Southwest Chief Re-Route?

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Swadian Hardcore said:
It's very hard to get the SWC axed, but you gotta admit, it's doing pretty poorly these days and a discontinuance isn't totally out the window.
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Um, what rationale is there to discontinuing it? I can't see that happening without there being major shifts in LD service. Reroute, yes. Cancellation, no.
 
Amtrak claims that there is no federal funding to preserve the existing route. They have requested that $100 million be provided as a one-time capital improvement cost and $10 million a year thereafter. The one time and annual costs were to be split five ways (Amtrak, BNSF, Kansas, Colorado, and New Mexico) $20 million one time and $2 million per year each. All three states declined to participate last year.

Fred Frailey, noted TRAINS magazine consultant claimed about a year ago that the reroute would not be "free" and that it could require as much if not more than the preservation. While some might scoff at this consider the rearrangement of tracks on the mainline to access depot locations, depot renovations (or even new structures), signal retimings, ADA compliancy issues, relocation of servicing facilities... Oklahoma and Texas will be no more willing to pay for a Southwest Chief reroute than Kansas, Colorado, and New Mexico were for preservation.

The Southwest Chief is not in the top of Amtrak's best Long Distance performers. The Chairman of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, Bill Shuster, would like to see Amtrak justify its Long Distance services. Of course Amtrak is dealing with funny money and would like to move all federal dollars to the Northeast Corridor. Amtrak is likely attempting to set precedent by finding non-federal funding sources for its long distance trains.
 
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Flyer said:
Fred Frailey, noted TRAINS magazine consultant claimed about a year ago that the reroute would not be "free" and that it could require as much if not more than the preservation. While some might scoff at this

I do scoff at this. It's absurd.

consider the rearrangement of tracks on the mainline to access depot locations, depot renovations (or even new structures),
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There are likely to be only two new stations: Wichita and Amarillo. Expect NO other stations between ABQ and Newton. Wichita is pretty much ready as far as track connections and the city is willing to pay for station renovations. Amarillo -- well, maybe there won't be a station in Amarillo either!
Look at the station spacing on some of the other trains. Amtrak is happy to increase station spacing.

signal retimings
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Not needed.
, ADA compliancy issues,
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No stations, no issue.
relocation of servicing facilities...
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There aren't any servicing facilities to relocate as far as I can tell. ABQ will remain; there's nothing between there and Newton.

Oklahoma and Texas will be no more willing to pay for a Southwest Chief reroute than Kansas, Colorado, and New Mexico were for preservation.
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But Wichita will pay for Wichita station, and honestly, the reroute doesn't need much more than that! Amarillo City will probably be asked to pay if they want a station.
 
Amarillo is buying the station with the foresight of amtrak moving the SWC. Plus it is also making it a main building in the downtown renovation project.
 
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BNSFboy said:
Amarillo is buying the station with the foresight of amtrak moving the SWC. Plus it is also making it a main building in the downtown renovation project.
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Oooh, good! Is there a newspaper article? This is the first I've heard of Amarillo doing anything with the station.
 
printman2000 said:
The Davy Crockett said:
Ya gotta love the footage they used, but here is a report from KOAT Albuquerque...

For shock value, did someone say Belen? :rolleyes:
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It has always been said on this forum that a reroute would for sure include Albuquerque. Is this just another Amtrak tactic to try and scare New Mexico into coughing up money?
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I personally think ABQ would still be served with the reroute. I don't know if its Amtrak or the folks in ABQ who are trying to save the Raton Pass routing.who are saying this, but my hunch is the latter, but both certainly could be playing that card.

The subject has certainly caught the eye of televised media in the areas that could be impacted anyway...
 
printman2000 said:
The Davy Crockett said:
Ya gotta love the footage they used, but here is a report from KOAT Albuquerque...

For shock value, did someone say Belen? :rolleyes:
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It has always been said on this forum that a reroute would for sure include Albuquerque. Is this just another Amtrak tactic to try and scare New Mexico into coughing up money?
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We at this forum have always assumed that Albuquerque would continue to be served directly, but has Amtrak ever said that? It's just another negotiating tool.
 
We at this forum have always assumed the Albuquerque would continue to be served directly as the station and servicing infrastructure there are already in place and there is a wye for turning the train just south of town. A Southwest Chief backtracking to serve ABQ would actually have a shorter backtrack than does the Silver Star in order to directly serve Tampa.
 
"We at this forum" does not include every member. I've often said its entirely possible that IF a reroute occurs the stop COULD be Belen.

It amazes me how people can be 100% sure of something that no one knows!
 
