Amtrak California Thruway Bus Service

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Allen Dee

Lead Service Attendant
Joined
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305
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Santa Barbara, CA
Amtrak California today operates more bus service within the state than Greyhound does.

Several years ago, Greyhound lobbied the state legislature to prevent this from happening. As a result, a law was passed that the dedicated feeder routes could only transport passengers who traveled a portion of their trip by rail.

Can any of the forum members tell me the law number and the approximate date that it was passed?

I would appreciate any and all responses.
 
"Can any of the forum members tell me the law number and the approximate date that it was passed?"

A Google search on "Greyhound law Amtrak California" yielded this lengthy thing from a state site:

BILL

ANALYSIS

{u SB 804

u} Page 1

Date of Hearing: July 12, 1999

ASSEMBLY COMMITTEE ON TRANSPORTATION

Tom Torlakson, Chair

SB 804 (Perata) - As Amended: May 28, 1999

{u SENATE VOTE u} : 26-10

{u

SUBJECT u} : Transportation: rail feeder bus service

{u SUMMARY u} : Establishes statutory guidelines regarding the

expenditure by the Department of Transportation (Caltrans), or a

designated successor, of state funds for rail feeder bus

service. Specifically, {u this bill u} :

1)Sets forth declarations and findings regarding the promotionof intermodal transportation and coordination of interregionaltransportation.

2)Requires, to the extent permitted under federal law, Caltransto encourage the National Railroad Passenger Corporation(Amtrak) to coordinate routes, rates, and ticketing as a means to enhance intermodal transportation and thereby improve service throughout the state.

3)Specifies that Caltrans may provide funding to Amtrak for the purpose of entering into a contract with a motor carrier to provide rail feeder bus service under the following conditions:

a) The motor carrier is not a recipient of governmental assistance, as defined under federal law. The bill specifies that this restriction shall not apply in cases where a local public motor carrier proposes to serve passengers only within its service area.

B ) The service is provided only for trips where the

passengers have had prior movement by rail or will have subsequent movement by rail.

c) The bill also requires that motor carrier vehicles that are used to provide feeder service as described in ( B ) be used solely for that purpose.

d) The motor carrier is registered with the United States

{u SB 804

u} Page 2

Department of Transportation (USDOT) and operates in

compliance with federal safety regulations and provides service that is accessible to persons with disabilities in compliance with the Americans with Disabilities Act.

4)Requires Caltrans to incorporate the above-specified

guidelines into agreements with motor carriers for the

provision of passenger rail feeder service. The agreements shall also specify that a breach of those conditions shall be grounds for termination of the agreements.

{u EXISTING LAW:

u} 1)Authorizes Caltrans to enter into contracts with the National Railroad Passenger Corporation (Amtrak) to provide commuter and intercity passenger rail services. The contracts may include, but are not limited to, the extension of intericty passenger rail services or the upgrading of commuter rail services.

2)Authorizes Caltrans to enter into contracts with common

carriers, as defined, or with any other entity, for the

provision of feeder bus services to and from rail passenger terminals or intercity bus transportation.

{u FISCAL EFFECT u} : Unknown

{u COMMENTS u} : Under current law, Caltrans contracts with Amtrak and its subcontractors to provide bus service to and from rail stations for rail passengers with Amtrak tickets. This service is generally "closed door" service, restricting bus riders to those with Amtrak tickets and excluding those who only want to

ride the bus. This restriction is intended to protect Greyhound and other "for-profit" intercity bus operators from competition by the publicly-subsidized rail feeder bus operators.

According to the sponsors, in many cases, they can provide the same service as part of their regularly-scheduled service without public subsidies. The objective of this bill is to encourage Caltrans to utilize already available service.

According to the author, Caltrans subsidizes the operation of intercity passenger rail service in California, including the operation of feeder bus service to and along those rail lines.

The state's share for intercity rail operation costs, including feeder bus service, have increased at a rate of approximately 30

{u SB 804

u} Page 3

percent a year -- from $29 million in fiscal year 1994-95 to $63 million in fiscal year 1998-99.

Greyhound Lines, the sponsor of this measure, contends there have been instances, for example, where government-subsidized intercity feeder bus operators have solicited passengers in the Greyhound station facilities, offering to carry the passengers for less than the Greyhound ticket price. The sponsor indicates the purpose of this bill to eliminate such unfair competition.

The bill requires Caltrans to incorporate the specified

conditions into state-supported passenger rail feeder bus

service agreements between Amtrak and motor carriers of

passengers. The bus service agreements shall also provide that a breach of those conditions shall be grounds for termination of the agreements.

