen. Currently, Viewliners have a capacity of 15-30, depending on whether the rooms have one or two occupants. Meanwhile, slumbercoaches could hold 40 and Amfleet IIs have a maximum capacity of 59.
 

Bob Dylan

Conductor
Joined
May 31, 2009
Messages
20,747
Location
Austin Texas
I like the idea of an intermediate between coach and a roomette, but this design isn't it as it takes up to much space. Returning to something similar to slumbercoaches with an open section design (allowing each bed to be sold) and meals not included could work, although I'm not confident it will ever happen. Currently, Viewliners have a capacity of 15-30, depending on whether the rooms have one or two occupants. Meanwhile, slumbercoaches could hold 40 and Amfleet IIs have a maximum capacity of 59.
Slumber Coaches and Sections are Great!( No Food/Drink included)
 

dlagrua

Conductor
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
Messages
3,154
Location
Hillsborough, NJ
Before suggesting something like this on Amtrak I would price the Delta one seat and see what it costs. Last years trip to Seattle we had to fly due to time reasons. We flew first class. The price : $1200 each ticket for one way.
I would agree that the one seat cubicle would be nice on Amtrak but if it took up an area of 2+ seats you might not want to pay the price. Since Amtrak has no plans to do a seating scheme like this and you do not wish to sit next to anyone, just purchase two seats-problem solved.
 

Dakota 400

Conductor
Joined
Mar 5, 2014
Messages
2,296
Maybe a return to the Slumbercoaches concept would be the best way to go.

Having enjoyed such a "Delta One" concept on a few Delta flights and one Singapore Airlines flight, it is surely better than Economy or Premium Economy seating. Being able to "sleep" in such a restricted space when one is not used to such is another thing. Having a seat belt strapped around me during the night is something that I have never been able to get used to. While I have had some "decent" sleep, most of my flights in this type of seats have been cat-naps at best.

It's the service, before boarding and inflight, and the additional "space" that makes such a booking worth it to me.
 

zephyr17

Conductor
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
4,050
Location
Washington State
Superliner sleepers have a sleeping capacity of 40 (13 revenue roomettes x 2, 5 bedrooms x 2, 1 handicapped room x 2, 1 family bedroom x 2 counting only the adult berths). Viewliners have a capacity of 30 (12 roomettes x 2, 2 bedrooms x 2, 1 handicapped room x 2).

The common 10-6 of the streamliner and heritage era has a capacity of only 22. Superliners and Viewliners already have nearly the approximate capacity of Slumbercoaches. The modern Amtrak roomette is essentially the same as a Slumbercoach double.

Budd slumbercoaches had a capacity 40, and most were subsequently reduced to a capacity of 36. The main reason Amtrak does not reach quite that capacity are the full bedrooms. All roomette cars would have Slumbercoach level capacities.

As far as the accommodations are concerned, modern Amtrak roomettes ARE Slumbercoach equivalents. And they were originally called and marketed as "economy bedrooms".

Get over the Slumbercoach thing folk
s, it is a phantom. There is only so much space, price is related.

Slumbercoaches were cheaper because of the higher capacity over then existing sleepers. Amtrak designs already incorporate that higher capacity.
 
Last edited:

cocojacoby

Lead Service Attendant
Joined
May 13, 2014
Messages
394
I would agree that the one seat cubicle would be nice on Amtrak but if it took up an area of 2+ seats you might not want to pay the price. Since Amtrak has no plans to do a seating scheme like this and you do not wish to sit next to anyone, just purchase two seats-problem solved.
I have actually heard stories of people who did exactly that but the conductor wouldn't allow them to take up two seats even though they paid for them. Need to hear people's experiences with this.
 

jiml

Conductor
Joined
Feb 27, 2019
Messages
1,912
Location
Somewhere in Southern Ontario
Having enjoyed such a "Delta One" concept on a few Delta flights and one Singapore Airlines flight, it is surely better than Economy or Premium Economy seating. Being able to "sleep" in such a restricted space when one is not used to such is another thing. Having a seat belt strapped around me during the night is something that I have never been able to get used to. While I have had some "decent" sleep, most of my flights in this type of seats have been cat-naps at best.

