Amfleet Food Service Cars Get Rebuilt
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Amfleet
Engineer
I have to say it's about time. No longer will passengers be forced to bring food back to their seats or eat on tiny pedistal stools. Now, there will be 14 booth style tables for passengers to enjoy their food and come for a change in pace.
AMTRAK-P42
Conductor
That is great news. There will finally be ample space, I tend to sit in the lounge the whole lenght of the trip anyways (the daylight portion) whenever I travel on single-level trains, so this is perfect.
Amfleet
Engineer
I also forgot to mention that from looking at the photo that the luggage racks were not removed, but kept in place. This will probably allow the Cafe Attendant to store extra inventory in the racks instead of taking up two booth tables.
battalion51
Engineer
I don't believe that the Amfleet II Lounges are going to be affected by these rebuilds, just Amfleet I.
Amfleet
Engineer
Who knows. After the removal of the video screens in the Sleepers, I think some sort of video entertainment system should be put in the Lounge. I would remove the smoking room altogether and just make the car a full dinette with the snack bar and a few tv monitors scattered about.battalion51 said:
I don't knoow about that one. They have movies in the sightseer lounge cars, and they tend to detract from the trip as far as I am concerned. However, most of the passengers like them, so I gues it would be ok. I just could skip that whole thing though and look out the window.Amfleet said:
Amfleet
Engineer
Movies are generally shown in the evening anyway (after dark in the winter months), though cartoons may be shown during the afternoon. Though, I fully enjoy looking out the window, it is nice to have the option of movie entertainment.Steve4031 said:I don't knoow about that one. They have movies in the sightseer lounge cars, and they tend to detract from the trip as far as I am concerned. However, most of the passengers like them, so I gues it would be ok. I just could skip that whole thing though and look out the window.Amfleet said:
I am a little confused........will any of these three designs have regular lounge seating, similar to a superliner lounge, or will it all be cafe-style tables?
Viewliner
Engineer
Bill its either, all tables, half tables-half club seating, or full club cars. The more consistant we are and the less variants we have will make operations more efficient.
battalion51
Engineer
Umm, Amfleet the rebuilt Amfleet II's all have a video entertainment system. :lol: As of that smoking room, if Amtrak ever takes those out Washington'll be hearing from me real quick. Smoking stops, and smokers with no smoking room are THE biggest pain in the butt on this planet. Many of them get off at stops where they shouldn't to smoke, and some will even smoke in the vestibules. KEEP THOSE SMOKING ROOMS!Amfleet said:
AMTRAK-P42
Conductor
I have to agree here. Last trip on the Crescent, back in August there were a crowd of people around the vestibule before the extended stop at Birmingham just to get a smoke in. We ended up having switch trouble in the yard, but they all stood crowding the doors for 50 minutes because they had no where else to smoke.battalion51 said:
Finally when we did stop, cigarettes in hand, they all jumped off exclaiming "oh thank god". It was amusing to watch, but annoying to listen to before everystop on the trip. I remember one such instance where the lady tried to light up while the train was still moving, just because the vestibule was open.
battalion51
Engineer
Doing that sort of stuff can get you thrown off the train with the right Conductor. I've seen it happy and had a smile on my face the whole time.
Viewliner
Engineer
I guess the best solution, and one that I hope will be implimented with the next generation of equipment (Viewliners, if we can ever get them) is to put a smoking room in some coaches, and make sure the box does a hell of a job isolating the smoke. With the Amfleet II Lounges and video equipment "if you have it, use it." B)
Battalion, I'd pay the fare to see that. :lol:
Battalion, I'd pay the fare to see that. :lol:
P
PennsyFan
Guest
As an added point, whatever our feelings about smokers, they do pay full fare, and Amtrak needs all the money it can get. Given the current policies about smoking on airplanes, Amtrak has a competetive advantage by being able to allow smokers to light up on board. As long as the smoking rooms are well-ventilated, there's no reason not to let Amtrak keep a good source of revenue.
By the way, why not have the last and first car on all long-distance trains with more than two sleepers be a smoking car. That way, there's no need for smoking stops or a smoking room in the lounge. Passengers don't have to walk through the last or first car unless they want to, so it won't impose second hand smoke on non-smokers. The only issue I could see would be cleaning - you would probably need seperate equipment pools for smoking and non-smoking, and knowing Amtrak they probably would manage to get themselves into a situation where they needed to use the wrong sort of car in order to fill out a consist.
By the way, why not have the last and first car on all long-distance trains with more than two sleepers be a smoking car. That way, there's no need for smoking stops or a smoking room in the lounge. Passengers don't have to walk through the last or first car unless they want to, so it won't impose second hand smoke on non-smokers. The only issue I could see would be cleaning - you would probably need seperate equipment pools for smoking and non-smoking, and knowing Amtrak they probably would manage to get themselves into a situation where they needed to use the wrong sort of car in order to fill out a consist.
Exactly. Scenario: some non-smoking car would be bad ordered and the only replacement available would be a smoking car. A passenger with asthma and some allergy to cigarette smoke gets placed in this car, thinking it was a non-smoking car to begin with. Passenger has medical problems on board due to their allergy. Passenger sues Amtrak for cost of medical bills and breach of contract.PennsyFan said:
battalion51
Engineer
It's that different pools of equipment that's the hard part. You want to streamline as much as possible with consistency. Also, you would have to make sure that you have 60 smokers in a coach to make it economically sensible, otherwise space is being wasted. A properly ventilated box in each coach makes the best sense anyway.
