Why are there so few Horizon cars on the NEC

[norfolkwesternhenry]

All of the times I have traveled on the NEC, I have never seen any Horizon cars, only Amfleet I & II, Viewliners, and Acela train sets. Is this because the Horizon cars don't fit in Penn Station? Or are they reserved for Midwest corridor service?

 

[CCC1007]

The primary reason as I understand it is the manual doors, requiring a crew member to open them for each station, increasing dwell time on the busy corridor.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

as for fit, the Horizons fit anywhere on system even NYP, NJT ran Comets into NYP all time.

Manual doors and speed restricted are main reason, Horizons are only good for 110 mph.

 

[norfolkwesternhenry]

Ah, ok

 

[A Voice]

Regardless of door issues or lack of certification for higher speeds, the Horizon fleet cars with rare esception are simply busy holding down assignments on regional trains out of Chicago. If the Nippon-Sharyo car order actually happens, then the Horizons will be freed up for use elsewhere, and there is indeed a shortage of Amfleet cars on the corridor.

 

[Acela150]

They are able to run at 125. Speed isn't the issue. It's the manual doors.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

only a few of horizons were cleared for 125 but it could have changed since my last timetable.

 

[MattW]

I'd expect the Horizons on the Carolinian, Downeaster, Vermonter, Ethan Allen and Empire Service trains before I see them on Regionals or Keystones. Empire trains, I don't know about, but I'm pretty sure the others don't really need automatic doors. Maybe the Vermonter does since it operates on a large portion of the corridor, but the others I'm pretty certain could make do with Horizons.

 

[Seaboard92]

I would add the Palmetto to that list as well

 

[jis]

Palmetto is now a corridor train stopping at places like Princeton Jct. and what not. Forget about putting Horizons on Palmetto. For that matter both Carolinian southbound and Vermonter both ways are regular corridor trains too.

 

[Thirdrail7]

only a few of horizons were cleared for 125 but it could have changed since my last timetable.

For the record, all Horizon cars are now cleared for 125mph. However, most Horizon cafe and split cafe cars are prohibited in third rail territory so they would be unable to enter the NYT district.

So, to answer the OP's question, it has to do with the manual doors and the availability of Amfleets.

 

[neroden]

only a few of horizons were cleared for 125 but it could have changed since my last timetable.

For the record, all Horizon cars are now cleared for 125mph. However, most Horizon cafe and split cafe cars are prohibited in third rail territory so they would be unable to enter the NYT district.

Curious. What's hanging under the car in the cafes but not in the coaches?!?

 

[Seaboard92]

It might be a larger potable water tank for food preparation. Coaches don't need as large of a tank. Without showers, or food prep. While a cafe car has food prep and would have a slightly larger need. That's my opinion. I've seen some toilets actually fill up completely on trains I've worked in about four hours. But it was a matter of the sewage tank being small

 

[MARC Rider]

Palmetto is now a corridor train stopping at places like Princeton Jct. and what not. Forget about putting Horizons on Palmetto. For that matter both Carolinian southbound and Vermonter both ways are regular corridor trains too.

However, they have used Horizons on the Vermonter. I know, I once rode the Vermonter that had a Horizon car in the consist.

 

[west point]

Horizons on the NEC ? Would be OK except in the dark of severe winter. How to solve the door problem. Two ways. 1. The obvious make doors automatic. 2. alternate horizons with Amfleets-1s or new coaches. That way anyone <> can pass thru Horizon vestibule to Amfleet-1 vestibule. Amfleet-2s not so good. That is assuming that control of Amfleet-1s door can pass thru Horizon cars.

 

[PVD]

Some months back, we had a long thread on possible repurposing of the bulk of the Horizon fleet upon the arrival of the NS cars.

 

[Hal]

Palmetto is now a corridor train stopping at places like Princeton Jct. and what not. Forget about putting Horizons on Palmetto. For that matter both Carolinian southbound and Vermonter both ways are regular corridor trains too.

