NJT / PATH / PATCO 2020/2050 Plans / Proposals

[Nexis4Jersey]

New Jersey

Projects to be completed by 2030

New Arrow Fleet

ALP 45DP's

Arrow Refurbishment

Perth Amboy Station upgrade

Wesmont station

New Brunswick station overhaul

More Double Decker cars

Northeast Corridor wire replacement

Raritan Valley line / Northeast Corridor Grade Separation

More Sidings added to the Atlantic , Pascack Valley lines

LED Departure boards @ Trenton , Hoboken , Newark , Secaucus

Hawthorne Transit Center

Cross County line

MOM Rail network

Lackawanna line

West Trenton line

West Trenton Riverline Extension

Hudson Bergen Light Rail > Northern Branch Corridor

Glassboro Light Rail line

Pennsuaken Transit Center

PATH extension to EWR

NJT Hudson Bergen Light Rail 440 Extension

Hoboken Ferry Terminal Overhaul

Hoboken PATH Terminal Overhaul

New Brunswick Station platform overhaul

Elizabeth Station Overhaul

Newark Embankment Overhaul

Dock , Delair , PATH Hackensack River Bridge repainting

New Portal Bridge

New Meadowlands Yard

Restoration of Ampere station

Restoration of Harrison Station

Ridgewood station overhaul

Newark Light Rail stations overhaul

Walter Rand Transportation center overhaul

Journal SQ PATH Station Overhaul

Harrison PATH station overhaul

PATH system signal upgrades

PATH Track replacement

PATCO car refurbishment

Franklin SQ PATCO station restoration

PATH PA-5 Full purchase

Large Scale Rail Projects

Project : West Trenton line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 4

Projected Ridership : 15,000

Project : MOM Network

Number of lines : 2-3

Stations : 8-12

Projected Ridership : 120,000

Project : Lackawanna line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 3-4

Projected Ridership : 25,000

Project : Philpsburg Connections

Number of lines : 2-3

Stations : 5-12

Projected Ridership : 45,000

Project : Passaic - Bergen Light Rail

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 12 (phase 1)

Projected Ridership : 8,000

Project : Northern Branch Light Rail

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 9

Projected Ridership : 25,000

Project : PATH extension to EWR

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 2

Projected Ridership : ?

Project : Pennsuaken Transit Center

Number of lines : 2

Stations : 1

Projected Ridership : ?

Project : Glassboro Light Rail

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 15

Projected Ridership : 25,000

Project : West Shore line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 21

Projected Ridership : 60,000

Project : Sparta line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 13

Projected Ridership : 28,000

Project : Hudson Bergen Light Rail 440 Extension

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 1-2

Projected Ridership : 10,000

Project : Pompton Branch

Number of lines :

Stations : 5

Projected Ridership : 12,000

Project : North Newark - JSQ - Downtown Jersey City Light Rail

Number of lines : 1-2

Stations : 17

Projected Ridership : 35,000

Project : Newark - Paterson Light Rail

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 22

Projected Ridership : 50,000

Project : PATH extension to Midtown Elizabeth via Jersey Gardens

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 8

Projected Ridership : 65,000

Project : New Brunswick Light Rail

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 13

Projected Ridership : 45-50,000

Project : Cape May line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 7

Projected Ridership : 7-9,000

Project : Pennsville Light Rail line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 7

Projected Ridership : 6,000

Project : Salem Light Rail line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 3

Projected Ridership : 4,000

Project : Millville Extension of the Glassboro line

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 9

Projected Ridership : 12,000

Project : West Trenton Riverline extension

Number of lines : 1

Stations : 9

Projected Ridership : 15-20,000

Project : Mt. Holly Light Rail Branch

Number of lines :

Stations : 10

Projected Ridership : 17,000

Current Railway / Light Rail lines

Line : Northeast Corridor

Length : 57 mi

Stations : 17

Ridership : 54,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 65,000)

Line : Morristown line

Length : 57 mi

Stations : 26

Ridership : 50,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 70,000)

Line : Gladstone Branch

Length : 22 mi

Stations : 13

Ridership : 5,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 12,000)

Line : Montclair / Boonton line

Length : ?

Stations : 19

Ridership : 17,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 25,000)

Line : Main line

Length : 30 mi

Stations : 26

Ridership : 9,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 17,000)

Line : Bergen line

Length : 20 mi

Stations : 7

Ridership : 5,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 13,000)

Line : Pascack Valley line

Length : 30 mi

Stations : 18

Ridership : 6,500 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 11,000)

Line : Port Jervis line

Length : 95 mi

Stations : 26

Ridership : 7,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 9,000)

Line : North Jersey Coast line

Length : 65 mi

Stations : 28

Ridership : 18,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 27,000)

Line : Raritan Valley line

Length : ?

