Vancouver-Portland HSR proposed

[Anderson]

I thought that it would mostly be MIA-WPB? From WPB onwards I've been under the impression that service would be pretty close to 110 MPH most of the way.

Also as another thought...stops on the Cascades lines may only be every 30 miles or so, but at the moment on AAF you're looking at a gap of over 150 miles WPB-Orlando (and technically an average distance between stops of 80 miles...though again, the distances are more like 40-40-160 or something like that). Granted, AAF will likely add some stops over time, but not even the most express Acela has that few stops.

There are long stretched of 90mph or less through areas like Melbourne, Rockledge etc. Lots and lots of pesky little curves, and in places a grade crossing every 200 yards and such.

Ok, remind me...what are the rules regarding grade crossings and top speeds? I know that AAF is closing a bunch of crossings, but I thought there was a way that you could have a grade crossing in 110-125 MPH territory?

 

[jis]

Grade crossing is not as much an issue as curves. You cannot have any practically manageable grade crossing above 110mph. It requires solid barriers like you see at the entrances to embassies and secure areas of airports. This has been discussed elsewhere on AU. Trust me no one will ever go through the trouble of managing such an unwieldy piece of thing. I don't think AAF will run at 125 mph anywhere on the classic FEC in the foreseeable future, and they have never expressed any intention to do so. They are more focused on end to end times than max speed anyway.

They actually will be very hard pressed to shut down any significant crossings in Melbourne/Palm Bay/Rockledge area. Mostly there are on semi-important roads. I don't think they will. At least their EIS does not say they will close down any of the significant crossings. They talk about upgrading them to eliminate whistle blowing and also committed to carry a significant part of the cost of doing so at least to Brevard County in exchange for getting the vote of the Commissioners on the bond issue rule change.

BTW, perhaps we should move some of this Florida stuff to the FEC thread. This has nothing to do with Pacific Northwest.

 

[Bus Nut]

BC is on board with HSR if someone else is paying for it.

BC could do a lot to improve speeds on their conventional rail on the Canadian side. They haven't, but they ought to because it would be good for the region. I for one have made a couple of trips to Vancouver that never would have happened without an Amtrak link. Just wouldn't have happened. I brought friends, too.

 

[neroden]

Grade crossing is not as much an issue as curves. You cannot have any practically manageable grade crossing above 110mph. It requires solid barriers like you see at the entrances to embassies and secure areas of airports. This has been discussed elsewhere on AU. Trust me no one will ever go through the trouble of managing such an unwieldy piece of thing.

Actually, I expect some rail owners will, but only for specialized private-crossing access -- where the private crossing is required by law for coastal property access, and where it's not remotely worth building a bridge due to low usage. Such crossings will stay closed 99% of the time and open only on advance notice, a bit like drawbridge raises.

 

[neroden]

BC is on board with HSR if someone else is paying for it.

BC could do a lot to improve speeds on their conventional rail on the Canadian side. They haven't, but they ought to because it would be good for the region. I for one have made a couple of trips to Vancouver that never would have happened without an Amtrak link. Just wouldn't have happened. I brought friends, too.

The biggest single improvement possible on the Vancouver BC - Seattle route is a bypass of White Rock (along highway 99), but neither Canada nor BC nor the localities has lifted a finger.

 

[CHamilton]

The biggest single improvement possible on the Vancouver BC - Seattle route is a bypass of White Rock (along highway 99), but neither Canada nor BC nor the localities has lifted a finger.

Actually, it was reported at yesterday's All Aboard Washington meeting that the Canadians are proceeding with a study of just such a bypass. Of course, it's a long way between a study and changes actually happening.

 

[Palmetto]

I find it interesting that the Southern end of this federally- designated HighSpeed Rail Corridor [Eugene-Portland] has been left out of the proposal. Sort of meshes with what the state government thinks about service south of Portland, and their proposal to fund it a lower level than in previous years.

 

[jis]

Grade crossing is not as much an issue as curves. You cannot have any practically manageable grade crossing above 110mph. It requires solid barriers like you see at the entrances to embassies and secure areas of airports. This has been discussed elsewhere on AU. Trust me no one will ever go through the trouble of managing such an unwieldy piece of thing.

Actually, I expect some rail owners will, but only for specialized private-crossing access -- where the private crossing is required by law for coastal property access, and where it's not remotely worth building a bridge due to low usage. Such crossings will stay closed 99% of the time and open only on advance notice, a bit like drawbridge raises.

That's possible I suppose, but I will believe it when I see one actually come into being.

Incidentally the rules for drawbridges on the NEC between Guildford CT and New London CT is that the bridges remain open for boat traffic and they are closed only when a train is approaching. Rich boat owners have amazing amount of political clout in Connecticut. Similar rules also apply to the drawbridges on the North Jersey Coast Line, specially the lower end of it, of NJ Transit in NJ.

 

[neroden]

Actually, it was reported at yesterday's All Aboard Washington meeting that the Canadians are proceeding with a study of just such a bypass. Of course, it's a long way between a study and changes actually happening.

Late followup, but which levels of government are funding the study?

We might see some followthrough at the federal level if Mulcair wins the election (Harper has had very consistently anti-passenger-rail policies, so anyone else would be an improvement).

British Columbia won't have elections until 2017; it is basically contested between the provincial Liberals and the provincial NDP. The Liberals were responsible for the BC Rail selloff-to-cronies scandal, after promising not to sell it off, so they're completely untrustworthy on rail. The NDP didn't do much for passenger rail when they were in power either, though I think that's better than getting involved in a major criminal corruption scandal.

 

[neroden]

That's possible I suppose, but I will believe it when I see one actually come into being.

"Locked & gated" crossings, opened only on special occasions (maybe one or two times a year) by prior arrangement, are more common than one might think. I can probably find some on HSR lines in other countries...