Western Canada forest fires

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A friend, and AU member, was on the westbound Canadian that was stopped in Edmonton Saturday due to the fires. The passengers were flown from Edmonton to Vancouver.
 
Was on train #2 that arrived in Toronto today (May 9th). It did Not originate in Vancouver, but started in Edmonton (a turned train #1). i boarded Sunday evening in Winnipeg (after doing Churchill). Only 16 sleeper class and zero prestige class passengers (plus some coach passengers). Passengers that would have been on my train from Vancouver were supposedly flown. The Park car was available for the entire time To sleepper class. 1 meal sitting.
 
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This is really shocking. Not so long ago, fire season was late summer, then expanded to earlier in the summer, and now, early May??
 
It's about a five hour bus ride from Jasper to Edmonton, not too bad. I hope the Sleeper and Prestige class people that were flown from Edmonton got a hefty refund in addition to their airplane ride.

From that Canada train board, sounds like an evolving situation.
One thing I don't understand is what's the difference between the rail line and the highway, as they are pretty close at spots, and both are in heavily forested areas. I have guesses but will wait to learn more.

West of Edson in 1984.
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One thing I don't understand is what's the difference between the rail line and the highway, as they are pretty close at spots, and both are in heavily forested areas. I have guesses but will wait to learn more.

West of Edson in 1984.
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If there is one vehicle with which I definitely wouldn’t want to enter a wildfire area, it would be a train: Can‘t just turn around, can‘t just take a detour…
 
If there is one vehicle with which I definitely wouldn’t want to enter a wildfire area, it would be a train: Can‘t just turn around, can‘t just take a detour…
Rode through a huge thunderstorm in Kansas and saw three small funnel clouds from the SSL. None touched down, and were a long way away, but still...
 
Can't find the original thread but there were reports last week of the Canadian busstituting and planestituting because of the Western Canada fires. I wondered at the time if sleeping car passengers (and especially Prestige) received a refund for their relatively high fares, given the loss of scenery. They did get to their destination, but not exactly what they were hoping for. Did anyone ever hear if they were compensated?
 
I was on that train #1 on May 5-6 Canadian. We arrived in Edmonton on Friday evening amid some smoke and fires in the countryside. We were told that the line to Jasper might be closed soon. We stayed in the yards overnight and next morning it was determined that our train would be cancelled. Those going to Vancouver would be flown via Air Canada sometime on Saturday. Took all day to make arrangements and buses took us to airport. A group going to Jasper and Kamloops would be bused at some point. A very disappointing end to our cross country voyage (not seeing the best part of scenery in Canadian Rockies. After a chaotic time at the airport we finally boarded and made the 1.5 hour trip to Vancouver airport. VIA had previously told us we could arrange an extra day at our Hampton in Vancouver, which I called and arranged. But after landing the VIA official said we had to stay at their pre arranged hotel. That was not nice. We had already committed to the stay at Hampton and VIA now says they would not pay Hilton. So we got a cab $40 AND the $275C for an extra night in Vancouver that was supposed to be on a train.... We have been gone since then on cruise in Alaska and a nice ride on the EB 8 coming back to Ohio so have not had a conversation with VIA about compensation, at least for missed Rockies part of Canadian, which was an expensive bucket list item for us old folks. They have been nice in the past and hope we will get some refund for the extra costs and cancelled train trip. I heard they were only offering credit for future VIA trips but that doesnt work for those of us who are not Canadian and have limited ride opportunities. Will try to call them Friday to see what they say.
 
