Amtrak Dining and Cafe service 2023 H2

[jis]

The real problem with serving coach passengers in the dining car is that the number of reservations are limited, and that it's often impossible to find the LSA who is willing to make the reservation. Thus, you can't be sure that you'll even be able to eat in the dining car, even if you're cool with paying Amtrak $50 for your meal.

That is why I think they should figure out a way to pre-sell meal packages of various sizes i.e. Dinner only, Breakfast only, all three meals etc. That way you know before hand where you will be eating instead of playing Roulette of the Russian kind with your meals.

This will also help them figure out and manage their own inventory better. So probably they won't do it. Cynic? Moi?

 

[wrowland]

I just priced my local Texas Roadhouse. A strip steak dinner with appetizer, salad and dessert, plus a non alcoholic and alcoholic beverage is about $45. Plus sales tax and tip. I would think a $5 upcharge for being a captive audience and getting the dining car experience isn't too unreasonable.

The real problem with serving coach passengers in the dining car is that the number of reservations are limited, and that it's often impossible to find the LSA who is willing to make the reservation. Thus, you can't be sure that you'll even be able to eat in the dining car, even if you're cool with paying Amtrak $50 for your meal.

As stated earlier, I stand corrected. Too bad about staff being unwilling to do something that, at the surface, appears to be part of thier job. This seems to be a recurring theme at times on these threads.

That is why I think they should figure out a way to pre-sell meal packages of various sizes i.e. Dinner only, Breakfast only, all three meals etc. That way you know before hand where you will be eating instead of playing Roulette of the Russian kind with your meals.

I like this idea; why aren't you in charge over there!?

 

[lordsigma]

I like this idea; why aren't you in charge over there!?

He’d have my vote for the Amtrak board.

 

[tgstubbs1]

That is why I think they should figure out a way to pre-sell meal packages of various sizes i.e. Dinner only, Breakfast only, all three meals etc. That way you know before hand where you will be eating instead of playing Roulette of the Russian kind with your meals.

It seems like they could just have a button on the reservation app for coach dining, just like they have other options.

 

[railiner]

Cynic? Moi?

Hey! I resemble that remark...

 

[Willbridge]

I agree...there was never an 'option' to accept or decline for a credit, meal service on Amtrak, once it became all-inclusive for sleeper passengers. The Slumbercoach was not considered "first class" during the brief time they still operated at the beginning of the all-inclusive era, hence meals were not included.

Prior to Amtrak, some railroads, notably the Santa Fe, did offer a meal plan for those that wished to purchase it. I believe it was offered to both sleeper and coach passengers. Sort of like resorts that offer "European Plan", or "American Plan" (two or three daily meals included) rates. It yielded a nice discount for those travelling through several meal periods, compared to the ala carte pricing.

 

[danasgoodstuff]

As discussed on this site previously, trad dining for coach passengers, when available is currently $20 breakfast, $25 lunch, $45 dinner (including desert and 1 alcoholic drink). If I was travelling coach and had this option, I would probably do one or two meals/day, and cafe or what I brought with me for the others, but it would depend on travel time and other factors. Yes, I'm cheap. But not fanatically so.

 

[lordsigma]

As someone who goes out to eat quite a lot Amtrak’s prices are well in line with the current going rate. One would expect a bit of a premium given its on board a train and the related costs associated with that just as food and beverage in any captive venue has a premium associated with it. Considering all that it really isn’t that bad.

 

[JWM]

View attachment 33464

Thanks for posting this as I was going to . Also, the "California Zephur" had an "early" dining offer for dinner too.

 

[AFriendly]

I agree...there was never an 'option' to accept or decline for a credit, meal service on Amtrak, once it became all-inclusive for sleeper passengers. The Slumbercoach was not considered "first class" during the brief time they still operated at the beginning of the all-inclusive era, hence meals were not included.

Prior to Amtrak, some railroads, notably the Santa Fe, did offer a meal plan for those that wished to purchase it. I believe it was offered to both sleeper and coach passengers. Sort of like resorts that offer "European Plan", or "American Plan" (two or three daily meals included) rates. It yielded a nice discount for those travelling through several meal periods, compared to the ala carte pricing.

