Nevada Wash Out Repairs on the California Zephyr Route

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Tennessee Traveler

Tennessee Traveler

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Apr 11, 2010
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Franklin, TN
Just wondering if anyone knows how long Union Pacific has reported that the repairs to the tracks washed out east of Elko, NV, will take and when the CZ can be expected to go beyond Salt Lake City on to Emeryville. Are we talking days, weeks, or months? Yes, I plan to be on the Zephyr near mid April both directions.
 
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Discussions over on trainorders.com strongly suggest that the CZ will not run west of SLC until March. But there is no guarantee that service will be restored by March 1.
 
According to Union Pacific, the tracks that the CZ normally uses are back in service, but is plagued by delays, and alternative routes have not yet been repaired (Elko-Ogden, Portola-Winnemucca, and Oroville-Portola). The flood waters had left Elko, but is headed to Winnemucca, which can strike a blow on the trackage there. I'm sure that Amtrak is waiting for the guarantee that the repairs are structually sound, and for the other trackage to open. It will be interesting to see how things play out for the next few weeks. The Zephyr is going to disrupted for a while, at least a couple of weeks, if what the guys on Train Orders are saying are true. Here's what the UP says about regarding the situation: https://www.up.com/customers/announcements/customernews/generalannouncements/CN2017-14.html
 
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I see the problems that UP has, but it looks on the diagram like a line exists between Sparks and Portola. I thought that was an old Western Pacific branch that is mostly abandoned, having driven past it in recent years. Is there some other line between those points? I know UP normally runs directionally westbound via Portola and eastbound via Reno. I think crews are transported by road between those two lines, or am I mistaken?
 
It fairly academic that the Reno-Portorla (ex WP, ex NCO) branch is in service. Nothing is moving east or west of Portola.

The problem for UP and Amtrak is that ALL UP freight has to be that would be on the ex-WP has to be rerouted over the ex-SP Sacramento to Winnemucca and everything that went ex-SP Wells to Odgen must go ex-WP Wells to Salt Lake City. There is too much freight and too little double track or sidings to do this efficiently. In addition BNSF lost the inside gateway Klamath Falls-Beiber-Sacramento so this freight also has to be re-routed.

The Winnemucca to Wells track is at risk to high water in places. Eastern Nevada drains west on the Humbolt River into the Humbolt Sink just east of Reno. That sink can only absorb so much water before becoming a lake with high water on the Humbolt. In the early 1900's this took out the narrow gauge Eureka and Palisade RR and flooded the SP for several months (WP had not yet been built). Normally dry hillsides and subgrades are likely near saturation so they may move or shift in ways they have not in over 100 years. Very risky and "interesting" until things dry out.

On the flip side, if you can plan a trip on CZ the desert will be blooming in the spring. Plants that wait 100 years for a water event like this will be in flower and everything else will have the plant attitude of "WATER! lets grow!".
 
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Thank you. I am just questioning why a line on their diagram shows from the Reno- Sparks area when it obviously had not been in use for some time. I understand the rest of your explanation.
 
Most UP maps still show the Reno - Reno Junction line as being active. I thought there were several locations up near Reno-Stead airport that were still being served for local jobs, but I don't know how good of shape the track is between there and and Reno Junction / Portorla.

What does the CZ do when it has to detour on the Feather River route? Does it do that in Winnemucca? I also assumed it just went up this route from Reno?
 
kbmiflyer said:
Most UP maps still show the Reno - Reno Junction line as being active. I thought there were several locations up near Reno-Stead airport that were still being served for local jobs, but I don't know how good of shape the track is between there and and Reno Junction / Portorla.

What does the CZ do when it has to detour on the Feather River route? Does it do that in Winnemucca? I also assumed it just went up this route from Reno?
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From what I hear, the CZ for the time being turns at SLC due to floods, and most likely won't be another week or two before it starts running to Emeryville. Track is open but congested due to other lines being closed. UP is basically requesting Amtrak to wait until other lines reopen.
 
kbmiflyer said:
Most UP maps still show the Reno - Reno Junction line as being active. I thought there were several locations up near Reno-Stead airport that were still being served for local jobs, but I don't know how good of shape the track is between there and and Reno Junction / Portorla.

What does the CZ do when it has to detour on the Feather River route? Does it do that in Winnemucca? I also assumed it just went up this route from Reno?
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I am not pretending to be the expert, but my original question was why that route showed on the UP diagram showing what is currently out due to the flooding. In 2015 and 16 I was on road trips and one night even camped out at a Forest Service Campground on the Feather River, on the opposite bank from the old WP, which was pretty busy and stayed one night at a B&B opposite the yard in Portola. I observed the WP line on the California side heading off to the northeast and the branch line headed south toward Reno, which appeared to be intact, but long out of use, except, for, as you say, some local businesses around Reno. Certainly Amtrak would not detour up that way from Reno. If Amtrak should be detoured, that would be done in the Winnemucca area.
 