I was on that train #1 on May 5-6 Canadian. We arrived in Edmonton on Friday evening amid some smoke and fires in the countryside. We were told that the line to Jasper might be closed soon. We stayed in the yards overnight and next morning it was determined that our train would be cancelled. Those going to Vancouver would be flown via Air Canada sometime on Saturday. Took all day to make arrangements and buses took us to airport. A group going to Jasper and Kamloops would be bused at some point. A very disappointing end to our cross country voyage (not seeing the best part of scenery in Canadian Rockies. After a chaotic time at the airport we finally boarded and made the 1.5 hour trip to Vancouver airport. VIA had previously told us we could arrange an extra day at our Hampton in Vancouver, which I called and arranged. But after landing the VIA official said we had to stay at their pre arranged hotel. That was not nice. We had already committed to the stay at Hampton and VIA now says they would not pay Hilton. So we got a cab $40 AND the $275C for an extra night in Vancouver that was supposed to be on a train.... We have been gone since then on cruise in Alaska and a nice ride on the EB 8 coming back to Ohio so have not had a conversation with VIA about compensation, at least for missed Rockies part of Canadian, which was an expensive bucket list item for us old folks. They have been nice in the past and hope we will get some refund for the extra costs and cancelled train trip. I heard they were only offering credit for future VIA trips but that doesnt work for those of us who are not Canadian and have limited ride opportunities. Will try to call them Friday to see what they say.
What hotel did VIA want to put you in?

$315 CAD seems a bit skimpy in terms of compensation. A Cabin for 2 Edmonton-Vancouver peak season undiscounted is over $3700 CAD including taxes (couldn't find peak season discount Cabin for 2 inventory, but I don't think it would be much less than $3K CAD). Granted they flew you to Vancouver, but less than 10% of the actual Sleeper Plus fare seems a steep premium for a flight (which I assume wasn't in First Class).

I heard they bustituted at least some passengers to Jasper and put them back on the train 2 consist they turned around. They had to run it back to Vancouver in any case. The only intermediate stop of any importance between Jasper and Vancouver is Kamloops. All the rest are flag stops the the train usually just goes right by, although most of time I've taken it, although it usually does stop at Valemount. I take it you weren't presented an option to be bustituted to the reversing train, just the flight.

I'd definitely talk to them, I think you are owed quite a bit more money. While I have a reasonable amount of experience dealing with Amtrak in cancellation situations, I don't with VIA so don't have a feel for how they handle such things. The closest parallel in my experience I can think was during the aftermath of the Gogama oil train derailment several years ago. They didn't run the Canadian east of Winnipeg for several months, even though CN had a shoofly open and was operating. I had a trip scheduled and hoped it would go through, it was several months after the actual derailment. But I also bought a fully refundable WestJet Winnipeg-Toronto ticket as Plan B. If the train went through, I'd just get the ticket refunded. Well, it turned out I needed Plan B. I already knew the train wasn't going all the way through, but when I checked in at Vancouver they told me, and gave me the option of cancelling entirely with a full refund, or going through to Winnipeg with about half my fare refunded, but VIA wouldn't take any responsibility for anything in Winnipeg or transportation to Toronto. Since I had Plan B in place, I went ahead and rode the train. Which was a great ride, BTW. There was hardly anyone on it.
 
What hotel did VIA want to put you in?

$315 CAD seems a bit skimpy in terms of compensation. A Cabin for 2 Edmonton-Vancouver peak season undiscounted is over $3700 CAD including taxes (couldn't find peak season discount Cabin for 2 inventory, but I don't think it would be much less than $3K CAD). Granted they flew you to Vancouver, but less than 10% of the actual Sleeper Plus fare seems a steep premium for a flight (which I assume wasn't in First Class).
How much an Edmonton-Vancouver ticket costs is irrelevant for the question of how much VIA should refund for having been forced to terminate the journey in Edmonton. What matters is the difference between what the passenger was charged and what the same journey would have cost terminating in Edmonton. For instance, when I look up an undiscounted Cabin for 2 (single Occupancy, incl. taxes) fare for the next departure of Train 1 (i.e. this Wednesday), the pricetag for Toronto-Edmonton is approximately two-thirds of Toronto-Vancouver ($3300 vs $4900). I would therefore expect a refund of approximately one-third of the fare I paid, minus whatever a last-minute flight from Edmonton to Vancouver might have cost me…
 