Stations : 20

Ridership : 12,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 18,000)

System : RiverLine

Length : 34 mi

Stations : 20

Ridership : 11,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 25,000)

System : Newark Light Rail

Length : 14 mi

Stations : 20

Ridership : 21,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 40,000)

System : Hudson Bergen Light Rail

Length : 21 mi

Stations : 24

Ridership : 40,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 100,000)

System : PATH

Length : 14 mi

Stations : 13

Ridership : 250,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 290,000)

System : PATCO

Length : 14 mi

Stations : 13

Ridership : 40,000 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 55,000)

Line : Atlantic line

Length : 68 mi

Stations : 8

Ridership : 6,500 (Projected 2020 Ridership : 15,000)

Total Projected 2020 Regional Rail / TRAM/Train Ridership with all Projects completed : 467,000

Total Projected 2020 Light Rail & Heavy Rail Ridership with all the Projects Completed : 518,000

Total 2020 Rail / Transit Ridership > 2.1 Million

If your wondering about the Ridership numbers , they were either taken form the state , a private group , or discussed by Rail fanners and Urban planners via Skype.....were never that off i must say. The MOM Network , West Shore and Philpsburg connections will service high commute areas of NJ with mostly NY/Urban Jersey bound commuters , the Morristown , Northeast Corridor and Pascack Valley lines are and will see bi-directional ridership movements increase over the next decade resulting in ridership climbs.... Transit Oriented development , Growth in the Railway towns , Reverse Commuting and gas prices all are factored into the projections aswell , some TOD sites will add up to 17,000 users to the local station like at the Newport PATH station in Jersey City. Similar density developments will surround the New Brunswick , Harrison , Journal SQ , Hoboken , Trenton , Rahway , Elizabeth , South Amboy , Watsessing Avenue, Morristown , Hackensack stations , Newark Board. For the TOD ridership to full take affect , leave at least 5 years after the project is completed. The Harrison and Journal SQ Developments should add another 40-60,000 to the PATH. The Rise of PPP's across the NE and Private developers will help pay for some of these projects..... I don't all will come to fruition , but at least 80% will.....

 

[jis]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj.us/transportation/capital/tcp12/pdf/transit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

 

[Nexis4Jersey]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj.us/transportation/capital/tcp12/pdf/transit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

Well the big Rail Projects will probably be funded by the Feds or PPP's so i think those will get built. The Max all this will cost 7 billion. Christie will only be a one termer , Democrats will swoop back in power.... I think the PATH will complete all there projects , so will the PATCO and DPRA. Developments will factor into alot of the projects , if they fall through then will won't get those projects...due to half the funding being put up by the developer. I tend to look optimistic and not down.

 

[jis]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj.us/transportation/capital/tcp12/pdf/transit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

Well the big Rail Projects will probably be funded by the Feds or PPP's so i think those will get built. The Max all this will cost 7 billion. Christie will only be a one termer , Democrats will swoop back in power.... I think the PATH will complete all there projects , so will the PATCO and DPRA. Developments will factor into alot of the projects , if they fall through then will won't get those projects...due to half the funding being put up by the developer. I tend to look optimistic and not down.

Let's get specific. Which Federal entities from which budget authorizations do you think will fund the projects? Which private enterprises do you suppose will actually put in significant amounts of money on infrastructure projects in NJ over the next five years? Just curious. Even if the Democrats swoop back into power where will they get the money from? We already know that DVPA will not fund a single penny of the Glauco line. Even the EISA is being funded by NJT, and the Governor's office has pretty much withdrawn the $500 million of non-existent money that Corzine had promised. So it won't happen unless FTA and/or NJ TTF manages to fund it.

 

[Eric S]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj....ransit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

Well the big Rail Projects will probably be funded by the Feds or PPP's so i think those will get built. The Max all this will cost 7 billion. Christie will only be a one termer , Democrats will swoop back in power.... I think the PATH will complete all there projects , so will the PATCO and DPRA. Developments will factor into alot of the projects , if they fall through then will won't get those projects...due to half the funding being put up by the developer. I tend to look optimistic and not down.

Do you have examples of projects built (and, more pertinently to this discussion, financed) elsewhere using such PPPs are you are suggesting?