Much love for the slumbercoaches for their price though- if the most important thing to you was privacy and a bed, and you weren't going to need to have all 3 meals in the diner it was a good deal. You bring up a good point- there's a need for an "unbundled" sleeper experience for those on board for just one night or people with smaller budgets. I used to think that the classic open section was the best way to go, but some other railroads in Europe are introducing sleeping pods which is interesting. There's also the lie-flat thing, but since that comes from airlines it triggers my allergies haha...

 

[tgstubbs1]

As discussed on this site previously, trad dining for coach passengers, when available is currently $20 breakfast, $25 lunch, $45 dinner (including desert and 1 alcoholic drink). If I was travelling coach and had this option, I would probably do one or two meals/day, and cafe or what

Five meals for $12 is $2.40 per meal. I wonder what the normal charge was in those days?
Amtrak charges $90 for a full day of meals. A meal ticket might have some discount but I don't know how much.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Five meals for $12 is $2.40 per meal. I wonder what the normal charge was in those days?
Amtrak charges $90 for a full day of meals. A meal ticket might have some discount but I don't know how much.

$2.40 per Meal back then was lots of Money! The Typical Blue Plate Special Lunch in Diners was about .35 cents!

The first time I ride on the Santa Fe I ate @ the Counter in the Cafe, had a Ham and Cheese Sandwich and a Glass of Milk for.30 Cents!

When I had my one Meal in the Diner on the Super Chief, it was $1.75Cents plus the Tip!( 25 Cents!)

 

[Yumacool]

I remember riding Santa Fe's "San Francisco Chief" with my father and younger brother in 1963. We had purchased the one-price meal tickets in advance, and it was a great experience. I was 11 years old at the time and did not like being limited to the child's menu. The waiter said I could order an adult meal "as long as I could eat it all." That's what I did for the entire trip. The meals included desserts at lunch and dinner, and the waiter always gave my younger brother (seven years old) a comparable dessert to make sure he didn't feel left out. I well remember that Santa Fe's blueberry pie was beyond delicious!

 

[AFriendly]

$2 in 1963 is approximately $20 today according to the consensus of various internet search results I got. Does today's quality match what AT&SF offered? Probably not, but something to think about anyway.

 

[Bob Dylan]

$2 in 1963 is approximately $20 today according to the consensus of various internet search results I got. Does today's quality match what AT&SF offered? Probably not, but something to think about anyway.

Not even close when it comes to the Quality of the Food( and the Service!)

 

[lordsigma]

Not even close when it comes to the Quality of the Food( and the Service!)

I'm sure but with respect most newer riders don't have the benefit of such a comparison - myself included. In those days there were also far more flights which offered meals outside of just first class, etc. Lots of things have changed. To many people who started riding more recently the dining car in its current form compares quite favorably to what's offered on other modes of travel which in some cases is nothing. I even met a couple once who were first time Amtrak riders and complemented FLEXIBLE dining because they were used to coach flights with absolutely nothing. Perspective is important to remember.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

Question on the set meal pricing - does this enable fewer employees? For example, since the LSA doesn't have to handle checks does that free them up to act as a waiter for a couple tables so there is one less employee per dining car?

Because that makes sense.

If we have the same number of employees but fewer options for affordable dining car service something is wrong.

For comparison - you could get a Steak dinner with baked potato and a side salad and a glass of water on Amtrak for $28.50 a few years ago. Now dinner on Amtrak is $45... that's a VERY significant increase.

 

[lordsigma]

I don’t know for sure but I suspect that may be part of the motivation. Last couple times I rode out west the LSA basically served the tables in one half of the diner and the other server took the other side. It basically makes the work the same for both sleeper and coach passengers.

As for the price before Covid - it did not include dessert and an alcoholic beverage and any soft drinks or coffee included. Additionally they didn’t have appetizers of which you have a choice of three. If you got the steak and crab cake option (which had the equivalent of an appetizer) the price was closer to what the current dinner is. You must also consider the dessert, first drink, and as much soft drinks and coffee as you want during the meal. I suspect the feeling is if people feel they can’t afford the packaged deal or it’s not worth it the cafe is an alternative option and the prices there remain quite affordable. I think the idea of the current dining service is doing a smaller core menu consistently well to give the high paying sleeper passengers a decent experience rather than doing a large hodge podge menu mediocre to try to accommodate any passenger who may walk into the diner and want to eat on the cheap.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

As for the price before Covid - it did not include dessert and an alcoholic beverage and any soft drinks or coffee included. Additionally they didn’t have appetizers of which you have a choice of three.