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I was on that train #1 on May 5-6 Canadian. We arrived in Edmonton on Friday evening amid some smoke and fires in the countryside. We were told that the line to Jasper might be closed soon. We stayed in the yards overnight and next morning it was determined that our train would be cancelled. Those going to Vancouver would be flown via Air Canada sometime on Saturday. Took all day to make arrangements and buses took us to airport. A group going to Jasper and Kamloops would be bused at some point. A very disappointing end to our cross country voyage (not seeing the best part of scenery in Canadian Rockies. After a chaotic time at the airport we finally boarded and made the 1.5 hour trip to Vancouver airport. VIA had previously told us we could arrange an extra day at our Hampton in Vancouver, which I called and arranged. But after landing the VIA official said we had to stay at their pre arranged hotel. That was not nice. We had already committed to the stay at Hampton and VIA now says they would not pay Hilton. So we got a cab $40 AND the $275C for an extra night in Vancouver that was supposed to be on a train.... We have been gone since then on cruise in Alaska and a nice ride on the EB 8 coming back to Ohio so have not had a conversation with VIA about compensation, at least for missed Rockies part of Canadian, which was an expensive bucket list item for us old folks. They have been nice in the past and hope we will get some refund for the extra costs and cancelled train trip. I heard they were only offering credit for future VIA trips but that doesnt work for those of us who are not Canadian and have limited ride opportunities. Will try to call them Friday to see what they say.
Hoping VIA is kind to yall( they usually are) and gives you a nice refund!

We're looking forward to hearing about yalls trip, both the Train and the Cruise Journeys, and any pics you took!
 
We've gotten lucky with almost no smoke until this last week. The communities along the CN rail line are mostly back at home and I believe there is only a few hot spots left. Minimal structural damage as well within those certain areas. Hopefully things get better from here.
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We've gotten lucky with almost no smoke until this last week. The communities along the CN rail line are mostly back at home and I believe there is only a few hot spots left. Minimal structural damage as well within those certain areas. Hopefully things get better from here.
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We're getting some of that Smoke( Haze) down here in Central Texas now that a Norther Blew through and the Sun is out !
 
Hoping VIA is kind to yall( they usually are) and gives you a nice refund!

We're looking forward to hearing about yalls trip, both the Train and the Cruise Journeys, and any pics you took!
Update on my VIA Canadian 1 trip that was cancelled on May 6. I received a nice note from VIA Customer Service. They will refund $923 US for the cancelled trip and $211 US for the hotel costs to my CC. I was satisfied with this since it was about 25% of what we paid for the trip and the entire cost of the hotel. I expect this cancellation cost the railroad big $$ since they paid for plane tickets and hotels for most of the passengers, bus tickets for others. Never found out whether they turned both trains around. Our crew rode the plane to Vancouver with us so there needed to be some crews added on both ends? Anyway, we did get some money back and hope someday we may get to see the Canadian Rockies on another trip. Maybe fly to Edmonton and ride the route to Vancouver in off season.
 
A brief synopsis of our trip on the Canadian 1 from Toronto to Edmonton follows here.
Wednesday May 3. Toronto & Canadian Shield

