federal sleepers???

[john]

Are the sleepers on the federal gone????

 

[AlanB]

Sadly yes, at least until next fall when the timetables change.

 

[panamaclipper]

Why can't they refurb some 50s' sleepers to provide service? Or have they dumped them all? Should be cheaper than new ones, right?

 

[panamaclipper]

And have all the old ATSF Hi Level cars been scrapped?

 

[battalion51]

One would think. But the cars would all require major refurbishments, new toilet systems (since old Heritage Sleepers didn't have retention tanks), as well as crash safety equipment. For a large number of cars the price of refurbishment and maintenence is significantly higher than that of a new fleet.

 

[engine999]

And have all the old ATSF Hi Level cars been scrapped?

AFAIK the only high levels left are the pacific parlour cars and the few coaches used on the heartland flyer. Supposily amtrak has a few coach/dorm highlevel's in storage at beach grove, but i am not 100% positive.

 

[battalion51]

Amtrak owns only 11 Hi-Levels I believe, 6 Lounges, 5 Coaches. A couple might be in storage at BG, but anything not active has been sold off.

 

[panamaclipper]

I had forgotten about the toilet issue. What a shame that something so basic would put so many of the cars in the scrap heap. I wonder how Via and some of the tour operators like American Orient Express have dealt with these 50s cars and the WC?

 

[battalion51]

Well VIA doesn't have to deal with it, there's no FRA in Canada. Their version of the FRA does not have the same rules as the U.S. FRA. As for AOE, those cars were heavily upgraded anyway, so that was a drop in the bucket for them.

 

[railman]

The waste system on Amtrak's Heritage fleet was not dealt the death blow by the FRA but by the EPA. Seems that, back in the 1990's, someone took extreme exception to raw untreated human excrement being deposited on America's rail rights-of-way and got the Environmental Protection Agency to issue a "cease and desist" order to Amtrak for such equipment. Amtrak's choices were to complete a very expensive and complicated retrofit to the fleet or get it out of service. History shows the choice made at 60 Mass...

 

[battalion51]

Actually...A few years back the Auto Train was rolling over a bridge in North Florida. A Congressman happened to be fishing on that body of water at the time. As the train rumbled over someone flushed the toilet, and well lets say the Congressman got hit by it. He was understandably pissed and lead the fight to get retnetion tanks on all railroad equipment in the U.S., which he obviously did.

 

[engine999]

Well VIA doesn't have to deal with it, there's no FRA in Canada. Their version of the FRA does not have the same rules as the U.S. FRA. As for AOE, those cars were heavily upgraded anyway, so that was a drop in the bucket for them.

Actually I heard Via want's to install rentention toilets on all of its trains that are not currently equiped with them starting in 2005.

 

[Steve4031]

Actually...A few years back the Auto Train was rolling over a bridge in North Florida. A Congressman happened to be fishing on that body of water at the time. As the train rumbled over someone flushed the toilet, and well lets say the Congressman got hit by it. He was understandably pissed and lead the fight to get retnetion tanks on all railroad equipment in the U.S., which he obviously did.

So why wasn't he arrested for tresspassing on railroad property.

And I hope it was #2 too since h caused the demise of my favorite cars.

 

[battalion51]

I'm pretty sure it was #2, or so I have been told.

 

[railman]

The fisherman/tresspasser/congressperson story is urban legend. It is true that someone on The Hill decided that the direct-dump systems on Amtrak trains were unacceptable and that person did work to kill the Heritage fleet. But the order came through the EPA... get rid of those cars or retrofit them with retention systems.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

The fisherman/tresspasser/congressperson story is urban legend. It is true that someone on The Hill decided that the direct-dump systems on Amtrak trains were unacceptable and that person did work to kill the Heritage fleet. But the order came through the EPA... get rid of those cars or retrofit them with retention systems.

I feel quite sure it is not urban legend. I have heard and read the story many times,no doubt in TRAINS magazines and other respected publications.

Yeah, I know---the respected publications are only as good as their sources and could have been fed a bunch of "garbage". (I'm being polite here) and fell for it......I know.....but it has the ring of truth to it for me as I have read it so many times over the years.

 

[Viewliner]

I have to agree with Bill, I've read it so many times in Trains Magazine that I don't think its an urban legend. Sounds like the kind of thing someone would need to experience to actually want to require retention tanks.

 

[AlanB]

Sounds like the kind of thing someone would need to experience to actually want to require retention tanks.

No it's the kind of thing that should make you think twice about trespassing on RR property. :angry:

 

[PRR 60]

Sounds like the kind of thing someone would need to experience to actually want to require retention tanks.

No it's the kind of thing that should make you think twice about trespassing on RR property. :angry:

The story, if true, is that they were fishing in a boat under an open-tie railroad bridge (fish like to habitate near pilings) when the train passed overhead the sprayed the waste through the bridge and into the water. No tresspassing was involved.