What's a safe distance from the train?

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George K

George K

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Over on Facebook, someone posted a video of an Amtrak train passing through a passenger station (I don't remember the details, location, etc). A few people commented that the videographer was dangerously close to the train as it passed (at a good speed), saying that they could have been sucked in, etc. From looking at the video, it's apparent that the videographer was behind the yellow section of the platform.

Was he being unsafe?

If so, what's the "safe" distance to be from the train? I would have thought that the yellow part of the platform is the "do not enter" part. Anything farther away should be okay.
 
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George K said:
Over on Facebook, someone posted a video of an Amtrak train passing through a passenger station (I don't remember the details, location, etc). A few people commented that the videographer was dangerously close to the train as it passed (at a good speed), saying that they could have been sucked in, etc. From looking at the video, it's apparent that the videographer was behind the yellow section of the platform. Was he being unsafe? If so, what's the "safe" distance to be from the train? I would have thought that the yellow part of the platform is the "do not enter" part. Anything farther away should be okay.
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Yes. No. Maybe. This isn't Facebook and without the video we'd just be blindly guessing at whatever speed and location you may or may not be talking about.
 
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Fair enough, D's A. Unfortunately, I can't copy the video here (gotta look for a way to do that...), but suffice it to say that the train was moving right along. If I had to guess, 60 mph or more was the speed. It's clear that the camera was to the far side of the yellow part of the platform.

Assuming you don't know anything about such things, how far from a speeding train MUST one be?

Here's a screen cap of the train:

Screen Shot 2016-04-20 at 7.12.35 PM.png
 
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How far is a safe distance is relative. If the train derails, you'll need to be in the next county. If it's a freight train, you'll want to move away from it. Some loads, especially on bulkhead flats, are secured with metal bands. The metal bands break from time to time and drag along the side of the car. You'll not want to be within range of this long razor blade.

jb
 
If the train is not moving, the yellow stripe should be thought of as the ABSOLUTE MINIMUM. Be farther from the train if you can. If you make a misstep and put your foot between the train and platform, you're in trouble. I like to think you're safest if you're far enough away that you can't touch it. Only cross the line if you are actually boarding or detraining. Some will say this is overly cautious. I say better safe than sorry.

IF THE TRAIN IS MOVING, INCREASE THE DISTANCE. Since dust and small stones can occasionally be kicked up, I recommend several feet. As John mentioned, steel strapping can come loose from freight cars and extend several feet beyond the edge of the ballast. I once saw a bridge plate fall from a moving piggyback flatcar and tumble about 10-15 feet from the ballast. It could have killed anybody in its path. A bridge plate is the movable ramp that allows a trailer to be moved from one flatcar to another. Each one is a couple hundred pounds of unforgiving steel.

Tom
 
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There is also the possibility that the camera was zoomed in.
 
(not apparent from the photo - the train *is* moving)

Thanks for your comments, everyone. However the answers beg the question: "What's the safe distance?" It doesn't require too much of a stretch of the imagination to see this scenario:

Railfan standing on platform outside the yellow line gets injured by debris or by getting caught under passing train. Lawsuit ensues, and photographic/video evidence surfaces that said railfan was standing outside the "do not cross" line, presumably safe, but obviously not.

Would Amtrak have any legal exposure based on this scenario? After all, a reasonable person would assume that anything outside the yellow would be safe. I can see lawyers salivating over such an incident.

FWIW, when my Metra train arrives at my station, I always stand back, MUCH farther than the edge of the yellow part of the platform.
 
There's also the possibility that the camera was not hand-held, but was on a tripod or supported by some other structure. But even if hand-held, I'd estimate the videographer was not intruding into the safety zone marked by the yellow line.
 
The show "Mythbusters" addressed the sucked-into-the-train subject several years ago in episode 66 on Nov. 8, 2006. If that is the episode I'm thinking of, the test train was running at 79 past the platform. (New Mexico, I believe).

"Despite the lack of suction, the MythBusters agreed that the turbulence was powerful enough in its own right to make standing that close to the train as it passes very dangerous."

http://mythresults.com/episode66
 
If something comes flying off the train, it probably doesn't matter where the person is standing. I'm willing to bet there is some liability. However, your basic question has been answered. There are numerous scenarios and it appears you are looking for a "one size fits all" answer.

Very well then. If you get hit by something or sucked in, you are too close. If you do not not get hit or do not get sucked in, you're far enough.

I hope that helps. :hi:
 
The inanimate objects in the "Mythbusters" tests were blown back from the train, not sucked in. A person can fall in any direction, however.
 
In the Netherlands we have to stay clear 1.5 meters from the closest rail. However, if I should trip or pass out flat I'd rather not kiss a car, so if possible I keep about 2 meters from vehicles.
 
I think you can use the yellow line as a guide. Amtrak and other commuter railroads often post language to that affect, even when the track is used by other high speed trains that do not stop at that particular station.

As far as getting closer to the track to take a picture. I can't image getting super close and getting a good picture or angle.
 
NS here in North Carolina at least, wants the platforms kept clear until it's time for boarding. That pretty much works here because we have agents or attendants at most of them.

jb
 
George K said:
A few people commented that the videographer was dangerously close to the train as it passed (at a good speed), saying that they could have been sucked in, etc.
Click to expand...
How could the photographer be 'sucked in'?

The photographer is more likely to be blown away from the train as the lead locomotive goes by him.
 
An anecdote: several decades back I was picking up my mom arriving on the Empire Builder at Glenview, IL. There was a freight ahead of the EB; the PA system told everyone to completely clear the platform (i.e. go into the shelters). Being a teenager, I figured staying on the platform couldn't hurt me. I was about twelve feet from the edge of the platform. The freight came through at about 60MPH. Once the initial blast of air passed, all I could do was stand there, lean back and pray. If I had lifted a foot I'd have been sucked into the train. It turns out a long passing train creates air vortices which act to suck nearby objects toward the train. This effect is more pronounced the longer the train. That definitely got added to the list of "stupid things I'm NEVER going to do again."
 
Survival instinct should dictate as the train approaches, you automatically step back, the distance being further the faster the train is approaching.
 
George K said:
Fair enough, D's A. Unfortunately, I can't copy the video here (gotta look for a way to do that...), but suffice it to say that the train was moving right along. If I had to guess, 60 mph or more was the speed. It's clear that the camera was to the far side of the yellow part of the platform.

Assuming you don't know anything about such things, how far from a speeding train MUST one be?

Here's a screen cap of the train:

attachicon.gif
Screen Shot 2016-04-20 at 7.12.35 PM.png
Click to expand...
I suspect the video is zoomed in and the guy is not standing that close. Depending one what station, he could be even off the platform in a parking lot .
 
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From photos I've seen, rail cars seldom seem to get more than about 45° from the track when derailed. So for an 85' passenger car at 45° you should be safe at a distance of 85Sin45° or about 60' - not accounting for any flying debris, of course. :blink:
 
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