Viewliner
Engineer
Exactly, and that relates to the original story, the whole goal of reducing the number of types of food service cars is consistancy. Consistancy makes for an efficient operation, and its what customers (although not really railfans) expect, and we all want.battalion51 said:
Amfleet
Engineer
While the Amfleet II's still have a good 20-25 years left in them (if maintained properly) why not do this. Remanufacture all 24 Amfleet II Lounges into full dinette configurations. Take 30 Amfleet II Coaches and remanufacture them with 1/3 of the car being an enclosed smoking room and the other 2/3 Coach seating. The remaining 85 Amfleet II Coaches would just be remanufactured into the same design as they already are. This way each single level long-distance train would have an Amfleet I Dinette or Amfleet II Lounge (depending on equipment avalibility), an Amfleet II Coach Smoking, and 2-5 regular Amfleet II Coaches. Of course a Viewliner Baggage Dorm, 2-3 Viewliner Sleepers, and a Viewliner Diner would be in the lead in front of the Amfleets.
Viewliner
Engineer
That could work, except maybe to give a uniform look to Long Distance trains while addressing Short Distance and Long Distance Fleet Issues, maybe deploy the Amfleet II's into Corridor Service as Business Class/Food Service. (Though that would defeat the Coach Smoking Rebuild for the Amfleets). Deploy Viewliner Sleepers, Coaches, Lounges, Baggage cars, and Dorms (Though with a Conductors Office and a couple of tables instead of the baggage areas.)
Typical Consist:
Viewliner Baggage
Viewliner Dorm
Viewliner Sleeper
Viewliner Sleeper or Deluxe Sleeper (if Ridership Warrants)
(Viewliner Lounge for FC on "Premier" Routes like the Meteor, if Fleet Allows)
Viewliner Sleeper
Viewliner Diner
Viewliner Lounge
Viewliner Coach Smoking
Viewliner Coach
Viewliner Coach
Viewliner Coach
(Viewliner Coach when ridership warrants)
Typical Consist:
Viewliner Baggage
Viewliner Dorm
Viewliner Sleeper
Viewliner Sleeper or Deluxe Sleeper (if Ridership Warrants)
(Viewliner Lounge for FC on "Premier" Routes like the Meteor, if Fleet Allows)
Viewliner Sleeper
Viewliner Diner
Viewliner Lounge
Viewliner Coach Smoking
Viewliner Coach
Viewliner Coach
Viewliner Coach
(Viewliner Coach when ridership warrants)
EmpireBuilderFan
Lead Service Attendant
This sounds pretty similar to what Superliner equipped trains use as a set up. The only thing I would personally change is to use the Viewliner Coach Smoking at the end of the train, as PennsyFan recommended. That way, those of us who don't smoke don't have to worry about walking through a smoking coach, because the Superliner smoking coaches tend to smell pretty much like an ashtray after a few hours on the road just due to the traffic in and out of the smoking room.Viewliner said:
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Guest_F59 PHI
Guest
Nah-- Amcoach and Amlounge IIs should stay on LD lines. Viewliners and Amfleets look decent when in the same train. It is the heritage diners that look bad...especially the noncorrigated ones.
Viewliner
Engineer
Empire Builder Fan, the Smoking Coach would be a la Amfleet II Lounge. It would have the "penalty box". The Amfleet II Lounges actually do a very good job, in that I haven't noticed the smoke smell in any of the refurbished lounges. As long as the smoking room does the job right, it would work out better having it situated mid-train, plus at least I think I remember Battalion bringing up, that the lounge does good business with smoke. But, I guess the Smoker could be at the rear, or it may just wind up in random order.
F59, I guess maybe some of the better patronized trains (i.e. the ones that have all Amfleet II's now, like the Crescent, Silver Meteor, Silver Star) would get Viewliners, and the less patronized trains (ones with a mix of say Amfleet II, and Horizon/Amfleet I like the Three Rivers) could get Amfleet II's now. Still if there are any left they could be used in corridor service.
F59, I guess maybe some of the better patronized trains (i.e. the ones that have all Amfleet II's now, like the Crescent, Silver Meteor, Silver Star) would get Viewliners, and the less patronized trains (ones with a mix of say Amfleet II, and Horizon/Amfleet I like the Three Rivers) could get Amfleet II's now. Still if there are any left they could be used in corridor service.
battalion51
Engineer
Amfleet, I think you're still missing the point. You want a streamlined fleet, one type of car for each variety (one type of diner, one type of sleeper, one type of lounge, one type of coach). It makes the most sense to rebuild all the Amfleets with eight tables on one side, and the smoking room on the other. It's a rare ocassion that all the tables are filled, and usually only right after the lounges opens/closes. I sit in that Lounge for 8-12 hours a day, and it's rare that all the tables are so full that people have to share tables, and that's even with one or two tables taken up by the crew (and myself, I share with the Conductor when possible). Now, if you want to rebuild ALL the coaches with a small smoking room for 4-5 people (as some of the early Heritage Coaches had), I can see putting tables on both sides of the lounge. But, in a long distance train, you want a stramlined consist, with as few varities as possible.
Viewliner
Engineer
Although, Battalion, you could do as you said with all of the coaches, but for the Lounge, where the smoking room is right now, maybe just add three more tables on one side of the car (B end three windows), and put a conductors office on the other half of the car. You'd gain at least four tables, since the coach conductor (if not both conductors) would no longer be occupying the one-two tables in the lounge, and would be able to have a better place to get organized.
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