Why don't they add more coaches?

[bryher]

When a train shows as sold out, weeks ahead, why don't they add more cars to the reservation? As an example, the CZ from Chi to Emy on July 26th is showing as 100% sold out. Was seeing if I could add my wife and son to the same trip as Me. Are they short on equipment or staff maybe? Seems like a popular route on a date several weeks out they could fill it up at least partially.

 

[jis]

When a train shows as sold out, weeks ahead, why don't they add more cars to the reservation? As an example, the CZ from Chi to Emy on July 26th is showing as 100% sold out. Was seeing if I could add my wife and son to the same trip as Me. Are they short on equipment or staff maybe? Seems like a popular route on a date several weeks out they could fill it up at least partially.

Mostly because there are no additional coaches in servicable condition available to add.

 

[bryher]

Ok that would make sense. Shake.

 

[Anderson]

(1) A lot of equipment isn't in good shape due to yard issues. You know how management said they were going to use the 3x/weekly running to fix up equipment? Guess what they didn't do?
(2) Additionally, adding equipment on some days but not others runs the risk of some sort of mixup of space being sold. Remember, for the CZ you need six cars to add one to each set (plus any spare allowances). Not to mention if there's an additional coach attendant needed, etc.

 

[lrh442]

Excepting key holidays (e.g. Thanksgiving) I don't think Amtrak has ever done much to add equipment to LD trains to accommodate increased traffic on specific dates. Adding equipment during busy season, yes, but not for specific dates. Equipment availability aside, it probably plays havoc with OBS crew scheduling.

My understanding is that even during the pre-Amtrak era there was limited load balancing that occurred by adding equipment for specific LD departures.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Excepting key holidays (e.g. Thanksgiving) I don't think Amtrak has ever done much to add equipment to LD trains to accommodate increased traffic on specific dates. Adding equipment during busy season, yes, but not for specific dates. Equipment availability aside, it probably plays havoc with OBS crew scheduling.

My understanding is that even during the pre-Amtrak era there was limited load balancing that occurred by adding equipment for specific LD departures.

But there were many more Trains pre-Amtrak, and in most cases to meet demand RRs would run additional Sections and even " Specials" since there were lots more Workers and Equipment than there is today.

 

[west point]

Amtrak would rather run empty AM-1s on the NEC instead of placing some on the single level LD routes.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

They have add AM-1 to long distance trains for special events, the feed back on overnight travel in a AM-1 was not positive.

 

[Amtrak25]

If they have surplus Am-1's, they can put them on the Pennsylvanian, and release 6 Am-2's for LD.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Equipment management is a art form. It requires a lot of work, and effort.

 

[bratkinson]

There's a number of factors at work that are limiting the number of coaches, sleepers, and even sightseer lounge cars on Amtraks trains these days.

1. During the pandemic, Amtrak stored a large number of cars. It's likely that the 90 day inspections expired as well as other regularly, required scheduled inspections and servicing. That means there's a good chunk of money required to get each car 'back on the road' again. $10-20,000 maybe more.

2. Numerous car maintenance and repair workers were similarly laid off during the pandemic. Whether they were called to come back and declined (had found work elsewhere) or decided not to work at Amtrak any more is unknown. From what I've read here and there, new hires can't be 'ready to go' when hired. It's far more complex than hiring an auto mechanic. Finding drug-free, alcohol-free, criminal record-free workers these days is getting harder every day. So there's a shortage of shops staff.

3. Add to that a shortage of on board services (OBS) staff. Many laid off. Fewer wanted to come back to long overnight schedules and irregular work days like 3 on, 2 off, etc.

4. Insufficient T&E staff. The freight railroads are having increasingly more difficulty having sufficient T&E crews. Training isn't a 1-day affair, either. More like months. How many clean and sober new hires are willing to work extra board non-schedules, long, tiring trips, crying babies and whining adults, and a deal with a growing number of beligerent passengers?

