No. The original line into both Pensacola and Mobile from the north were built to connect the interior of Alabama to the Gulf ports. The line to Pensacola was built as a branch of the M&M (Montgomery and Mobile) out of Flomaton AL.
Wasn't the Gulf Wind actually a joint L&N and SAL operation? Afterall it ran on SAL East of Chattahoochee all the way to JAX, no?
Yes. It was Seaboard's replacement for the New Orleans - Florida Limited IIRC. As for the name for the new NOL - MOB service, I'd have to agree with others on here and go with Gulf Breeze.
I've noticed a lot of people saying that reintroduction of service east of Mobile is unlikely (not saying you are, but others), but I beg to differ. Within the past couple months, FDOT has released a preliminary plan for expanding passenger rail in Florida, and multiple representatives along the SP Line (MOB - JAX line) have expressed support for the return of service to the Florida Panhandle. Pensacola, Tallahassee, and Lake City are also on board as well. I would like to see the return of the Gulf Wind as a NOL - ORL train with thru cars to the SL and CNO (I may make a forum post about that at some point), with a state supported train running PNS - JAX. I was thinking that could be called the Apalachee Service. But I digress.
Yes, it was SAL east of Chattahoochee and the heavyweight Seaboard diner came off there. Until the late 60's it still had a sleeper and, until maybe 1964 or so, the observation that was built for the Crescent in the early 50's. One of the two in that service is still available for charter, Royal Street. I saw it in the early 60's in JAX and was quite envious of those riding it. I got my chance a few years later, but was in coach to Milton, FL and although it still had the sleeper, the observation was in seasonal service on the Florida Special. The train since the 50's was combined with either the Pan American or Piedmont Ltd. between Mobile and New Orleans.
So very true. But push comes to shove, it will provide an alternative to traveling either via Cary and Charlotte or via Washington DC, for traveling from Florida to New Orleans.
Didn't they basically say though the state doesn't want to fund it? That means the LD study is the only path forward - which even if the study recommended it then it has to get into legislation. The capital grants for LD routes can come from the IIJA but the operating subsidies would have to be added into Amtrak's annual appropriation.
The MOB - JAX service restoration places me in the "I will believe it when I see it" category of believers. If Florida funds any Amtrak service, it is more likely to fund intra-state service on the present Amtrak route a la the erstwhile Silver Palm V1.0, but even that falls in the category of "I'll believe it when I see it" category in my mind. Florida has not funded any Amtrak-like service in a couple of decades now. It has funded Commuter Service construction provided the local Counties agreed to take over all costs after three to five years of service inauguration. This includes all operating costs, not just station staffing and maintenance costs.
The answer is quite simple. Amtrak didn't want to. By 2005, Amtrak management's hostility to long distance services was already established. My understanding is CSX notified Amtrak they could resume operations about 6 months after Katrina.
mlanoue: Trying to stay on point with the thread here. Had almost forgotten about the Three Rivers. It was the very last heritage 10/6 sleeper I occupied on rails in the US. Was this train ultimately "doomed" due to a cancelled U S Postal Service contact??
That would make sense. From what I recall, at one point they had something like 6-7x daily trains from the East Coast to Chicago either on a proposed timetable or listed online. [1] Most of these were contract-oriented, since Amtrak wasn't acquiring new equipment (though I think they were trying to limp along with some 10-6s as long as possible). There were some other odds and ends proposed at the time (including service into Mexico).
At first, I think there were political and PR issues they didn't want to stir up by proceeding with official discontinuance, which would have gotten at least some coverage. Now it just may be inertia and letting sleeping dogs lie. In any case, they got what they wanted, dropped a long distance service at little to no regulatory or PR cost.
It’s definitely possible - LD routes can get grants for that for up front costs but they still have to get it added into operating grants.
It's worth remembering that even before Katrina, the Sunset Limited was the route that Congressional Amtrak critics targeted the most frequently. Those critics cited the financial losses and the abysmal timekeeping, and frequently used those issues to attack the entire system. Amtrak likely figured that "suspending" the route was the best political strategy,
I think that the "sleeping dogs lie" bit is definitely true...I think an effort to formally discontinue the service might, depending on the proverbial season, risk triggering anything from a forcible effort to reinstate service to a legislative ban on eliminating service in the future. They've come close in the past (e.g. the Southwest Chief fiasco), but I don't think it's a stretched that some cheesed-off Congresscritters could band together and just eliminate the discontinuation process for the LD system, either totally [just killing off the process] or effectively [making it onerous, or perhaps even illegal under various conditions - say, "As long as Amtrak's National Network funding appropriation exceeds X% of the avoidable losses for the LD routes as a whole, Amtrak may not apply to discontinue an LD train in part or in whole, and if Amtrak cannot publicly present a plausible version of that metric then they may not make that application" is the sort of thing I could see showing up in a bill].
What may return is corridor service, not a reinstatement of a 3 train a week service connecting Los Angeles and Orlando. I wouldn't think that he Sunset East would be particularly useful transportation even if the Sunset went daily, especially given the risk of serious delays on the eastbound train that's coming all the way in from LA. New Orleans to Jacksonville would make the most sense, but to really make the service competitive with driving, they'd probably need to build a lot of new trackage and a bridge across Mobile Bay to deal with the circuitous extra mileage of the current route.
I know, I am in complete agreement. Personally I feel that PNS - JAX should be served by a twice-daily service, while NOL - ORL should be served by a daily LD train with thru cars to the SL and CNO. As I've said before, I feel those trains should be called the Apalachee Service and Gulf Wind respectively.
I thought this was taken out as part of the Infrastructure Bill and replaced with serving the country or something?
