Suggestions for for LA--Portland--St. Paul trip

[Viajero Joven]

Hi everyone, greetings from Flyertalk.com

I usually travel by air, but Amtrak holds a special place for me. I'm planning my first ever sleeping car trip, St. Paul to LA (or vice versa) using Continental-to-Guest Rewards points on the Coast Starlight and Empire Builder.

My questions are:

-- For the best scenery, which side of the train should we try to get rooms on?

-- Is it worth spending more for a Deluxe room vs. a Standard? 2 people would travel, my mom and myself-- both of us are 5'7".

-- Should we fly to LA, then train back (1 hour connection in Portland) or take the train to LA and fly to St. Paul (4 hours from CS arrival until 1am LAX flight)?

If we can't get ideal rooms, should we settle for what's available and travel under the promo, or just go later for full price? For the moment, availability is very limited-- hoping to travel in late June under the 20% discount, so we may not have much of an option.

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As a related tip for all of you, consider earning Continental or United miles that you can later move to Amtrak. The airlines have promotions for double miles, etc., and a round trip from the east coast to Asia for $600 can yield 20,000 points, enough for a 2 zone standard room one way.

Thanks!!

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Just to get this started let me give you my take on the one I feel strongest about---your second question. yes, I do think it is well worth it to take the deluxe room. That will enhave your enjoyment and your comfort level significantly. When you get on board and look at the two accommodations, you will see what I mean. ANd you will have your own lavatory and an enclosed toilet which also serves as your shower room. A nice big sofa to lounge on during the day, while one of you sits in a chair. In the smaller room, each of you just get one chair during the day, no private toilet or lavatory, or private shower(you go down the hall or downstairs for your toilet and lavatory and downstairs for your shower.

For the scenery, not sure if it matters, and not sure that you can really choose that much, about which side, because cars can be placed to face in different directions and the people making reservations do not have that information.

As to your connections, remember that trains can run late, so be careful about this that. Others may give you more specific advice.

 

[Viajero Joven]

Bill, thanks for the reply!

Re. the air-train connection, I'm leaning toward flying to LA and taking the train back- missing the flight would be a real bummer!! We don't have the luxury of padding the LA arrival by a day. I'm a little worried about the 1 hour CS to EB connection in Portland-- but I trust you guys can better advise on that.

On the car diagram, I see the dlx rooms are all on the same side of the train-- as are the even standard rooms. My hunch is that, especially on the CS, the car would be positioned so the deluxe rooms would have the best view.... and thusly, even standard rooms would be better off.

Maybe I'm saying too much... I yield to the experts!

 

[AlanB]

On the car diagram, I see the dlx rooms are all on the same side of the train-- as are the even standard rooms. My hunch is that, especially on the CS, the car would be positioned so the deluxe rooms would have the best view.... and thusly, even standard rooms would be better off.
Maybe I'm saying too much... I yield to the experts!

Amtrak positions the cars in any way they please without regard to which side might have the best scenery. In fact it's not uncomon to see one sleeper orientated in one direction while the second one is opposite.

However one advantage of a deluxe bedroom, is the fact that you can still look out the door of your room and then through the window in the hall. The standard bedroom does not offer this luxury. Especially if your neighboor across the hall has their curtains drawn.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

The standard rooms are on boths sides of the car, the deluxe on one side only.

I was on my way to a meeting earlier and did not get a chance to address your connection problem.You SHOULD be worried about your one hour connection from CS to EB. The Coast Starlight has a reputation for running late with some frequency.

Any chance you could spend an extra day in Portland? I would strongly advise it.

 

[Viajero Joven]

Bill and Allen,

I checked a few things this afternoon.... looks like there's more sleeping car availability than there was last time I looked. I am leaning toward Deluxe over Standard rooms. And, if we get Deluxe rooms, since the side of the train is luck of the draw, I guess there's no use in worrying about it.

I'm hoping someone can add input on the CS to EB connection-- how padded are the schedules? Are connections bussed, or the train held? Is there a substancial number of people making the connection?