It's the service, before boarding and inflight, and the additional "space" that makes such a booking worth it to me.
Nailed it.
 

zephyr17

Conductor
Joined
Jul 22, 2009
Messages
4,050
Location
Washington State
Last edited:

IndyLions

Lead Service Attendant
Joined
Nov 6, 2016
Messages
358
Location
Brownsburg IN
Here’s a thought. On long haul trips (LSL, CS) sell an enhanced BC designed for better sleeping - maybe a extra foot of room with a better seat. Keep it at 2+1, but make the seats reserved & priced like bedrooms are - selling singles & doubles. The extra foot would cause Amtrak to lose a couple of rows - so pricing would need to go up. I’d guess a single would need to be up about 25% over existing BC. A double logically would cost twice as much. There would be no restriction on an individual purchasing a double if no singles are available.

A nicer seat designed for better sleeping, a guaranteed seating situation you are comfortable with, along with the already quieter environment of BC would be a pretty good option, in my opinion. Could you get a roomette for the same price? Maybe at low bucket, but as the lower roomette buckets fill up, this BC would look very attractive.
 

Ziv

OBS Chief
Joined
Oct 25, 2011
Messages
664
I agree with IndyLions, this could be very useful. It doesn't take up quite the same space as a roomette if it is done in a 1+2 layout, with a single seat on one side of the aisle and 2 seats on the other. Price it between a coach seat and a roomette. THAT is what business class ought to look like.
A "lay flat at an angle" seat is a huge improvement over a traditional coach seat, and given what the seat pitch is in coach, it wouldn't take any more room than is currently there. Roomettes at mid-bucket and high-bucket are a bit of a reach for most of us. A middle ground on pricing for a business LFAAA seat would be an attractive option for a lot of people and if there is a modest selection of them, they would probably book up fairly quickly. Make half the business class car Business Elite with LFAAA seats.
I know it won't happen, but it would be nice if it did.
 

tricia

Conductor
Joined
Aug 23, 2011
Messages
1,144
Location
Spring Creek, NC
An old thread on buying 2 seats uncovered this from the then current Service Manual ("Blue Book")

Basically, you can't buy two seats just to sit alone. If you do, the conductor doesn't really have to honor it. If you have a disability that requires it, or are so large as to need it, then yes you can buy two seats.

Doubt that the policy has changed.
Perhaps actually allowing passengers to buy two adjacent seats, at double the price, on long-distance trains would "fill the niche" for single passengers who don't want to sleep next to a stranger but find roomette prices too high. It's hard for me to see how this wouldn't be a win for Amtrak--same revenue for the number of seats, fewer passengers for staff to deal with.

There'd still be quite a gap between the cost of two coach seats and the cost of one person in a roomette.
 

sttom

OBS Chief
Joined
Jan 23, 2019
Messages
585
It would be nice to have a budget option, but I personally think a Delta One style seat could work as a business class product on long distance trains or as a First class product on day trains.

As for the pricing, you can fit 34 of them in the seating space of an Amfleet coach. A Viewliner can seat 30, assuming a maximum of 2 people per room. So there would be a higher potential number of riders.

As for pricing it, if you're not getting food and privacy, you're not going to be paying as much for it.

As for digging into sleeper revenue, would that really happen if there is only 1 car per train with these or sections and 2-3 sleepers? Amtrak doesn't seem to have an issue filling sleeper space and it does want to get more out of those in coach and get more people into trains in general. Since Amtrak lacks something like Delta One or a Section, it's revenue from my long distance trips is effectively $0. I would consider the train on some trips of this or a section was an option. And where there is one, there is more.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Ziv
Top