The said part of the opposition to Colorado Springs rail is that the right of way already exists, I've driven down I25 past some extremely long coal trains, and at COS have seen Ringling Bros parked. Assuming double tracking would be needed to add passenger, but it's not like people will see and hear trains where they presently don't.
Denver Union Station Question
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neroden
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BuffaloBoy
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There are no vending machines or any place to buy snacks, however, if you can walk fast there is a 7-11 two blocks away. Walk out of the front (street side) of the station and go left. Turn right at the first corner and walk 2 blocks and there it is. I just did it the other day and had no problems.
BuffaloBoy
Service Attendant
Well Jim, the Denver dog station is as about as creepy as you can get, so I was happy to make the 6 block walk to the most beautiful Union Station I have ever seen. I took a little trip up to Wyoming and that went smooth, but the trip back absolutely sucked. I took the Black Hills Stage Line (the only option) back to Denver. Arrival time doesn't match up with the Zephyr and I had to decide if I wanted to pay at least $250 a night for a decent hotel or tough it out. I opted to hang out in the glorious Union Station. Security is top-notch and I felt very safe there. If you are not a ticketed passenger they run you off right quickly! I did get the feeling that they "put up with" Amtrak passengers, but they rather wouldn't do it. I was nodding off at 3am and I was woken up by security packing 9mm's and told "you can wait here; but you can't sleep" and I was told that you can't hang out on the nice, comfy couches, but you can sit on the Amtrak hard wooden benches and sleep if you remain sitting up! It was a long night. I should have ponied up and gotten a very over-priced hotel. Live and learn, but I'll continue my adventures!
Interesting experience....but still better than the way it used to be, perhaps....
In the past, after the last train departed, the station would lock up for the night, and not open again until 6:00 AM.....at least you can stay there now overnite, if you wish....
Depending on what the Rockies are doing, the surrounding area can be pretty busy. Also, the station renovation included the addition of the "Crawford Hotel" into the space, the building is now a 24 hour facility by neccessity. It has some beautiful rooms and areas, but is an expensive place to stay, With the prices for rooms there, I get why they want people to at least feel safe.
eblkheart
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I will say that when my train (at the time) was late 8 hours arriving in the early morning (3am), I saw a lot of people dozing off only to have security to wake people up. That said, I did notice a decent amount of homeless teens in and out most of the night trying to sleep and charge their cell phones. They too were awaken by the security as well. I will say that if you're a ticketed passenger and need to catch some sleep when your train is 8 hours late and you have your luggage and most of all, your ticket, you should be able to doze off for awhile w/o someone waking you up, unless it's Amtrak telling you that your train is arriving.
8 late is a long time. A few years back I had one running about 3 late, that wasn't too bad, I went up to the 16th street mall. One possible issue is that Amtrak does not own the station, Denver RTD does. They are probably more interested in keeping crime statistics low since you have less of a chance of getting robbed when awake. Not inconveniencing customers is probably not on their list of priorities. In my hole in the ground home station NYP, at least they created a partitioned waiting area for ticketed passengers only. It isn't especially nice, but they do a decent job of making sure that everyone in that area is actually waiting for a train.
You can't really compare Denver and NYP....NYP has trains running 24 hours a day, so it is normal for passenger's to be there. Denver only has Amtrak trains during the 'wee hours' when they are way off schedule. And since the lobby is really for hotel guests, you can't expect a hotel to provide plush seating for those not choosing to book a room.
It is similar at places like the Hilton at O'Hare Airport....I don't believe the hotel security would allow airline passenger's to sleep in their lobby seating....they would 'escort' them back toward the airport terminal area....
It is similar at places like the Hilton at O'Hare Airport....I don't believe the hotel security would allow airline passenger's to sleep in their lobby seating....they would 'escort' them back toward the airport terminal area....
When you get right down to it, it's one train in each direction daily for Amtrak. Heck of a lot more commuter action with the buses downstairs and the RTD lines. Lobby also serves the shops, bars and restaurant, not just the hotel, but your point about the hall is still valid. It is really geared for short term waiting and patrons of the businesses. It takes a great deal more to keep it nice than the old wooden benches. Not everyone would agree, and some can not physically, but my preference is to drop my bags for a few bucks, and unless the weather is bad, go up to the mall. I don't know if I could handle 8 hours in any case.
Amtrak's Track-A-Train shows that the California Zephyr does some sort of a "loop" getting into and out of Denver. What exactly is the route it takes? Does it change direction? Is the train turned?
Thanks,
jb
Thanks,
jb
jis
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The Zephyr pulls past the station throat and then backs into the station in Denver. Remember it is a terminal station, not a run through station. It has not much to do with changing railroads. Even if you wish to make a stop at Denver and then go north on BNSF through Colorado Springs, you'd have to do the same thing. That is the way the track layout is.
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SubwayNut
Conductor
The main issue is portions of the rail line from Denver to Colorado Springs is home to 27 coal trains in each direction per day plus others. It is a joint lined used by CSX and UP with single tracked areas in places that are huge bottlenecks. To allow passenger trains to run between COS and Denver this rail relocation project to build a new freight line out on the plains and relocated through freight from the front range would need to be built.
TrainLoverJoy
Lead Service Attendant
Just left the station. Very impressive, and had full 45 minutes to explore!
Since when does CSX run thru Colorado? Unless Mr Buffet sold his railroad to them....
Rail Freak
Engineer
Isn't it beautiful?! Last October I took a trip, PDX-DEN before I flew home to FLA. & spent a lot of time playing shuffle board!!!
SubwayNut
Conductor
It's BNSF, I was typing quickly and mixed up my four letter acronyms please forgive me.Since when does CSX run thru Colorado? Unless Mr Buffet sold his railroad to them....
Ryan
Court Jester
In the "someone is going to point it out, so I might as well get it over with" category, CSX is only three letters.
jis
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Notwithstanding that, the San Francisco Zephyr, and later the California Zephyr has always entered and exited the station from the north end and has always backed into the station in the lifetime of Amtrak. AFAIR. The south end throat had not been used by any passenger service after A-Day as far as I can recall.It wasn't always that way....used to be a thru station until redevelopment several years ago. Trains could go directly SOUTH to Colorado Springs over the Joint Line....
Wait. What? You don't consider {null} to be a letter?In the "someone is going to point it out, so I might as well get it over with" category, CSX is only three letters.
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You're right about that...except that in the SFZ days, the train did not back in. When it ran to Cheyenne, they pulled it backwards between Denver and Cheyenne, then ran the power around the train before leaving Cheyenne heading west. And vice versa. They changed engines entirely at Denver then....Notwithstanding that, the San Francisco Zephyr, and later the California Zephyr has always entered and exited the station from the north end and has always backed into the station in the lifetime of Amtrak. AFAIR. The south end throat had not been used by any passenger service after A-Day as far as I can recall.It wasn't always that way....used to be a thru station until redevelopment several years ago. Trains could go directly SOUTH to Colorado Springs over the Joint Line....
When they bypassed Cheyenne, later on, the BN did back No. 5 in. But the UP did not back No. 6 in. The BN backed it out and turned it upon departure....
When the train became the CZ over The Grande, then it backed in both ways......
Going back to the Rio Grande Zephyr days, both it and the Ski Train used the south end to reach their base at the Burnham Yard. And even Amtrak would occasionally venture south over the Cherry Creek bridge to expedite switching cars and engines at times....especially on those rare occasion's when No.s 5 & 6 were in the station at the same time.....
jis
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Railner, of course you are indeed right about the backward move of the SFZ to Cheyenne, because they had to reverse direction there again. I have been on that version of the SFZ once!
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