Southwest Chief derailment

[TinCan782]

Per CNN, the 2 troops were from Appleton, Wisconsin with 8 adult leaders. They were on their way back home for the Philmont Scout Ranch in New Mexico. None of them were hurt (thank goodness) and they assisted other passengers who needed help. National headquarters is trying to arrange transportation to get them home as soon as possible.

Nice article and interview here from WTMJ in Wisconsin.

Boy Scouts from Appleton on board Amtrak train when it derailed in Missouri, rendered aid to wounded

Scouts and chaperones from two Boy Scout troops based in Appleton, Wisconsin were on-board an Amtrak train when it derailed in Missouri on Monday

wtmj.com

 

[Cal]

Lacking equipment it would need to be 2 on, 2 off, 1 on, 2 off.

I’m confused by what you mean by this.

 

[The Chief]

Tight lock couplers prevented the couplers from climbing over each other and causing more damage. They prevent severe vertical displacement between the couplers as well as reducing the possibility of jackknifing

They reduced damage, not increased it.

Exactly. Part of design always has been to prevent the deadly "telescoping" of longtime years ago.

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

I was watching one of the videos of people onboard afterwards and I was impressed at how calm they were despite everything (not that I was expecting the Poseidon or anything). But impressive. They were packing up and seemed calm, if shaken, and helping each other to clean up.

One the crossings: of course the state pays, who owns and maintains the roads? From the brief description it seemed like more than just crossing arms, but an entire intersection redo was in the works.

 

[zetharion]

2 days train, 2 days no train, 1 day train, 2 days no train.

 

[Cal]

I was watching one of the videos of people onboard afterwards and I was impressed at how calm they were despite everything (not that I was expecting the Poseidon or anything). But impressive. They were packing up and seemed calm, if shaken, and helping each other to clean up.

One the crossings: of course the state pays, who owns and maintains the roads? From the brief description it seemed like more than just crossing arms, but an entire intersection redo was in the works.

Honestly that’s a little surprising to me, considering it seems to be a small crossing in the middle of nowhere

 

[zephyr17]

My understanding is that, as with drawbridges over waterways, much depends upon which came first: The highway or the railroad? Caveat: I Am Not A Lawyer.

Yeah, that is my understanding, too

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

Honestly that’s a little surprising to me, considering it seems to be a small crossing in the middle of nowhere

Here's what the article posted by Fenway said:

"However, MODOT's 2022 State Freight and Rail plan released in February listed the intersection at County Road 113 and Porche Prairie Road for installation of lights, and gates, and roadway improvements at the public crossing."

 

[AmtrakBlue]

BNSF made $6B last year. Why should the state (aka state tax-holders) be responsible?

Because the railroad was there before the roads (just my guess). These are farm roads, not state roads, so maybe the farmers should be responsible.

 

[zephyr17]

Because the railroad was there before the roads (just my guess). These are farm roads, not state roads, so maybe the farmers should be responsible.

Well, it shows as a county road, not a private road, even though it serves farms in the area. County has it.

 

[Willbridge]

Here's what the article posted by Fenway said:

"However, MODOT's 2022 State Freight and Rail plan released in February listed the intersection at County Road 113 and Porche Prairie Road for installation of lights, and gates, and roadway improvements at the public crossing."

I can't speak to this one, but every crossing has a history. Few states had a State Rail Plan until 1976 and then the 4-R act provided federal funds.

Often county roads on the survey grid in the West predate the later railways, keeping in mind that the Santa Fe built this relatively "modern" line to be the shortest diagonal between Kansas City and Chicago. So, some may want the railway to pay. But, there may have been a modern increase in road traffic on it. That turns out to be a common story, and it argues for the local government or state to contribute. County commissioners or city councils like the revenue from development, but usually do not think of side effects unless an angry neighbor testifies. It takes a while to work things out when there is a new situation.

I've only been in one grade crossing accident. It was in Indiana, on the Cardinal, and visibility for the garbage truck driver and the engineer was excellent. The truck driver changed his mind at the last minute, and we just clipped his truck. No one was killed. However, this was another county road that now led to a garbage dump and at some point, that increased its traffic. I'm sure when the Monon was built that they did not anticipate that.

 

[NSC1109]

BNSF made $6B last year. Why should the state (aka state tax-holders) be responsible?

because it’s their road.

 

[DeepChillWolf]

On a practical note, is Amtrak not already facing a serious shortage of usable SuperLiner equipment?