In my example, I included the $3.50 for a salad so yes, the $28.50 did include an appetizer (if you count the salad, which I do).

You must also consider the dessert, first drink, and as much soft drinks and coffee as you want during the meal.

Oh yes, I wasn't comparing the prices of every component. But the majority of coach passengers eating in the diner didn't order an alcoholic drink AND dessert. I intentionally picked one of the higher-priced entrees in my example - there were obviously more affordable options as well... the cheapest being the Burger at $12.50. You could get a burger, salad, dessert, and wine for like $32. That's my point, Coach passengers used to have an option for a pretty affordable dinner in the diner, but now they don't. (But I'm still glad there is at least an option depending on the LSA's mood lol).

I think the idea of the current dining service is doing a smaller core menu consistently well to give the high paying sleeper passengers a decent experience rather than doing a large hodge podge menu mediocre to try to accommodate any passenger who may walk into the diner and want to eat on the cheap.

I don't think I follow this at all. The Amtrak dining car menu was never a large hodgepodge mediocore menu in my opinion. Coach passengers not ordering a glass of wine or dessert shouldn't give the sleeping car passengers a lower quality of experience.

 

[Willbridge]

Thanks for posting this as I was going to . Also, the "California Zephyr" had an "early" dining offer for dinner too.

 

[danasgoodstuff]

Inflation of only 10X since 1963 seems like a gross understatement to me. The CPI can be a misleading measure for particular goods and services since it contains so many different things.

 

[railiner]

Inflation of only 10X since 1963 seems like a gross understatement to me. The CPI can be a misleading measure for particular goods and services since it contains so many different things.

Agreed...not everything inflates at the same rate...some things are relatively a bargain, compared to others, as their prices have not risen commensurately.

 

[lordsigma]

I don't think I follow this at all. The Amtrak dining car menu was never a large hodgepodge mediocore menu in my opinion. Coach passengers not ordering a glass of wine or dessert shouldn't give the sleeping car passengers a lower quality of experience.

I found what they were doing presentation and effort at least immediately pre Covid rather mediocre compared to the current offering - at least in my opinion. No coach customers not ordering a glass of wine or dessert wouldn’t degrade the experience and I certainly wouldn’t have an issue with them having a lower tier option that excludes those extras but part of the idea may be to simplify the LSA’s work during meal periods so they don’t have to worry about whether coach passengers paid for this or that so as to provide a consistent experience and is what I was getting at with that comment. They do give the option for the lunch entrees at dinner so perhaps if you select that they charge the lunch rate. However given they also offer meals for purchase in the cafe at quite reasonable prices and again when compared to the general cost of eating out these days I personally don’t really have much issue with what they’re doing either and I don’t see them going back to the a la carte priced menu offered previously.

 

[railiner]

$2 in 1963 is approximately $20 today according to the consensus of various internet search results I got. Does today's quality match what AT&SF offered? Probably not, but something to think about anyway.

It is not really a fair comparison. Back then, many railroads 'subsidized' their excellent food service as a marketing device, to bring favor on their railroads to compete with others for both passenger and freight business. Today, Amtrak is mandated not to do that, but to recover all costs. That has eased somewhat of lately, but I doubt you will ever see Amtrak serve "The King's Dinner", as done by the Illinois Central, on its Panama Limited.

Scroll down to the menu...

https://hawkinsrails.net/mainlines/ic1/ic1_trains.html

 

[MARC Rider]

For comparison - you could get a Steak dinner with baked potato and a side salad and a glass of water on Amtrak for $28.50 a few years ago. Now dinner on Amtrak is $45... that's a VERY significant increase.

I could get a steak dinner at the Texas Roadhouse with two sides, etc. for my whole family for $50 a few years ago. Now, even when we go out for dinner, even at cheap places, we are always seeming to spend $100. Remember, we had almost 10% inflation last year, and even in the years before when inflation was less, 3% a year compunded yearly starts adding up.