Caltrans currently maintains contracts for 17 intercity bus feeder routes that operate as an integral part of the intercity passenger rail service. This bus feeder service for rail passengers, provided on a contractual basis with Amtrak and its subcontractors and known as the Amtrak California Thruway Bus network, provides rail passengers with an assured connection to and from the train, with combined bus-train tickets and guaranteed seating on the bus.

{u Author's Amendments u} : The author has indicated that he intends to offer amendments that would address concerns raised by Amtrak and others regarding provisions in the bill that would restrict the ability of Caltrans to contract with Amtrak for bus service.

The amendments would:

1)Exempt federally-authorized programs that provide intercity bus service in rural areas of the state from the provisions in the bill (as described in Item #3(a) of the Summary section of this analysis) that prohibit motor carriers that receive governmental assistance from competing for rail feeder bus service.

2)Add clarifying language to provisions in the bill (described in Item #3( B ) of the Summary section of this analysis) that requires rail feeder bus service to be provided for trips that begin or end with movement by rail. The amendments would specify that passengers should be holding tickets that authorize roundtrip or one-way trips by rail/bus combination.

{u SB 804

u} Page 4

3)Add language to the bill that would specify that Caltrans is authorized to provide funding to Amtrak to contract with motor carriers to transport its passengers on buses provided that the vehicles are operated as part of a regularly scheduled, daily bus service that has been operating consecutively without an Amtrak contract for 12 months immediately prior to the contract agreement.

{u REGISTERED SUPPORT / OPPOSITION u} :

{u Support u}

Greyhound Lines Incorporated (sponsor)

Amalgamated Transit Union

California Conference Board of the Amalgamated Transit Union

{u

Opposition u}

California Bus Association

Planning and Conservation League

Rail Passenger Association of California

Southern California Transit Advocates

Train Rider's Association of California

{uAnalysis Prepared by u} : Andrew Antwih / TRANS. / (916) 319-2093
 
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I swear I didn't put those smiley faces in there.
The code for that particular smiley face is "b)", so any time you type that you'll get a smiley face. I have no idea why they choose that particular code, but they did. The only way to stop that is to put a space between the b and the ). I've gone ahead and edited your post to add that space and make things look a bit better.
 
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Awhile back, I had a friend who attempted to board an Amtrak California Thruway Bus between two points that are no longer served by Greyhound and was denied boarding. However, the law still remains in effect. It is time for this law to be repealed or amended.
 
I guess that Amtrak needs to know that they have bus seats for rail passengers arriving or traveling onwards by train. For example, it might be awkward if all the bus seats between Emeryville ans San Francisco were taken by local (non Amtrak) commuters? Would the modest amount of revenue raised be worth the logistical difficulties. After all, one can pre book on Amtrak, one can't on Greyhound.

Ed. B)
 
I guess that Amtrak needs to know that they have bus seats for rail passengers arriving or traveling onwards by train. For example, it might be awkward if all the bus seats between Emeryville ans San Francisco were taken by local (non Amtrak) commuters? Would the modest amount of revenue raised be worth the logistical difficulties. After all, one can pre book on Amtrak, one can't on Greyhound.Ed. B)
Ed,

Except that is how most of the other Thruway buses actually operate.

Several years back I watched a disaster in the making where close to 20 people got off the Pennsylvanian in Toledo with Thruway tickets to a bus going to Detroit. The bus pulled up, the driver announced that he had only two seats available and ran out of the building. And Greyhound knew that Amtrak had sold those seats already, in fact some of those people had brought their tickets months in advance. But Greyhound didn't care!
 
Alan,

You cited a perfect example of why Amtrak California no longer contracts with Greyhound for thruway bus service.

For decades, Greyhound provided the majority of the thruway bus service in California, but not any more.

The thruway bus service between LAUS and Las Vegas, which is operated by Greyhound, is contracted by Amtrak (national), not Amtrak California. Those Amtrak passengers arriving at LAUS and desiring bus connections to Las Vegas would be much better off using Megabus.
 
Obviously this can't happen at every bus stop, but I understood that Greyhound had a policy of no overbooked busses. Basically, they would keep adding busses to a particular time table until the passengers were all collected.
 
Obviously this can't happen at every bus stop, but I understood that Greyhound had a policy of no overbooked busses. Basically, they would keep adding busses to a particular time table until the passengers were all collected.
But sometimes this means wait a while. A few years ago I had the experiece in Nashville, going to Memphis. The filled the first bus, knowing that a second would be required, so that bus was also filled and there were several people left over, including me. It took them something over an hour to scrounge up a third bus. My son who was to meet me in Memphis was told after the second bus arrived that there was no third bus, so he went back home. So I had to call him to come back in.
 
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