 

[Nexis4Jersey]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj.us/transportation/capital/tcp12/pdf/transit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

Well the big Rail Projects will probably be funded by the Feds or PPP's so i think those will get built. The Max all this will cost 7 billion. Christie will only be a one termer , Democrats will swoop back in power.... I think the PATH will complete all there projects , so will the PATCO and DPRA. Developments will factor into alot of the projects , if they fall through then will won't get those projects...due to half the funding being put up by the developer. I tend to look optimistic and not down.

Let's get specific. Which Federal entities from which budget authorizations do you think will fund the projects? Which private enterprises do you suppose will actually put in significant amounts of money on infrastructure projects in NJ over the next five years? Just curious. Even if the Democrats swoop back into power where will they get the money from? We already know that DVPA will not fund a single penny of the Glauco line. Even the EISA is being funded by NJT, and the Governor's office has pretty much withdrawn the $500 million of non-existent money that Corzine had promised. So it won't happen unless FTA and/or NJ TTF manages to fund it.

Form what i heard the Feds will pay for most of the Northern Branch and Glassboro lines. Half of these projects are underway or budgeted. The ALP 45s , Arrow Refurbishment , Pennsuaken Transit Center , Hoboken Terminal Overhaul , PATCO car refurbishment , New Portal Bridge , Newark Embankment Overhaul , PATH track overhaul , PATH Signal Upgrade , Harrison PATH overhaul , Walter Rand Center upgrades , Newark Light Rail station upgrades , Ridgewood station upgrades , Dock / Hackensack Bridge Repainting , More Double Decker cars , New Meadowlands yard , PATH PA-5 Full Purchase < all of those are either underway or about to begin. The Feds will fund Glassboro and Northern Branch corridors , i'm hearing either 60% or the whole thing which is not uncommon. NJT looking over the past 2 decades has managed to find the $$$ for upgrades and expansions.... The Glassboro / Northern Branch will be funded by the Feds.....form what i heard there working on funding the rest of the project..as of February.

 

[Nexis4Jersey]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj....ransit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

Well the big Rail Projects will probably be funded by the Feds or PPP's so i think those will get built. The Max all this will cost 7 billion. Christie will only be a one termer , Democrats will swoop back in power.... I think the PATH will complete all there projects , so will the PATCO and DPRA. Developments will factor into alot of the projects , if they fall through then will won't get those projects...due to half the funding being put up by the developer. I tend to look optimistic and not down.

Do you have examples of projects built (and, more pertinently to this discussion, financed) elsewhere using such PPPs are you are suggesting?

The Restoration of the Harrison , Ampere , and New Wesmont station could be funded by PPPs or the city/town. It depends on the size and traffic volume for that Project , the Harrison TOD project could add up to 20,000 commuters to the PATH station. The old Harrison station would be restored to balance things out more and a deal between the Developer and town is in the works. Theres also an Interchange planned for I280 which will be funded by PPP's. The New Brunswick station overhaul will be funded by PPP's / TOD Project. The MOM network & West Trenton lines could be funded by PPP's .....The MOM network will be used by over 100,000 ppl what PPP wouldn't want that project. The West Trenton LRT extension could be funded by TOD / PPP's. The Problem is in this state NJT is afraid of PPP's for some reason.....Hopefully that will change...

 

[Eric S]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj....ransit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

Well the big Rail Projects will probably be funded by the Feds or PPP's so i think those will get built. The Max all this will cost 7 billion. Christie will only be a one termer , Democrats will swoop back in power.... I think the PATH will complete all there projects , so will the PATCO and DPRA. Developments will factor into alot of the projects , if they fall through then will won't get those projects...due to half the funding being put up by the developer. I tend to look optimistic and not down.

Do you have examples of projects built (and, more pertinently to this discussion, financed) elsewhere using such PPPs are you are suggesting?

The Restoration of the Harrison , Ampere , and New Wesmont station could be funded by PPPs or the city/town. It depends on the size and traffic volume for that Project , the Harrison TOD project could add up to 20,000 commuters to the PATH station. The old Harrison station would be restored to balance things out more and a deal between the Developer and town is in the works. Theres also an Interchange planned for I280 which will be funded by PPP's. The New Brunswick station overhaul will be funded by PPP's / TOD Project. The MOM network & West Trenton lines could be funded by PPP's .....The MOM network will be used by over 100,000 ppl what PPP wouldn't want that project. The West Trenton LRT extension could be funded by TOD / PPP's. The Problem is in this state NJT is afraid of PPP's for some reason.....Hopefully that will change...

So no projects have been built and financed using such PPPs?