5. I don't know what the union contract indicates as number of cars = what number of conductors. But it's quite possible that any lengthening of a train will require an extra assistant conductor as well.

We are all familiar with current Amtrak management 'save first, save last, save always, and Amtrak will prosper' thinking. Put another way, they appear to shy away from doing anything that would generate more income, especially during the summer peak travel season and countless potential passengers are being turned away due to full trains...and overworked staff, especially in the lounge car!

 

[mgkeihl]

I was on an overloaded coach car in April 2021. Lsl from Chicago to Rochester. First they said we would be needing to share seats, which during covid was not happening. Then they decided to add a car.... it took almost 4 hours! Meanwhile people were getting restless and hot since there was no power! It made me very uneasy as some people do not handle adversity very well! Another car came, they took the front half of coach to this car and separated the rest of us! After an awesome trip to Seattle on the EB, it was a long bad ending to the trip! I was more upset at myself as I had cashed in the roomette for 3 extra days in Seattle! I think most of those passengers just kind of slept the delay away.

 

[Amtrak25]

So after a year of Amtrak moaning, groaning, whining, and playing victim card about not enough people working for them to repair all the LD equipment, they pull 8 Amfleet-2 coaches out of a hat and entirely re-equip the Maple Leaf for the comfort of the bus load of passengers that head to Ontario, and screw the domestic bike users. They could have added 2 coach lines to the Lake Shore Ltd and 1 to the Cardinal.

Goes to prove Stephen Gardner is playing devious games with stealth attacks on the national network. Just wait for the perfect storm of him and the next Congress In January.

 

[zephyr17]

Is there on the ground sighting that Maple Leaf actually is running with Amfleet IIs now? I am asking because the videos posted of the first train that went through to Toronto showed a consist made up of Amfleet Is.

 

[jis]

So after a year of Amtrak moaning, groaning, whining, and playing victim card about not enough people working for them to repair all the LD equipment, they pull 8 Amfleet-2 coaches out of a hat and entirely re-equip the Maple Leaf for the comfort of the bus load of passengers that head to Ontario, and screw the domestic bike users. They could have added 2 coach lines to the Lake Shore Ltd and 1 to the Cardinal.

Goes to prove Stephen Gardner is playing devious games with stealth attacks on the national network. Just wait for the perfect storm of him and the next Congress In January.

Are you sure that it was not NY State that wanted its Amfleet IIs back? Afterall they are the ones paying for the train in NY State and they were told at the COVID shutdown time that there would be no Amfleet IIs for the duration of COVID, as I was told back then by my ESPA acquaintances.

 

[Amtrak25]

Before COVID, the train had 3 Am2 and 1 Am1, so a decent balance. The 280 series trains with 6 cars are usually booked. This is too coincidental with the Roanoke and Night Owl train start ups.

 

[jis]

Before COVID, the train had 3 Am2 and 1 Am1, so a decent balance. The 280 series trains with 6 cars are usually booked. This is too coincidental with the Roanoke and Night Owl train start ups.

Still just one conjecture. Nothing solid based on documented facts.

 

[brianpmcdonnell17]

Is there on the ground sighting that Maple Leaf actually is running with Amfleet IIs now? I am asking because the videos posted of the first train that went through to Toronto showed a consist made up of Amfleet Is.

From the videos I saw, the first trip was using Amfleet Is and the following trains have been using Amfleet IIs, although I can't confirm if that has been the case every day.