Yup......again I remind everyone, just ask the poor folks at Phoenix......now being "served" at Maricopa...... :rolleyes:
 
Everything about that article ticked me off. Nothing is for sure yet, and they reported it as fact, including that quote about Belen. Way to scare a large passenger base for no good reason. :angry:
 
henryj said:
VentureForth said:
Wouldn't it be nice for the reroute to go down all the way through Wichita to OKC then cut to the West there?
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No that would be quite stupid and would significantly delay the train.
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Really? Why? Just looking at Google, and not knowing the time tables for the various subs, the new route would be around 20 miles further than the current routing. If my suggestion were to be implemented, you would essentially be following the I-35/I-40 corridor, where there is much greater population and perhaps the swapping of fine track along that route vs the slow and windy Raton Pass route that currently exists, it is conceivable that you could service many more people for about the same amount of time. For that reason, it would not be stupid at all nor "significantly" delay the train.

That being said, it IS truly NOT a good idea, but primarily because there is no TRACK along I-40. But to call someone's ideas "stupid" - particularly for the irrelevant reasons listed - is uncalled for.

TVRM610 said:
"We at this forum" does not include every member. I've often said its entirely possible that IF a reroute occurs the stop COULD be Belen.

It amazes me how people can be 100% sure of something that no one knows!
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Don't disagree with you. It could be Belen. But it likely will remain ABQ. As discussed in plenty of other places (and maybe even this thread), there isn't a cross-platform way to get passengers from Amtrak to the Rail Runner easily. Since all the infrastructure is in ABQ, it's likely (but not 100% fer sure) that will be the stop in central NM.
 
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TVRM610 said:
"We at this forum" does not include every member. I've often said its entirely possible that IF a reroute occurs the stop COULD be Belen.

It amazes me how people can be 100% sure of something that no one knows!
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Notelvis didn't say "100% sure". He said "have always assumed".
 
VentureForth said:
henryj said:
VentureForth said:
Wouldn't it be nice for the reroute to go down all the way through Wichita to OKC then cut to the West there?
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No that would be quite stupid and would significantly delay the train.
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Really? Why? Just looking at Google, and not knowing the time tables for the various subs, the new route would be around 20 miles further than the current routing.
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The only track heading west from OKC is not fit for Amtrak. It's a short-line route maintained for low speeds, mostly single-track, and it doesn't have good geometrics either (i.e. you can't speed it up).
The correct thing to do is to have the SW Chief go through Wichita and Amarillo along BNSF's mostly double-track, likely-soon-to-be-90-mph Transcon -- and to have the Heartland Flyer continue north from OKC to Wichita to connect to it. The rerouting of the SW Chief should inspire reconsideration of the studies about extending the Heartland Flyer; reversing the Heartland Flyer at Wichita eliminates some of the complications which were involved in previous plans to connect at Newton or run all the way to Kansas City.

That being said, it IS truly NOT a good idea, but primarily because there is no TRACK along I-40.
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Um, yeah.

Don't disagree with you. It could be Belen. But it likely will remain ABQ. As discussed in plenty of other places (and maybe even this thread), there isn't a cross-platform way to get passengers from Amtrak to the Rail Runner easily. Since all the infrastructure is in ABQ, it's likely (but not 100% fer sure) that will be the stop in central NM.
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Indeed. Albuquerque is a service stop (and a long one). The tracks from ABQ to Belen are owned and maintained by NM RailRunner. To maintain service to ABQ, Amtrak would simply need to refurbish the "Abajo Wye". To move service to Belen, Amtrak would have to build a platform track, and a station, and a ticket office, and baggage handling, and arrange for fuel and potable water supply and sewer cleanout -- waaaaay more expensive. Much cheaper for Amtrak to run up to ABQ and back down.
I think the people who are trying to keep the train running over Raton Pass are the ones scaremongering about losing Albuquerque. Unless BNSF or the State of New Mexico fights with Amtrak or the SW Chief gets cut entirely, ABQ will almost certainly be served.
 
This made the news in Lubbock yesterday because if the train does get re-routed it's suggested there will be an Am-Bus from Lubbock to Amarillo. Also expressed was reports that the Dallas - Denver proposed "Cap Rock Express" could happen too. Although that may be more wishful thinking from the Texas Association of Rail Passengers. I would really like to see both things happen. It'd be great to not always do the 5 hour drive to Dallas from Lubbock. And it'd be nice to be able to take a train to Chicago without having to go to Dallas or ABQ to get it. (An hour bus ride to Amarillo isn't bad at all!) Here's a link to the story: http://www.myfoxlubbock.com/news/local/story/Lubbock-Lubbock-Trains-west-Texas-Trains-Caproc/etVnWQMZ9kSJhMNwxVPoFQ.cspx
 
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