After a restful sleep, we prepared baggage and I went out to find some breakfast to tide us over until we reached the station where there was a Tim Hortons. The Subway did not open until 8am so I tried another deli place and found some breakfast sandwiches and drinks. Back to the hotel and sadly, the sandwiches were stale and not up to quality. Moved downstairs and waited in the lobby while I contacted Lyft for a ride to Union Station. The first contact failed to show up in 8 minutes and the AP switched to another driver, who also did not show up. First time for a negative experience using Lyft drivers. We were now running late and I hailed a cab on the street and we loaded luggage for a 15 minute ride to the train station. When we unloaded, I immediately noticed that my CPap machine was not in the cab. Terror ensued. We only had 10 minutes to check our bags and after check-in in the First Class Lounge, I called the hotel and their security quickly located my Cpap bag on the seat in the lobby. They secured the bag, gave me a control number, but I did not have enough time to return to the hotel to retrieve it. I did manage to get our large bags checked at the baggage area and we had to go to boarding gate soon after. Not happy with Lyft and my lack of concentration that led to this unfortunate problem. We moved to our boarding gate and were met by friendly VIA staff who guided us to our Car 111, Room B. on Canadian Train 1. We had a cabin for 2, which had larger space than an Amtrak roomette/bedroom and did have a private bathroom. Two leather chairs that would later be covered by beds from the wall. Bags with towels, soap were available. The shower is at the end of the hall and was quite spacious. Our car attendant was Eric, who was on an extra board and learning some ropes, so Jessica from dining car came to our room and went over functions and some rules of the road. She was very nice and we saw her several times in the diner for our meals. Our train left on time at 9:55am as we slowly moved away from the station, past the CN Tower and many GO Trains moving in and out. We eventually made a backup move and then north out of Toronto. Our dining times were assigned and we first moved to the diner for lunch at 1pm. We met an interesting couple originally from Tanzania & Kenya who now lived in Canada. Raji and Sahari were struggling a bit with language barriers and their dietary restrictions. We found out later that Raji was not feeling well and would later need some medical attention. Our meal was excellent with Jessica and Jesse as servers. Pasta salad, pulled pork sandwiches, chocolate ice cream were the highlights.

The Canadian is an interesting train, traveling through many small towns that can be flag stops if anyone needs a ride. The government approved the continuation of the train on condition that it would serve people in the rural areas of Canada. The rocky terrain, lakes and forests of the Canadian Shield region was the highlight of the first two days. Beautiful scenery as we went up to our Skyline observation car to see the terrain. Bobby was our Skyline dome car attendant and he was humorous and gave some history of the region. Hors d’oeuvres and snacks were available. We stopped at Washago around noon, Parry Sound around 3pm, (a beautiful view of the lake and cottages from a trestle bridge, Sudbury Jct. around 5 and Capreol at 6pm where crews changed and engines refueled. All of the Manor Cars are named after famous Canadians. Our car was name Burton for a General Ralph Burton who commanded British forces at Louisbourg in 1750s. We visited this French fort in Nova Scotia on our cruise last fall.

See photos of the Canadian Shield, lakes, rock formations and forests. Many small towns along the route.

The consist of the train has two Economy (Coach) cars, 10-15 Manor cars (sleepers), 3-4 Skyliner dome cars, 2 Prestige cars (suites) and a Park Car that is shared with Prestige class and sleeper class during the day. There are 2 diners, sometimes 3, 2 locomotives GM F40PH #6412 and lead unit #6437 in the current “Love The Way” paint scheme, a baggage car behind the engines. There were 52 of this class of VIA locos in service on long distance trains. 6400 was scrapped after a wreck.

After a nice fresh air stop at Capreol, where we photographed train, station and yards, we moved to dinner at 7. A nice meal and conversations with a couple from Maine. Beef Tenderloin. Potatoes, salads, broccoli, great pretzel bread and cheesecake. The staff was very professional and friendly.

We returned to our room and found the beds down and a notice to change our watches for tomorrow to Central time. The bed was very comfortable, but without my CPap, I found sleeping to be somewhat difficult. The train rocked a bit, no worse than Amtrak. A long day of interesting scenery, meeting new people and seeing new parts of Canada. Good night.

 

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Thursday May 4 Ontario to Winnipeg, MB

We awoke to a snowy northwest Ontario as our Canadian #1 continued across the woodlands. After a shower, it was time to head to the diner for breakfast. An omelet with Fred & Alex from Parry Sound who had boarded the train yesterday afternoon. We had several stops for freights which is why the timetable has plenty of padding in the schedule. A major stop overnight was at Homepayne, Ontario for another crew change.

