Empire Builder and the Souris River

[anir dendroica]

From BNSF today:

07/01/2011
Update Report: Minot, North Dakota Area Flooding

As stated in the Service Advisory dated Friday, June 24, 2011, BNSF reported that both main tracks at Minot, North Dakota were closed to rail traffic due to flooding.

Main track one was removed from service 12:00 p.m. CT on June 22, 2011.

Main track two was removed from service 10:00 a.m. CT on June 24, 2011.

Based on current hydrological forecasts, BNSF estimates that water levels will recede to levels allowing main track two to be repaired and returned to service early the week of July 4th, 2011.

In anticipation of the opening of main track two, we will begin to route some trains over our north lines through Minot, North Dakota over this weekend; while some traffic will continue to run over the established reroutes.

Customers will continue experience 24-48 hours delays on traffic over the next week as crews and equipment are returned to balance, and congestion from the track outage is alleviated.

Please see bnsf.com/customers/weather-interruptions for maps and additional information. If you have any questions, please contact BNSF Customer Support at 1-888-428-2673 option 4, option 3.

I still don't expect to see Amtrak running before the 12th, but the situation is improving. The question will be whether Amtrak decides to resume service on the KO subdivision or whether they wait for the Devils Lake sub to reopen, which could be another 2-3 weeks.

Mark

 

[Altygrae]

Considering how full the EB tends to run at this time of year I would expect Amtrak will try and get trains running even if it is over an alternate route. That's what they did a couple of years ago when there was flooding on the Red river in Grand Forks.

 

[SBee]

I was booked on the EB from Portland to Chicago (then on to NY) on 6/15 and had backup refundable plane ticket. I was very happy that the train ran that day, but wasn't that stressed out since I knew I'd make my trip either way. The ride was LOVELY and the train fun - my first LD trip. I suggest making backup plans, just in case. Good luck!

 

[Eric308]

Just checked online with Amtrak for my CBS-PDX trip. First date with train up and running is now 7/20. My question is that why did the one-way coach fare go from $156 to $347? I thought only sleeper fares increased as the departure time got closer.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Just checked online with Amtrak for my CBS-PDX trip. First date with train up and running is now 7/20. My question is that why did the one-way coach fare go from $156 to $347? I thought only sleeper fares increased as the departure time got closer.

Lots of people don't realize that Coach fares have Buckets also, the Fuller the Train, the Higher the Rail Fare! You only get the Low Bucket Rail Fare when you Book a Sleeper! This also applies to Rail Passes, there only only a Certain Number??? of Low Buket Coach Fares Available on Each Train! :help:

 

[anir dendroica]

Just checked online with Amtrak for my CBS-PDX trip. First date with train up and running is now 7/20. My question is that why did the one-way coach fare go from $156 to $347? I thought only sleeper fares increased as the departure time got closer.

Coach fares have at least three buckets, possibly four. Getting a low-bucket price on the EB in the summer is almost impossible.

 

[Eric308]

Just checked online with Amtrak for my CBS-PDX trip. First date with train up and running is now 7/20. My question is that why did the one-way coach fare go from $156 to $347? I thought only sleeper fares increased as the departure time got closer.

Lots of people don't realize that Coach fares have Buckets also, the Fuller the Train, the Higher the Rail Fare! You only get the Low Bucket Rail Fare when you Book a Sleeper! This also applies to Rail Passes, there only only a Certain Number??? of Low Buket Coach Fares Available on Each Train! :help:

Gotcha...but does that still apply even if there is no sleeper available? Man, that would mean that my r/t would be almost $700 coach if I booked today. So glad that I booked months ago and am not paying much more than that WITH a roomette. Hey, Jim....thanks for the clarification. As you can obviously tell I'm still in a learning phase here.

 

[AlanB]

Just checked online with Amtrak for my CBS-PDX trip. First date with train up and running is now 7/20. My question is that why did the one-way coach fare go from $156 to $347? I thought only sleeper fares increased as the departure time got closer.

