CSX abandons NORAC

[battalion51]

Effective Monday, CSX will no longer operate using the NORAC Rule Book. NORAC was primarily used in former Conrail territory, while the CSX Rule Book was used primarily down south. The entire system will now use the CSX Rule Book. Among the changes for those up north will be Radio Procedures, use of Form EC-1's (instead of Form D's), and some Operating Rules. Most notably trains will now be required to call all signals up north. In Cab Signal territory this isn't much help since signals are usually only found at CP's, but elsewhere in the system it will be a big help in keeping tabs on a trains location.

 

[amtrakmichigan]

Most notably trains will now be required to call all signals up north.

Just currious of where "up north" exactly means. Is this a change for old Conrail line that CSX now owns? I am asking because signals have always been called out here as far as I can remember on the old C&O/Chessie system here in Michigan, and that's as far north as CSX runs.

 

[A_Nonny_Moose]

Every signal and indictation and train number needs to be called on radio, not just in cab.

Great way for terrorist to know were each train is and if its moving??

Homeland security at best, go figure.....

 

[Amtrak OBS Employee]

Every signal and indictation and train number needs to be called on radio, not just in cab.Great way for terrorist to know were each train is and if its moving??

Homeland security at best, go figure.....

You may have a slight point regarding the terrorist situation. But "communication" is critical out on the railroad. One mistake can end up costing lives, property damage to the railroad and others, etc. among other things. The calling of signals is a necessary means of communication mainly for other trains, signal and track workers, and other railroad employees working on or near trackage in areas where cab signal territory is not used or available. If my memory serves me correctly, on CSX's RF&P trackage between RVR, VA and WAS DC, CSX uses a combination method of cab signals and calling wayside signals. And as a railroad employee, I am more concerned about "operations safety" than I am of a terrorist attack based on the possible probabilities. For the record, in my opinion, if a terrorist organization is going to target a train, they are gonna know where that particular train is gonna be at certain times, anyway. It is just as easy for a terrorist to go to the Amtrak website (assuming an Amtrak train is what they are targeting) and check the train's status as well as you or I could do the same. And they would simply follow through with their plans and set up wherever they planned to do so. One must keep in mind how the criminal mind "works" so to say! For this is one of the many reasons why as employees (and railfans too), we must remain vigilant at all times on duty, and yes, even off duty when around the rails. So I all for safety regarding daily operations (something employees have direct contol over for the most part) over a possible terrosist attack (which no one really and truthfully has any idea of when one will actually occur)! I am not saying to not take the necessary precautions with this. I feel there are decent procedures in place in the case there is a problem such as this out on the rails. Of course there is room for improvement, vigilance will help us accomplish that in my opinon!

 

[battalion51]

Definitely agree with you. Safety is always priority number one for the railroads. For example, down here in South Florida, there are 5-10 work areas (also known as Conditional Stop Orders) everyday. When employees are calling wayside signals it helps the employee in charge keep tabs on a trains location and movement so that their employees are advised on where the train is. Station employees use the calling of signals to know when to alert passengers when the train is arriving, and on what track in multi-track locations (even though crews are suppposed to say something like "P098 Amtrak 51 North arrival Deerfield Beach Track 2" when they arrive and "P098 Amtrak 51 North on the move out of Deerfield Beach on a Clear Track 2"). In the case of meets, it allows the engine crew to keep tabs on the opposing train's location (and the ID for Delay Reports). Calling signals is more than it appears to be on the surface.

And yes OBS the RF&P uses is a combination of Cab Signal and Wayside.

 

[Save Our Trains Michigan]

I don't agree with calling signals over the radio.You have to much radio traffic going on in 1 time i am just glad BNSF dosen't make us do it.Thats why you have signals to govern your movement from block to block calling the signals over the radio doesn't help we just say them in the cab and i write the signal indication on my signal form and turn it in at the end of duty.

 

[Save Our Trains Michigan]

The only 2 rule books you have out there are GCOR and NORAC so if CSXT is droping NORAC they will be on GCOR.

 

[battalion51]

No they aren't going to GCOR. They are governed by CSX Operating Rules. If you ever read a CSX Bulletin (before they dropped NORAC), a crossing failure would say "BE GOVERENED BY CSX OPERATING RULE 100-J OR NORAC 138." Most of the non-Conjob territory used and now the whole system uses CSX Operating Rules.

 

[Save Our Trains Michigan]

No they aren't going to GCOR. They are governed by CSX Operating Rules. If you ever read a CSX Bulletin (before they dropped NORAC), a crossing failure would say "BE GOVERENED BY CSX OPERATING RULE 100-J OR NORAC 138." Most of the non-Conjob territory used and now the whole system uses CSX Operating Rules.

Right just like we use GCOR but BNSF has there own rules added.what i am saying is there is only to Rule books out there NORAC and GCOR for operating rules and in those rule books each RR can add there own rules.

 

[AMTK1007]

Actually there is GCOR, Norac, CSXT, CN and NS, and probably a few other smaller books

Roads on GCOR include BNSF, CP, UP and Amtrak's Chicago and New Orleans terminals

( each modified by there TTSI)

ROads on Norac include Amtrak NEC, Providenc and Worcester, CP (D&H), NJT, Long Island/Metro North, and Conrail

CN US has a seperate rule book as does CSXT and NS ( non Conrail)

At one time I was qualified on GCOR, and the ttsi for UP, BNSF, COP, Amtrak Chicago Terminal, WSOR, NI Springfield Relocation