 

[Nexis4Jersey]

Take a look at the 5 year capital plan here: http://www.state.nj....ransit5year.pdf

Now tell me honestly what proportion of those projects have a prayer of completion by 2020. And by far there isn't even any guarantee that there will be appropriations to cover even this plan.

Well the big Rail Projects will probably be funded by the Feds or PPP's so i think those will get built. The Max all this will cost 7 billion. Christie will only be a one termer , Democrats will swoop back in power.... I think the PATH will complete all there projects , so will the PATCO and DPRA. Developments will factor into alot of the projects , if they fall through then will won't get those projects...due to half the funding being put up by the developer. I tend to look optimistic and not down.

Do you have examples of projects built (and, more pertinently to this discussion, financed) elsewhere using such PPPs are you are suggesting?

The Restoration of the Harrison , Ampere , and New Wesmont station could be funded by PPPs or the city/town. It depends on the size and traffic volume for that Project , the Harrison TOD project could add up to 20,000 commuters to the PATH station. The old Harrison station would be restored to balance things out more and a deal between the Developer and town is in the works. Theres also an Interchange planned for I280 which will be funded by PPP's. The New Brunswick station overhaul will be funded by PPP's / TOD Project. The MOM network & West Trenton lines could be funded by PPP's .....The MOM network will be used by over 100,000 ppl what PPP wouldn't want that project. The West Trenton LRT extension could be funded by TOD / PPP's. The Problem is in this state NJT is afraid of PPP's for some reason.....Hopefully that will change...

So no projects have been built and financed using such PPPs?

To my knowledge none at the moment , but there are several in the works....

 

[jis]

Form what i heard the Feds will pay for most of the Northern Branch and Glassboro lines.

They might and then again they might not. Until a so called FFGA (Full Funding Grant Agreement) is signed there is no telling if even a penny will be paid for by the feds. Glassboro is yet to go through EIS, and even for Northern Branch I don;t think the so called ROD (Record of Decision ) on the EIS is done. The federal grants, if they come will have matching requirements from NJ. As you can see in the 5 year budget plan there is no money budgeted for NJ match for any of these.

Half of these projects are underway or budgeted. The ALP 45s , Arrow Refurbishment , Pennsuaken Transit Center , Hoboken Terminal Overhaul , PATCO car refurbishment , New Portal Bridge , Newark Embankment Overhaul , PATH track overhaul , PATH Signal Upgrade , Harrison PATH overhaul , Walter Rand Center upgrades , Newark Light Rail station upgrades , Ridgewood station upgrades , Dock / Hackensack Bridge Repainting , More Double Decker cars , New Meadowlands yard , PATH PA-5 Full Purchase < all of those are either underway or about to begin.

Contrary to your fond belief about half of those are not fully funded yet. They may be budgeted as authorization, but without appropriation there is no money actually to spend and hence no project work.

The Feds will fund Glassboro and Northern Branch corridors , i'm hearing either 60% or the whole thing which is not uncommon. NJT looking over the past 2 decades has managed to find the $$$ for upgrades and expansions.... The Glassboro / Northern Branch will be funded by the Feds.....form what i heard there working on funding the rest of the project..as of February.

The past two decades were also decades of unparalleled profligacy in NJ in effect bankrupting the TTF. There is no real solution for fixing the TTF yet and the backlog in sheer maintenance of highways and railways in NJ is huge, that needs to take precedence over new projects. I am not sure last two decades is a good guide for the next one.

At this point even the feds don't know that they will fund it since no application has been sent to them yet. Yes at some point they might. As I said the EIS process has to complete first. Also there is a new minor NIMBY issue arising on the North branch in the form of the town of Tenafly which has come out in opposition of the project. As you will recall on the Pascack Valley Line two critical sidings were killed by local communities causing countless headaches for operating a frequent service. So nothing is certain until shovels go in the ground.

The bottom line is that at this point the funding situation for capital projects on NJ Transit is more dire than it has ever been. Trust me on this I work in the trenches with the advocacy community as does GML to make these funds become available that you claim are already in hand. They are not. It is going to be a long uphill slog. But of course we all hope that we will succeed in getting many things funded eventually. That is why we slog.

 

[Nexis4Jersey]

Form what i heard the Feds will pay for most of the Northern Branch and Glassboro lines.

They might and then again they might not. Until a so called FFGA (Full Funding Grant Agreement) is signed there is no telling if even a penny will be paid for by the feds. Glassboro is yet to go through EIS, and even for Northern Branch I don;t think the so called ROD (Record of Decision ) on the EIS is done. The federal grants, if they come will have matching requirements from NJ. As you can see in the 5 year budget plan there is no money budgeted for NJ match for any of these.