However, they have used Horizons on the Vermonter. I know, I once rode the Vermonter that had a Horizon car in the consist.

They had that car in the consist in the winter because because the automatic Amfleet doors would freeze up in Vermont. So the idea was if all the other doors froze in the consist they could get those manual doors on that Horizon car open and closed. That one car was always in the middle of the five car set.

 

[Hal]

Horizons on the NEC ? Would be OK except in the dark of severe winter. How to solve the door problem. Two ways. 1. The obvious make doors automatic. 2. alternate horizons with Amfleets-1s or new coaches. That way anyone <> can pass thru Horizon vestibule to Amfleet-1 vestibule. Amfleet-2s not so good. That is assuming that control of Amfleet-1s door can pass thru Horizon cars.

The doors will trainline thru the Horizon cars. A mixed consist won't break the trainline.

 

[edjbox]

I've seen a horizon car on the tail end of the cardinal at Washington union station several months back, not sure if it stayed in DC or continued with the rest of the consist.

Also, after the Bilevel Midwest cars are ever delivered, they should send the horizon cars to the heartland flyer to free up the superliners there. In addition, horizons can be used for any additional future gulf coast daily service that supplements the CONO extension

 

[FreeskierInVT]

Palmetto is now a corridor train stopping at places like Princeton Jct. and what not. Forget about putting Horizons on Palmetto. For that matter both Carolinian southbound and Vermonter both ways are regular corridor trains too.

However, they have used Horizons on the Vermonter. I know, I once rode the Vermonter that had a Horizon car in the consist.

They had that car in the consist in the winter because because the automatic Amfleet doors would freeze up in Vermont. So the idea was if all the other doors froze in the consist they could get those manual doors on that Horizon car open and closed. That one car was always in the middle of the five car set.

When was this? Of all the times I've ridden and seen the Vermonter, I've never once seen a Horizon car in the consist.

 

[Seaboard92]

The palmetto uses amfleet IIs so it could use horizon cars.

 

[Hal]

Palmetto is now a corridor train stopping at places like Princeton Jct. and what not. Forget about putting Horizons on Palmetto. For that matter both Carolinian southbound and Vermonter both ways are regular corridor trains too.

However, they have used Horizons on the Vermonter. I know, I once rode the Vermonter that had a Horizon car in the consist.

They had that car in the consist in the winter because because the automatic Amfleet doors would freeze up in Vermont. So the idea was if all the other doors froze in the consist they could get those manual doors on that Horizon car open and closed. That one car was always in the middle of the five car set.

When was this? Of all the times I've ridden and seen the Vermonter, I've never once seen a Horizon car in the consist.

A few years ago in the winter. They did it one, maybe two years. Then they stopped.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[battalion51]

The Horizons have also worked Empire Service when the corridor fleet has been stretched. With a more limited number of high platform stops it's not as big of a deal as it is on most Regionals where nearly all stops are high platform.

 

[Northeastern292]

only a few of horizons were cleared for 125 but it could have changed since my last timetable.

For the record, all Horizon cars are now cleared for 125mph. However, most Horizon cafe and split cafe cars are prohibited in third rail territory so they would be unable to enter the NYT district.

So, to answer the OP's question, it has to do with the manual doors and the availability of Amfleets.

I'm surprised that the Horizon cafe cars can't run into NYP. Can they be modified to do so if so needed?

 

[Thirdrail7]

only a few of horizons were cleared for 125 but it could have changed since my last timetable.

For the record, all Horizon cars are now cleared for 125mph. However, most Horizon cafe and split cafe cars are prohibited in third rail territory so they would be unable to enter the NYT district.

So, to answer the OP's question, it has to do with the manual doors and the availability of Amfleets.

I'm surprised that the Horizon cafe cars can't run into NYP. Can they be modified to do so if so needed?

Some of them have been modified which is why most of them are prohibited...not all. I don't know if they plan modify the rest but I doubt it.