Viewliner II - Part 1 - Initial Production and Delivery

Help Support Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum:

Status
Not open for further replies.

dlagrua

Conductor
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
Messages
3,106
The last report that I've heard stated delivery of the Viewliner II's beginning in Q1 13. Here we are at the end of Q2 and we should be getting close. Time for discussion to begin again. Anyone hear anything?
 

VentureForth

Conductor
Joined
Jan 23, 2007
Messages
5,847
Last time you brought that up, wasn't the concensus that the earliest we would see the Viewliner IIs would be October, but early 2014 was more realistic? ;)
 

dlagrua

Conductor
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
Messages
3,106
We are now at the end of Q2 13. Time for discussion to begin again. Anyone hear anything?
 

Cho Cho Charlie

Conductor
Joined
Apr 9, 2009
Messages
2,143
The last report that I've heard stated delivery of the Viewliner II's beginning in Q1 13. Here we are at the end of Q2 and we should be getting close. Time for discussion to begin again. Anyone hear anything?
We are now at the end of Q2 13. Time for discussion to begin again. Anyone hear anything?

Last time you brought that up, wasn't the concensus that the earliest we would see the Viewliner IIs would be October, but early 2014 was more realistic? ;)
I agree with VentureForth.
 
N

Nebulous Abyss

Guest
Why do you suppose the matter is kept so opaque? No pictures of semi completed cars, so explanation of delays, no factory views of the new interrior rooms... arn't WE railfans the best costomers Amtrak and CAF have? Shouldn't we be sold some SIZZLE!?!?!? Where's the excitment, the salesmanship?

I get inundated with American Airlines commercials every time I turn on Bloomburg.... and I doubt any of that stuff about new roomier planes is true anyway. The new viewliners howeve seem to have real potential, but what is up with all the secrecy. Sell the sizzle, sell the new cars, and sell out the tickets!

Ok, I'll settle down now... play the chirping crickets.
 

Ryan

Conductor
Joined
Apr 14, 2008
Messages
17,017
Couple issues with that.

1) We've seen pictures of semi completed cars.

2) We've seen pictures of the new interiors.

3) What good would promotion do now? It's not possible to buy a ticket today to ride a train that will have one of these cars.
 

dlagrua

Conductor
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
Messages
3,106
We will see no Viewliner II's in 2013. Per the CAF website, delivery is now in 2014. That probably means 12/20//14 just in time for Christmas. If it keeps going like this why before you know it delivery will be 2015.
 

afigg

Conductor
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
5,896
We will see no Viewliner II's in 2013. Per the CAF website, delivery is now in 2014. That probably means 12/20//14 just in time for Christmas. If it keeps going like this why before you know it delivery will be 2015.
There is nothing inconsistent with the CAF website statement with what Amtrak stated in January in their 2013 preview news release: "The delivery of the first four of the eight test pilot cars are due late in 2013 with the first units expected to be placed into service late spring 2014."

The first 4 cars may be turned over to Amtrak late in 2013, but the ramp-up of production to begin to deliver cars for revenue service would be 2014. depends on how "delivery" is defined. Of course, if a problem is found during the testing of the first 4 units, the production run would be delayed.

On the other hand, if the FY2014 funding from Congress is badly cut, Amtrak may have to postpone or cancel part of the order. I don't expect that would happen, but given the toxic political environment in the House, can't entirely be ruled out.
 

VentureForth

Conductor
Joined
Jan 23, 2007
Messages
5,847
What I don't understand is the need to retest. Aren't the shell and trucks already certified? I thought only the interior modules were new.
 

dlagrua

Conductor
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
Messages
3,106
There is nothing inconsistent with the CAF website statement with what Amtrak stated in January in their 2013 preview news release:
But isn't it inconsistent with the announcement by Amtrak at the time the original order was placed?
 

afigg

Conductor
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
5,896
There is nothing inconsistent with the CAF website statement with what Amtrak stated in January in their 2013 preview news release:
But isn't it inconsistent with the announcement by Amtrak at the time the original order was placed?
It is pretty obvious that there has been a major schedule slip since the order was placed with CAF in 2010 for various reasons. I was quoting what Amtrak stated in January 2013. The question is whether there has been any additional delays or schedule slips since then. We may not find out until the first 4 units are rolled out in a dog and pony show - whenever that happens.
 

afigg

Conductor
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
5,896
What I don't understand is the need to retest. Aren't the shell and trucks already certified? I thought only the interior modules were new.
These are cars from a new manufacturer and production run. There are undoubtedly many small differences and changes in the design and equipment from the original Viewliners built back in 1990s. A set of cars will have to go to Colorado to be put through their paces.