 

[west point]

Yes there is too much speculation. But why? It all comes down to the fact that Amtrak will not be open as to what their rolling stock plans are. That is one of a very few facts that we can verify. What do we know? Lers start in the midwest.
1. There are Siemens cars going there every month. The problems with potable water has not been explained but appear to have been resolved?
2. It appars that the Siemens cars have not been given complete approval to be permanetly asigned to mid west trains. WHY?
3. Once these cars are approved or have been approved what are the plans for the displaced cars? There is o transparancy for#4 - 7.
4. Will Horizons go to the Cascad service?
5. Will Superliners go to Wester LD trains?
6. Will AM-2s go to east coast LD trains?
7. Will AM-1s go fill in spots including any AM-2s on NEC trains?
8. Will revenue cars that are being used as axel cars be reassigned to the above items?
9. What are the results so far for dinning car services?
10. What are reasons for the less than daily service on some routes.
11. How many revenue passengers have been lost on the Crescent due to the northbound schedule change?
12. Why has Amtrak not persued NS on their constant delays on the Crescnt and south of the lake routes?
13. Why are there enpty train cars on some NEC train conists ( all directios ) that could be assigned to LD trains?
14. What are the maintenance holdups and what is the planto get as many pieces of equipment into service as soon as possible?

These are just some of the questions that Amtrak's keeping secret from the govt and public.scb

 

[joelkfla]

2. It appars that the Siemens cars have not been given complete approval to be permanetly asigned to mid west trains. WHY?

https://www.amtraktrains.com/thread...-be-used-for-boarding-deboarding.82520/unread

 

[Ryan]

These are just some of the questions that Amtrak's keeping secret from the govt and public.scb

I wonder why you think that Amtrak owes the public complete disclosure on what their equipment plans are?

 

[joelkfla]

I wonder why you think that Amtrak owes the public complete disclosure on what their equipment plans are?

Probably because they're a quasi-governmental corporation subject to the FOIA and the oversight of Congress.

 

[lordsigma]

1. During the pandemic, Amtrak stored a large number of cars. It's likely that the 90 day inspections expired as well as other regularly, required scheduled inspections and servicing. That means there's a good chunk of money required to get each car 'back on the road' again. $10-20,000 maybe more.

And most of the cars stored were those that were coming due for overhaul - the money saving came from deferring the overhaul. As a result these cars are having to undergo that overhaul at Beech Grove before being able to get back out there.)

 

[lordsigma]

3. Add to that a shortage of on board services (OBS) staff. Many laid off. Fewer wanted to come back to long overnight schedules and irregular work days like 3 on, 2 off, etc.

It's not just because of the lay offs or Amtrak's own decision making some of this is macro economic trends. As you may remember they initially got enough people back through recalls to resume daily service on all LDTs. They have subsequently lost people and the hiring isn't fast enough to keep up with the turnover. I think some of this is workforce trends - these OBS jobs are tough jobs that require a lot of time away from home and it is so easy to switch to another job right now and with the pandemic many people experienced spending more time at home and many of the younger millennial and gen z workers have different expectations about work life balance than what boomers were willing to put up with and the pandemic and an increasing number of jobs shifting to offering some work from home has really accelerated this. Amtrak, railroads, and airlines in general are going to have to get creative in trying to attract people to those fields whether it's higher pay, better benefits, etc. to make up for the time away from home which less people are willing to do these days.

 

[MARC Rider]

. . . many of the younger millennial and gen z workers have different expectations about work life balance than what boomers were willing to put up with and the pandemic and an increasing number of jobs shifting to offering some work from home has really accelerated this. Amtrak, railroads, and airlines in general are going to have to get creative in trying to attract people to those fields whether it's higher pay, better benefits, etc. to make up for the time away from home which less people are willing to do these days.

As a Boomer, I find this analysis to be amusing, as I recall back in the earlier days of my career pundits were writing "think pieces" about how Boomers were being more demanding about work-life balance than their parents were. If they were all true, then in a generation or two, everybody will want a work-life balance that's all life and no work. I have since found that it's just a matter of sucking it up in the present, and when you retire, you can get all the work-life balance you want.

There are also a lot of people for whom being away from home a lot is a feature, not a bug. As the poster said, employers are going to have to be creative about how to attract such people. I would think that one of the big problems with working Amtrak are the frequent delays, which mess up schedules. Even OBS on odd schedules still have a routine and messing up said routing is psychologically stressful.