Coach fares have at least three buckets, possibly four. Getting a low-bucket price on the EB in the summer is almost impossible.

Coach has 4 buckets, sleepers have 5.

 

[mwmnp]

Maintenance crews on Friday started busily working at getting the tracks through Minot back into operable condition. Per a BNSF employee at Minot, BNSF tentatively plans to have one track open through Minot by tomorrow (July 3rd) afternoon.

 

[Trogdor]

Gotcha...but does that still apply even if there is no sleeper available? Man, that would mean that my r/t would be almost $700 coach if I booked today. So glad that I booked months ago and am not paying much more than that WITH a roomette. Hey, Jim....thanks for the clarification. As you can obviously tell I'm still in a learning phase here.

Coach and sleeper buckets work independently of each other.

If you're in coach, you pay whatever the prevailing coach bucket rate is. If you're in a sleeper, you pay whatever the prevailing sleeper accommodation charge bucket is, plus a rail fare per person equivalent to the lowest coach bucket for that segment.

 

[Eric308]

Gotcha...but does that still apply even if there is no sleeper available? Man, that would mean that my r/t would be almost $700 coach if I booked today. So glad that I booked months ago and am not paying much more than that WITH a roomette. Hey, Jim....thanks for the clarification. As you can obviously tell I'm still in a learning phase here.

Coach and sleeper buckets work independently of each other.

If you're in coach, you pay whatever the prevailing coach bucket rate is. If you're in a sleeper, you pay whatever the prevailing sleeper accommodation charge bucket is, plus a rail fare per person equivalent to the lowest coach bucket for that segment.

Thanks! How come sometimes the family bedroom is cheaper than a roomette?

 

[Trogdor]

How come sometimes the family bedroom is cheaper than a roomette?

Each type of sleeper accommodation works separately for buckets, as well. The lower buckets of a family room may be cheaper than the high buckets of a roomette for a given city pair.

 

[mwmnp]

Maintenance crews on Friday started busily working at getting the tracks through Minot back into operable condition. Per a BNSF employee at Minot, BNSF tentatively plans to have one track open through Minot by tomorrow (July 3rd) afternoon.

Turns out that was too optimistic of a plan and the tracks remain closed. Nevertheless, BNSF and contractors are working very hard on raising the track and getting the subgrade dry in order to run trains through Minot again. From what I heard, BNSF seems to be so committed to getting at least one track open as quick as possible that trains may be running with water still high enough to touch the ties. Several trains are already waiting on either side of the flooded area in anticipation of the reopening.

Picture of the Mouse River bridges on Friday, when work began in earnest to reopen one of the tracks.



Copyright: cu.minotdailynews.com

 

[anir dendroica]

I would hate to be the engineer of the first train across that bridge. I suppose they will push some loaded cars across it first as a makeshift "inspection".

Mark

 

[js]

Planning to travel East on the EB leaving July 14th. So far I am 'reassured' by Amtrak that all is good. Any on the ground updates as to the track status and repair progress?

 

[Shanghai]

From various photos I have seen, it is going to take a great deal of work and time

to restore the tracks for passenger service.

 

[jb64]

Can you tell me what requirements differ for passenger service as opposed to freight? I honestly don't know and am curious. If BNSF thinks they can have trains moving by the end of this week, what more will need to be done to get Amtrak moving across these lines? I have an upcoming trip on the EB and therefore have an interest as to whether we will be going via alternate transportation.

Thanks,

 

[jmbgeg]

How come sometimes the family bedroom is cheaper than a roomette?

Each type of sleeper accommodation works separately for buckets, as well. The lower buckets of a family room may be cheaper than the high buckets of a roomette for a given city pair.

I have found family bedrooms below deluxe bedrooms with like regularity.