Half of these projects are underway or budgeted. The ALP 45s , Arrow Refurbishment , Pennsuaken Transit Center , Hoboken Terminal Overhaul , PATCO car refurbishment , New Portal Bridge , Newark Embankment Overhaul , PATH track overhaul , PATH Signal Upgrade , Harrison PATH overhaul , Walter Rand Center upgrades , Newark Light Rail station upgrades , Ridgewood station upgrades , Dock / Hackensack Bridge Repainting , More Double Decker cars , New Meadowlands yard , PATH PA-5 Full Purchase < all of those are either underway or about to begin.

Contrary to your fond belief about half of those are not fully funded yet. They may be budgeted as authorization, but without appropriation there is no money actually to spend and hence no project work.

The Feds will fund Glassboro and Northern Branch corridors , i'm hearing either 60% or the whole thing which is not uncommon. NJT looking over the past 2 decades has managed to find the $$$ for upgrades and expansions.... The Glassboro / Northern Branch will be funded by the Feds.....form what i heard there working on funding the rest of the project..as of February.

The past two decades were also decades of unparalleled profligacy in NJ in effect bankrupting the TTF. There is no real solution for fixing the TTF yet and the backlog in sheer maintenance of highways and railways in NJ is huge, that needs to take precedence over new projects. I am not sure last two decades is a good guide for the next one.

At this point even the feds don't know that they will fund it since no application has been sent to them yet. Yes at some point they might. As I said the EIS process has to complete first. Also there is a new minor NIMBY issue arising on the North branch in the form of the town of Tenafly which has come out in opposition of the project. As you will recall on the Pascack Valley Line two critical sidings were killed by local communities causing countless headaches for operating a frequent service. So nothing is certain until shovels go in the ground.

The bottom line is that at this point the funding situation for capital projects on NJ Transit is more dire than it has ever been. Trust me on this I work in the trenches with the advocacy community as does GML to make these funds become available that you claim are already in hand. They are not. It is going to be a long uphill slog. But of course we all hope that we will succeed in getting many things funded eventually. That is why we slog.

Sigh oh well....i'll change that 2030 which more realistic.....we really need to start addressing the funding issues in the NE. Enough is enough ,i guess it will take a few more derailments and bridge collapses to wake ppl up.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

In 20 years, I will be 46 years old. At that point, god willing, I will have built my glove & safety business into a large company that has sufficient intangible assets that I can sell it for enough money to retire in reasonable comfort, say $2 million in todays dollars. That would mean a yearly EBIT of around $500k, or an improvement of about $475k. My parents think my intention to accomplish this within 20 years is nuts. My wife thinks the intention is nuts. My pet white footed mouse, Sally, thinks this intention is nuts.

I'm really anxious to do it, too, so I can devote the rest of my life to studying and proving the conscious and possibly superhuman intelligence of Peromyscus leucopus, the concept of which most people, including most members of this forum, think isn't just crazy, but bat$hit so.

Compared to your hopes and "realistic expectations", mine are not only sane, but completely reasonable. There is a lot more to all of this than you grasp. Funding isn't appropriated on common sense, it is appropriated on a wide variety of things, including egos, personal rivalries, and partisan politics.

Because the group I am involved with is far too interested in trans-hudson tunnel capacity for their own good (the Gateway plan is sufficiently good that we should be hoping, praying, and begging for it to proceed, rather than lamenting its limited inadequacies) we aren't really even pressing for some of these service expansions you mention. And if we, the rail advocates of New Jersey, aren't pressing hard for the service expansions you suggest, nobody is. If nobody is pressing for them, they don't have a snowballs chance in hell of being built in 20 years.

It takes 10 years, my friend, just to get through the mountain of pre-fabricated paperwork we have compiled to make sure that we not only really, truly, and utterly want to build this, but aren't killing more than 3 extremely rare polka dotted snapping turtles in the process. I urge you to attend some rail advocacy meetings- start with the Lackawanna Coalitions, fourth Monday of every month, 7:15PM in the Millburn town hall, just two blocks from the Millburn train station on the M&E. Perhaps it will help open your eyes to the world of working towards getting this stuff done.

 

[Nexis4Jersey]

Well , i guess i'll have to look over things again...i still think a decent amount will get done. It is 2050 after all.....i'm still sticking with the Ridership projects ...i'm not far off with that.