Hoosier State Going from IPH Back to Amtrak

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jis said:
Continuing saga of the rest of IPH business ...

http://trn.trains.com/news/news-wire/2017/02/27-ip-lawsuit
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I'm not familiar with such licensing agreements, so perhaps it is common, but doesn't a 30% royalty seem rather high? That is going to really eat into ticket revenue.

Also, if Iowa Pacific paid over $3 million in past-due royalties, are they really as bankrupt as commonly reported? That's a fair chunk of change for a company which supposedly can't meet payroll.
 
MARC Rider said:
As to the lack of food service, first everyone complains about how horrible the food is, now they're complaining that there isn't enough of it! :)
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Well, there's more to it than bad nuked food. Cafe cars have beer, wine, cocktails as well as having table seating. It is a social space on the train (for either hanging with a group of friends or for chatting with strangers) that other modes of transportation lack, so for me one of the draws of train travel. Most trains may not have the lounge cars of yesteryear but I still cherish those spaces - whether they be great ones like the lounge on the Caledonian Sleepers in Scotland, or good ones like the Sightseer Lounges, or simple cafe cars - as one example of what makes train travel more dignified than flying or taking the bus, the ability to do something other than just merely sit in your seat waiting to arrive at your destination.
 
A Voice said:
jis said:
Continuing saga of the rest of IPH business ...

http://trn.trains.com/news/news-wire/2017/02/27-ip-lawsuit
Click to expand...
I'm not familiar with such licensing agreements, so perhaps it is common, but doesn't a 30% royalty seem rather high? That is going to really eat into ticket revenue.

Also, if Iowa Pacific paid over $3 million in past-due royalties, are they really as bankrupt as commonly reported? That's a fair chunk of change for a company which supposedly can't meet payroll.
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If they had $3,368,731 in the bank before they made their $3,368,730 payment, they would have a little trouble making payroll, don't you think?
 
Per a post on TrainOrders, the Hoosier State as of March 1st under Amtrak operates with Horizon fleet equipment; Both coach and business class seating, a staffed cafe car, and - for at least the first month - the 10031 dome.
 
A Voice said:
Per a post on TrainOrders, the Hoosier State as of March 1st under Amtrak operates with Horizon fleet equipment; Both coach and business class seating, a staffed cafe car, and - for at least the first month - the 10031 dome.
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Ok now. Staffed Lounge, and Dome. I thought Amtrak was not allow to lose money on its State Contacts. I wonder if Indiana is pay Amtrak more for the equipment, or did Amtrak discover the T+E charges were a bit too much.

However it should be note the Dome Car is a promotional item. So Amtrak may not be charging for it.
 
A Voice said:
rtabern said:
Palmetto said:
History shows that once a train goes, it is very difficulty to get it back, let alone increase service. Not a good idea to cease service.
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As much as we all love trains and train travel... and I would hate to see ANY service get cut ... I have yet to see someone on the forum actually present an argument to justify a state paying a $100-130 per passenger subsidy for train service that is: A) Just 190 miles long... B) Almost all of the route parallels an interstate highway... C) Dinks along taking 1 hour and 10 minutes to go just 30 miles from Dyer to Chicago switching between a half dozen freight railroads... D) Takes almost 2 hours longer than driving... E) Takes 1 hour and 30 minutes longer than the bus... F) Mainly provides service for people to LEAVE your state (Indiana) and spend money in another (Illinois) for a day trip... G) Doesn't really encourage tourism to your state (no one from Chicago is going to arrive in Indy at Midnight and turn around and come back at 6am the next day)... H) Operates at ungodly hours... etc, etc.
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Again, the state does not provide a per-passenger subsidy of $100-$130 for operation of the Hoosier State. That is not a valid metric for evaluating the finances of passenger rail; The true purpose of a (largely fictitious) per-passenger loss figure is to make the trains' financial numbers look as bad as possible. Yes, the service requires an operating subsidy, but the per-passenger numbers are virtually meaningless (in theory, you could get a better result by giving tickets away).

You arbitrarily dismiss arguments in favor of the Hoosier State while failing to provide a sound basis for your contention that it is unworkable; Respectfully, some of your arguments, A-H, are just silly. What, one might reasonably ask, would a parallel interstate have to do with anything? Most Amtrak routes - and most major highways - travel between major destinations. That's where the business is to be found.

I wouldn't "poo-poo" the dome car and the nice meal service. I have rode this train around 20 times and a lot of people in business class have told me that the reason they chose to take the train vs. drive or the bus was because of the nice meal service and observation car. This was both business men/women and yes some railfans. Sure most people probably didn't care --- but if it swayed a few thousand people to try the train or take it over driving -- well, those people are going to go back to their old modes of transportation probably when Amtrak takes over. Personally, I know we won't ride the Hoosier anymore after March 1st. No reason to anymore.
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So, even if the amenities are the same, you won't ride anymore? That's telling.

how about INDOT discontinue the train and give you the $130 so you can go and buy a pass to ride as much as you want at the Illinois Railroad Museum.
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You do realize, I presume, that this makes even less sense than the politicians who suggested it would be cheaper to buy Amtrak passengers an airline ticket than subsidize the train. The Hoosier State does not exist - and it is not subsidized - for the purpose of letting people take a train ride. The purpose of the train is to provide a transportation service between Indianapolis and Chicago. The Illinois Railway Museum is rather, well, a museum.
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I'm all for state-subsidized trains--for most of the reasons you name. But I just can't justify this one. My personal perspective: I often take the train even though it might cost more and take longer. I wanted to take this one, but its departure and arrival times just made it ridiculous. I just couldn't see any point in riding it other than for the train ride itself, not for actual transportation. The times make using it for a weekend in Indy untenable. If people like me aren't going to spring for it, I don't think many average travelers are likely to.
 
Wi-Fi, Business Class and Café Car on the new Amtrak Hoosier StatePromotions and “Great Dome” railcar for launch of revamped service

The Indiana Department of Transportation, community partners and Amtrak announce passenger amenities on board the Hoosier State service when it transitions to modern Amtrak railcars and locomotives on Wednesday, March 1. The train operates four days a week between Indianapolis and Chicago with intermediate stops in Crawfordsville, Lafayette, Rensselaer and Dyer.
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http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=257448&information_id=255819&type&syndicate=syndicate
 
I am curious -- maybe someone more in the know than I can answer --

Is INDOT paying Amtrak for the dome car to be on the train? Or is Amtrak doing it for free in an attempt to kiss up to INDOT and maybe get the permanent contract back beyond June 30?
 
There is no second locomotive. There is a strategically located roadside post that makes it look like there is a separation between the front and the rear of the single locomotive.

The two Horizons are Coaches. The Amfleet is a BC + Cafe, and the Dome is of course the Dome.
 
Yeah that's a post. Sorry again about the quality, this is not terribly out of my way to work and is the least obscured area.

I know some folks that were on board, and in a text they mentioned that it was announced that all passengers will be getting Lounge access in Chicago as well.
 

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