 

[anir dendroica]

Can you tell me what requirements differ for passenger service as opposed to freight? I honestly don't know and am curious. If BNSF thinks they can have trains moving by the end of this week, what more will need to be done to get Amtrak moving across these lines? I have an upcoming trip on the EB and therefore have an interest as to whether we will be going via alternate transportation.

Thanks,

I imagine that BNSF will want to do a more careful inspection of the bridges before letting Amtrak across. But with the river dropping steadily, that should be complete by the end of the week. The next question is whether Amtrak will re-start service using the direct route from Minot to Fargo (bypassing Rugby, Devils Lake, and Grand Forks) or whether they will wait for the line through Devils Lake to reopen. The Devils Lake line crosses the Souris River near Towner, and the track in that area is in pretty bad shape. Furthermore, since Towner is about 60 miles downstream of Minot, it will take longer for the river to recede there.

Photos taken near Towner on June 30:

http://www.bnsf.com/customers/pdf/weather/2011-07-01a.pdf

Mark

 

[bretton88]

Well, Amtrak has the train sold out until the 19th, thats probably a bad sign for travel beforehand.

 

[Amtrak George]

PASSENGER TRAINS AND HIGH WATER: The line will be okay for freight for at least several days before it is opened for passenger. It is okay as a calculated risk to tiptoe through high water with cargo, but running a trainload of passengers through track that you can barely see and that may be undermined is too dangerous for BNSF to take a risk. In addition, there will be so many slow orders, and soft track, as well as a bunch of freights that are taking forever to traverse their runs. This line is already running at capacity when it is dry. With Amtrak's equipment shortage and long crew districts, they can't afford to literally run a day late. That said, I'm still hoping things get better ASAP!

 

[Eric308]

Well, Amtrak has the train sold out until the 19th, thats probably a bad sign for travel beforehand.

I find that to be a strange coincidence...I think they are just saying "sold out" and don't actually plan on running until then.

 

[Carol]

Thank you all so much, for sharing the information that you have.

When I first became aware of the probable impact of the flooding on a July 9 EB trip, I used Google and found this thread. By reading it, and the online Minot newspaper, I was able to decide that I'd better make alternate travel plans. By the time the call came from Amtrak cancelling my train I had decided to drive the 1400 miles instead and had taken the steps to make that happen. My daughter and I have taken the EB the last couple of summers - Seattle to Fargo. We loved it and will miss this year's trip. We'll hope that next year will bring no flooding.

 

[Bruce-C]

Can you tell me what requirements differ for passenger service as opposed to freight? I honestly don't know and am curious. If BNSF thinks they can have trains moving by the end of this week, what more will need to be done to get Amtrak moving across these lines? I have an upcoming trip on the EB and therefore have an interest as to whether we will be going via alternate transportation.

Thanks,

I imagine that BNSF will want to do a more careful inspection of the bridges before letting Amtrak across. But with the river dropping steadily, that should be complete by the end of the week. The next question is whether Amtrak will re-start service using the direct route from Minot to Fargo (bypassing Rugby, Devils Lake, and Grand Forks) or whether they will wait for the line through Devils Lake to reopen. The Devils Lake line crosses the Souris River near Towner, and the track in that area is in pretty bad shape. Furthermore, since Towner is about 60 miles downstream of Minot, it will take longer for the river to recede there.

Photos taken near Towner on June 30:

http://www.bnsf.com/...2011-07-01a.pdf

Mark

I would have to think that the Corp of Engineers would have something to say about the bridge inspections and declaring them OK for any use. The last thing anyone needs is a freight car in the drink.

 

[mwmnp]

After nearly 10 and a half days of being out of service, one of the tracks through Minot was reopened at around 9:00 PM Central Time on Monday, July 4. Since then, a continuous fleet of freight trains has traversed the still-soggy tracks through the city. The trains are being asked to go 10 mph east of the Mouse River bridge and at a walking speed west of the bridge. So far, so good.