Went up to the Skyline car to enjoy the scenery as Bobby had more trivia information about Ontario. The sun was now shining and added to the glittering lakes. We are running about an hour behind schedule and thus, our stop at Sioux Lookout took place while we were having lunch. This small town was once a major Indian gathering point and was used to monitor Sioux tribes coming north to challenge native Canadian tribes. The small station looks like it belonged in the Alps with its chalet architecture. We joined Lowell & Lynn from Queensland Australia for lunch & a VIA Burger. An interesting conversation as they had boarded the Quantum in Australia several weeks ago.

More Canadian National freights forced us into sidings as the afternoon progressed. The scenery was changing away from snow and into the lakes region around Manitoba. We explored some of the manor cars near our Burton Manor and found most to have a few openings in the bedroom area. Each manor car has 4 cabins for 1, with a single toilet in the room, 6 cabins for 2 like our room with two beds and separate bathroom, 3 berths with upper and lower beds at night and two facing chairs during the day. There is a curtain that gives some privacy at night. There are 2 regular bathrooms at the end of the car for those passengers. The shower, as mentioned, is midway down the hall. Those in Economy Class have their own chair during the day and night. They can get access to food in their own Skyline dome car for a price. Food is similar to café car food on Amtrak. This car is exclusively for Economy Class and there are 2 bathrooms in each coach car.

We had an excellent cod dinner for our evening meal around 5. Potatoes, green beans and key lime pie were also part of the fare. Service was excellent and efficient in moving a full complement of passengers each day. Table cloths, flowers and real cutlery are classy.

We arrived in Winnipeg about 7:30pm and would have two hours to explore the city. It was a nice brisk evening so I headed out the door and into the central city. Winnipeg is the capital of Manitoba with 750,000 people, sixth largest city in Canada. I first headed to the famous Fort Garry Hotel, built by the Grand Trunk Pacific Rwy. in 1913. A 13-story luxury hotel just a block from the Union Station. Had a brief tour by the social host and then took some photos of the large buildings downtown. Walked up the street to some famous squares where statues of World War 1 soldiers and memorials were located. Later went to the other side of the station and out toward the Museum for Human Rights with its unique architecture, statue of Mahatma Gandi and beautiful parks. Several plaques commemorating the Indian survivors of the Residential Schools horror story and the thousands of indigenous children who disappeared. Canada has now set aside large $$ for First Nations peoples. Walked to the large bridge Esplanade Riel that connects the inner city to a suburban land. Thousands of people in the parks and walking the city. Returned to Union Station in time to line up for boarding, which took way too long. Back on board at 9:30 pm.

As all service crews change here, we had a new room attendant, Louise; and a new Skyline car attendant in Meg. The dining car also had new faces. All VIA Canadian crews are based in Winnipeg; thus they only serve 2 + days on board. It was now 10pm and time to call it a day.

Friday May 5. Manitoba, Saskatchewan to Edmonton AB

We are now traveling across the prairies of Saskatchewan, a big change in scenery from the last two days. Fields of wheat, grain elevators and lots of small farm towns.

We had breakfast with Paul & Mary from Scotland. Omelets, hash browns, rolls and cereals were available. We talked of my Scottish roots and their travels to Canada. We arrived in Saskatoon, SK around 9:30. We had an hour layover here due to more crew changes so I explored the train and station during our wait. Good exercise.

We left Saskatoon on time at 10:30 and moved to the Skyline Car where Meg was serving drinks and giving some histories of Saskatchewan. She grew up in the area and had some interesting stories of her early life there. More elevators and private rail cars as we moved closer to Alberta Province. Lunch was with a couple from Boston. Great chicken soup, turkey wraps, apple cobbler and ice cream. Our visits to the Boston area were discussed and cruise we took last fall from Boston Harbor.