I'm curious to know how other trains that use superliner equipment will be affected by this accident. Will we be seeing less service (such as tri-weekly) on some routes, or perhaps shorter train consists? It's already bad enough that the Texas Eagle runs on a reduced service with only four cars and no sightseer lounge. Would it be possible for them to transfer some amfleets over to the western pool once the Siemens Venture cars are in service?

 

[Tk48states]

I was just inthis area last fall, the crash site is on the BNSF’s Marceline Sub, a very busy high speed double track railroad diagonally across Missouri from Fort Madison Iowa to Kansas City, it was built by the Santa Fe in late 19’thcentury as an airline deliberately missing populated areas on a straight line between Chicago and KC.
The BNSF maintains it for passenger train speeds up to 90mph and freights 70. The area around Mendon is flat open country with long straight tangents of heavily ballasted 136 lb welded rail. This is very rural farm country but the residents are well aware of the 60-70 highspeed trains mostly intermodal passing through daily, CTC controls all movements. Will be interesting to find out the identity of the driver and the type of company involved.. As a lawyer my second thought in this type of accident is how much money damages are involved and the answer in this one will be in the hundreds of millions when personal injury claims are added. Only the very largest national trucking companies have enough liability coverage to survive this kind of catastrophic event.

 

[Cal]

because it’s their road.

They own the road? What? DO you mean it's their crossing?

I'm curious to know how other trains that use superliner equipment will be affected by this accident. Will we be seeing less service (such as tri-weekly) on some routes, or perhaps shorter train consists? It's already bad enough that the Texas Eagle runs on a reduced service with only four cars and no sightseer lounge. Would it be possible for them to transfer some amfleets over to the western pool once the Siemens Venture cars are in service?

I doubt it, they only lost one set.

 

[NSC1109]

They own the road? What? DO you mean it's their crossing?


I doubt it, they only lost one set.

The railroad lets them cross there. If the locals want to upgrade the warning devices, they’re paying for it. I believe it’s based on the amount of traffic that the road sees.

Do we know if the fatalities on board were crew or passengers?

 

[Willbridge]

The AP story describes details that help to understand this, so it's worth a read. However, it finishes up with the traditional wire service paragraphs itemizing past accidents without explaining whether they were related or not. The BBC did that, too, concluding with a 2018 accident. When I was news director on college radio I asked my announcers to trim those paragraphs off and get on to actual news.

3 killed, dozens hurt in Amtrak train crash in Missouri

MENDON, Mo. (AP) — An Amtrak passenger train traveling from Los Angeles to Chicago struck a dump truck Monday in a remote area of Missouri, killing three people and injuring dozens more as rail cars tumbled off the tracks and landed on their sides, officials said.

apnews.com

 

[joelkfla]

Angry farmer talks about efforts to get crossing improvements:

 

[Rover]

...and some people will still try to beat out the train....

Bty,
How do other countries, including China handle rail crossings in remote, rural areas??

 

[coventry801]

People are going to want every crossing to have arms, bells, and whistles.

How about drivers just have some common sense?

I thought all crossings would have I've always treated rails without signals as abandoned

BNSF made $6B last year. Why should the state (aka state tax-holders) be responsible?

Vanguard being the biggest stock holder I believe. Greedy Wall street

 

[billosborn]

Angry farmer talks about efforts to get crossing improvements:

sadly, at first glance, based on what this farmer said, it appears that the failure to upgrade the crossing were due to bureaucracy on either the part of the railroad or the county.

 

[zephyr17]

If BNSF has a crossing they deem too dangerous, and local authorities do nothing about it, they have the option of closing the crossing.

 

[west point]

Is that the remains of a block signal destroyed?

 

[billosborn]

I just read that today's (6/28) #3 SWC will depart from Kansas City, not Chicago. I know that Amtrak is busy trying to get all the passengers on the derailed train to their final destinations - but in cases like this, are the folks who are booked from Chicago on the #3 on their own as far as getting to KCY by 10.30 pm tonight to catch the #3 to Los Angeles?

 

[John819]

I'm curious to know how other trains that use superliner equipment will be affected by this accident. Will we be seeing less service (such as tri-weekly) on some routes, or perhaps shorter train consists? It's already bad enough that the Texas Eagle runs on a reduced service with only four cars and no sightseer lounge. Would it be possible for them to transfer some amfleets over to the western pool once the Siemens Venture cars are in service?

Remember that the cars involved will (irrespective of the damage sustained) be out of service until (a) released by the NTSB and (b) released by the Amtrak legal department (usually after all lawsuits are resolved).

If there is an immediate need for more Superliner equipment, perhaps the CL could be converted to Amfleet II / Viewliner equipment?