If this situation appears to be long in correcting maybe UP will upgrade the branch ? Bet they could do it in a week with another week for track to become fixated ?

It may be Amtrak can get other quid pro quo from UP in return for not operating the CAL Z ?

With the Empire builder now operating maybe Amtrak can route passengers either Builder - Starlight or SW Limited - Starlight ? Intermediate passengers on CAL Z can be routed DEN - Raton and SW Limited.
 
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With the disruption being prolonged, hope they will restore the CZ when the problem is over rather than discontinuing it altogether. It would be bad to see the CZ go and share the fate of the SL (not to mention dropping Nevada off coverage), as I will be riding it in the near future.
 
The Feather River Canyon route of the UP runs between Portola and Oroville and is completely out of service for the time being due to several slipouts and washouts.
 
bmjhagen9426 said:
With the disruption being prolonged, hope they will restore the CZ when the problem is over rather than discontinuing it altogether. It would be bad to see the CZ go and share the fate of the SL (not to mention dropping Nevada off coverage), as I will be riding it in the near future.
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Update: My previous post was out of paranoia. I think I found my answer. I looked up CZ from CHI to EMY leaving on May Day (or Amtrak Day), and was bookable, which means that it is going to be reinstated eventually, in March or April.
 
Having experienced the severe flooding in Texas in 2015, I know the UP was pre-staging to fix their main lines ASAP. The back up of freights took a long time for Dispatchers to sort out and prioritize. Amtrak eventually was squeezed in so normal passenger operations could resume. First the flooding has to recede and no additional torrential rains so the soil can dry some. That area still has to deal with heavy spring snow melting flooding.
 
Lonestar648 said:
Having experienced the severe flooding in Texas in 2015, I know the UP was pre-staging to fix their main lines ASAP. The back up of freights took a long time for Dispatchers to sort out and prioritize. Amtrak eventually was squeezed in so normal passenger operations could resume. First the flooding has to recede and no additional torrential rains so the soil can dry some. That area still has to deal with heavy spring snow melting flooding.
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No heavy rains are forecasted for the next week, but some moderate rain and snow. Which could complicate the flooding. Winnemucca is the last place to be hit with the flood waters (Wonder where it flows after that). Elko, Carlin, and Wells have started to see the flood waters recede, albeit slowly. The river is the main problem, as the flood waters has to go somewhere. I would call this a storm of the century for Nevada. Surprisingly, no alerts remain for the CZ cancellation.

It makes sense that the CZ SLC-EMY is slow to be reinstated, aside from weather. According to the UP bulletin, other routes are still blocked (no freights can get thru), including the Feather River route and the Elko-Ogden line. Which causes freight traffic to severely be backed up, as there's only one available route to go from Northern California to points east. I would not be surprised if UPRR has requested Amtrak to delay reinstatement of CZ runs west of SLC due to freight traffic backups, as there is no room to squeeze the CZ into the trackage at this point.
 
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From the pictures (links on one of the earlier threads) that I saw earlier this, the tracks that were washed out and probably going to need a lot of work to bring them back up.

With all the snowpack it's going to be a very wet spring and maybe even summer in the west (I remember driving on US 50 - the "loneliest highway" through western Utah in the 80's through massive floodwaters to the point that the highway had to be raised on a travel bed to be passable) - the desert can only absorb so much water, depending on soils locally, before it becomes runoff.
 
With fleeting of freights a CAL Z going the opposite direction would really face major delays. Makes sense and maybe Amtrak can receive some quid pro quo somewhere else ?

It just goes to show with the monstor length trains now operated the need for longer sidings is very much needed. That is even on directional runnings such as this route, the front range in Colorado, New CSX in Ohio, etc.
 
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Now that the Oroville evacuation orders have been lifted has that helped Amtrak at all?

This is sure gonna be a messy spring out west!
 
Don't be surprised if/when Oroville Evacuation goes back into effect over the coming days. Multiple storm systems expected through Monday.
 
According to Boilingman on Trainorders, Amtrak is planning to resume the full schedule Chicago to Emeryville beginning from both Emeryville and Chicago Monday, February 20. At the same time another set of equipment already in Reno will begin the trip westbound to Emeryville to be the train 6 of Feb. 21. Also the train arriving in Salt Lake City February 20 will continue on to Emeryville to be train 6 of Feb. 22. Thus all CZ equipment will be in place to provide regular service. Let's hope this all works out.
 
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