We could see uplands starting to form on the horizon, the terrain looking similar to the sand hills of Montana. But we also saw smoke forming in the background with ominous events about to unfold. We had supper with a Toronto couple. He worked for CN, she spoke Portuguese to a couple riding in our car. Filet of sole, mashed potatoes, salads and a scrumptious strawberry short cake followed.

By 8 pm we were on the outskirts of Edmonton, Alberta and the conductor announced that many people were being evacuated from areas west and north of Edmonton due to prairie fires that were out of control. We had nearly 4 hours layover in the large CN Walker Yards for maintenance and crew changes, but the station was not near the city, so there was virtually no where to roam except around the train station. We continued to get announcements about the fires, but were told we were safe in Edmonton so everyone went to bed not knowing how the next day would turn out. We were scheduled to arrive in Jasper BC for a nice layover and town exploring between 6:30 and 9:30 am on Saturday before spending the remainder of the day traveling through the Canadian Rockies before reaching Vancouver on Sunday am. Good night.

Saturday May 6. Train Cancelled, Fly to Vancouver

We awoke to find our train had not moved overnight. The scheduled breakfast was continental with fruit cups, pastries, muffin, toast, milk, cranberry juice. We enjoyed our conversation with Bonnie & Charlie from London, Ontario and discussions ensued about our fate for the day. VIA supervisors told manor car attendants to take down information about passengers and Louise mentioned that we might want to arrange hotels for Saturday in Vancouver since our train was going to terminate in Edmonton and we would be flown from EDM to VAN later in the day. The smoke from the fires was still far off but the sky looked ominous. VIA spent most of the day arranging a charter flight with Air Canada and getting buses to take several hundred people to the airport that was on the south end of the city. I called our Hampton Inn in Vancouver and explained our situation. They were able to accommodate us and kept us in the same room as our Sunday reservation. We were not happy about flying or missing the Canadian Rockies part of our train trip. Some passengers who were detraining in Jasper and Kamloops were going to be bused over 6 hours to their destinations despite the threat of smoke and fires. Those who refused to fly also had that option.

We finally left our train room around 5pm with our load of luggage including the checked bags in the baggage car. It was quite an adventure to get our bags into the lower compartment of the buses. Reminded me of my Gathering bus transfers in California last October. The bus ride took an hour and on arrival at the airport, there was considerable confusion between VIA and Air Canada officials. After finally clearing security and walking a long distance to our gate, we boarded the Airbus 247 at 7:30pm and had seats in the rear of the plane. The trip took just over an hour and we then had a walk to our baggage claim area. Bags acquired, I heard the VIA agent tell passengers that if they need hotel accommodations the railroad had vouchers to get to a hotel near the airport. ?Sandman hotel?. I told the agent that we were told by our car attendant to make arrangements with our own hotel if possible and that we could not cancel at this late date. He said he was sorry, but he was not authorized to pay for any other hotels. So we were stuck with arranging a cab to our hotel downtown $45 and pay for our extra night in Vancouver. $211 US. After standing in line a while, we grabbed a cab and made it to our hotel around 9:30 pm. The front desk was friendly and we went to our hotel room with a nice view of the sports stadium. We were pretty hungry so went across the street to Boston Pizza & Grill. It was 11pm and kitchen was closing, but they fixed some sandwiches for us. Food was good and sports bar was full of hockey and soccer fans and some NBA basketball. We were very tired so around midnight went back to the hotel for some rest. We had an extra day in Vancouver tomorrow, but now sleep was in order.
 

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And the last of some VIA Canadian Photos. As mentioned, VIA did compensate us for part of our train fare and hotel, so all was not lost. We spent two days in Vancouver and then boarded Royal Caribbean Quantum of the Seas for a 7 day cruise in Alaska.
On return to Seattle, we would board Empire Builder #8 and Amtrak back to Chicago. Will talk about that trip in the main trip report area for Amtrak later. Thanks for reading.
 

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