All of the cars will have to undergo a thorough inspection and an acceptance test procedure, and do test runs, presumably on the NEC before they are cleared for revenue service. Between the ACS-64s and Viewliner IIs, there are likely to be many late night sightings on the NEC over the next 2-3 years of deadhead trains of new equipment passing through stations.
 

Acela150

Conductor
Joined
Jan 11, 2008
Messages
8,733
There is nothing inconsistent with the CAF website statement with what Amtrak stated in January in their 2013 preview news release:
But isn't it inconsistent with the announcement by Amtrak at the time the original order was placed?
Sure. But aren't most ordered delayed?
For sure they are! Ask Septa and the MBTA how their orders with Hyundai Rotem are going? Rotem's first order in the U.S. was Metrolink followed by Septa's new Silverliner V's. Septa is getting these cars at well over 50% off, due to the "Penalty Clause" in the contract, which was $250 per car, per day. The very last SL V was delivered earlier this Spring. 5-6 years behind schedule. No Joke.. And shortly before the last SL V delivery, the MBTA got their first car which was scheduled to roll off the line in 2008.. 5 years behind schedule. The MBTA seriously considered canceling the contract with Rotem. They should have too. Rotem's workmanship is the worst I have EVER yes, that's EVER, seen. The welds on the SL V's look like someone who has never welded before made the weld. And on top of that their has been some serious, serious labor issues at the Rotem plant in South Philadelphia. Complaints of harassment, sexual harassment, and from what the local papers have said the majority of the employees and paid so low that they have to use food stamps, and were hired with NO experience. When one inquires about taking tours of their plant they are quickly turned down with a small handful being able to tour the plant.
 

trainviews

Service Attendant
Joined
Apr 24, 2011
Messages
240
There is nothing inconsistent with the CAF website statement with what Amtrak stated in January in their 2013 preview news release:
But isn't it inconsistent with the announcement by Amtrak at the time the original order was placed?
Sure. But aren't most ordered delayed?
For sure they are! Ask Septa and the MBTA how their orders with Hyundai Rotem are going? Rotem's first order in the U.S. was Metrolink followed by Septa's new Silverliner V's. Septa is getting these cars at well over 50% off, due to the "Penalty Clause" in the contract, which was $250 per car, per day. The very last SL V was delivered earlier this Spring. 5-6 years behind schedule. No Joke.. And shortly before the last SL V delivery, the MBTA got their first car which was scheduled to roll off the line in 2008.. 5 years behind schedule. The MBTA seriously considered canceling the contract with Rotem. They should have too. Rotem's workmanship is the worst I have EVER yes, that's EVER, seen. The welds on the SL V's look like someone who has never welded before made the weld. And on top of that their has been some serious, serious labor issues at the Rotem plant in South Philadelphia. Complaints of harassment, sexual harassment, and from what the local papers have said the majority of the employees and paid so low that they have to use food stamps, and were hired with NO experience. When one inquires about taking tours of their plant they are quickly turned down with a small handful being able to tour the plant.
Well try to google "fyra" or "IC4" and just rejoice that nobody in America got the idea of buying an italian train (IC4 is running almost 10 years late now, and most of the dellivered train sets are out of service due to poor quality, Fyra has been banned from the tracks in Belgium and the order cancelled)
 
N

Nathanael

Guest
I wonder if they're still having trouble with the carshells. Remember there was a delay which appears to have been due to CAF's difficulty hiring welders who were able to work with stainless steel (which requires specialized welding techniques). If that hasn't been fully sorted out yet, that could account for a lot of delays -- we could have interiors ready to go and Amtrak might not be satisfied with workmanship on the carshells. After some of the carshell horror stories which people just shared about various commuter rail orders...
 

jis

Conductor
AU Lifetime Supporter
Gathering Team Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2003
Messages
25,646
When one inquires about taking tours of their plant they are quickly turned down with a small handful being able to tour the plant.
I have taken a tour of the plant arranged by DVARP in collaboration with SEPTA last year. Did not hear that they had any problem arranging it, but then again I did not ask specifically either.
Also, I have recently heard from usually reliable sources that two each of Sleeper, Diner and Bag pre production run cars will be out for testing in late fall this year. But of course ones mileage on these whispers from usually reliable sources may vary a bit. :)

The delay may partially have to do with Amtrak's ability to pay for them too I suppose.

Incidentally it was CAF that fabricated all the cars for Heathrow Express service in the UK, and they appear to be fine cars to me, having ridden them many times.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

jis

Conductor
AU Lifetime Supporter
Gathering Team Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2003
Messages
25,646
Or at least produces an alarming amount of smoke. But then I am sure that will happen sooner or later with an overheated bearing or a broken coffee pot, even the new tech coffee pot, or someone dozing off while smoking against the regulations. :) AFAIK there are no LI-Ion batteries except for the ones in everyone's i-Devices and laptops and other mobile devices.
 
2
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top