Our likely dates will be leaving LA June 27 or 28- right after the track work is scheduled to be finished north of Sacramento.

I put a spot on hold for the June 28 date-- it's deluxe LA to Portland, Standard Portland to Spokane on train 28 (all that was available) then a midnight move in Spokane to a deluxe on Train 8.

For June 27, though, there's a Family Bedroom on the CS-- that would guarantee an ocean view. Then deluxe from Portland to St. Paul. What do you think?

Sorry for all the questions.... don't mean to sound like a newbie, but I'm trying to make everything just right.

I officially owe you one when you pop over to flyertalk.com

 

[pismobum]

Portland is a beautiful city and a layover is highly recommended. However, the CS to EB connection is normally guaranteed (not when they have construction reroutes but you are doing it after the construction is ended). If train 14 is late you get a bus out of Eugene to Portland - later you get a bus KFalls-Portland - later still and it's KFalls-Pasco - worst case scenario it's KFalls-Spokane, but you WILL make the connection. Reverse order into LA for a 1AM is a no-no. #11 is habitually late and you would miss that flight most of the time. There is no diner Portland-Seattle, but the cold sleeper meal we got was one of the best meals we had ever eaten! That was a couple years ago - dunno if the vendor is still the same. For scenery, the sightseer lounge is your best bet, so the real decision of std/deluxe is whether the restroom and extra space is worth the price differential. Having ridden the ride many times, the scenic spots are the Santa Susanna pass out of LA (left), Ventura to Vandenberg (left), Cuesta Grade north of SLO (left then right), Elkhorn Slough north of Salinas (both), Mt Shasta if running late (right), the long lake north of KFalls (left), and Cascades grade from Chemult to Eugene (mostly right - some left). Out of Portland up the Columbia (right) and Rockies (both sides). After the Rockies, it's flat nothing or fields.

 

[AlanB]

Viajero,

First room availability can go up and down, as just like you’ve made a tentative reservation, others may do the same. If they fail to pay for the room by the deadline, then the room goes back into the pool to be sold to someone else.

Now for the connection in Portland, Amtrak considers this to be a guaranteed connection. That means that no matter what Amtrak is obligated to get you to your ultimate destination. If things run smoothly, then you will indeed make your connection in Portland. If you are running late, then things get interesting. If the train is going to be no more than a half hour past the normal departure time of the Empire Builder, then they might decide to hold the EB for you. Certainly anything later than that and you can forget about connecting in Portland. After all the Portland section of the EB must connect with the Seattle section, so they can’t hold the Portland section for very long.

If you are running a few hours late, expect to be bussed or transported in a van to make a connection. Depending on how late you are, they will take you off the train at one of the stops before Portland. Then you will be bussed to a stop on the Portland EB, in effect catching that train on its way to Spokane.

If you are extremely late, then a couple of things could happen. Amtrak might just fly you to St. Paul. The other option is that they will put you up in a hotel in Portland and then send you out on the next days EB. This however could leave you riding in coach, if all the bedrooms are sold out. You would of course get a refund for the loss of the bedroom accommodations.

As for padding there really isn’t too much here. In fact you would actually be better off if you were using Amtrak coming home. Going that way there is a four-hour layover in Portland, which would help to ensure that you make your connection.

Finally here are a couple of thoughts on the family room. First off you should understand that this room is on the lower level of the car. While this means less people walking by your room, it does mean that you are closer to the tracks and the wheels. This can make the ride a little noisier than it would be in a deluxe room. The family room also does not have it’s own bathroom, like the deluxe does. Plus you have to go upstairs to access the rest of the train, including the diner and the lounge.

Next, while the family room does actually have a window on each side of the car, there are two other things to consider. First, the view is always better from the upper level of the car. You can often see over things that you couldn’t see over from the lower level. Second, there is only one window on each side of the room. In the deluxe rooms and even the standard rooms you actually have a double window or two windows side by side.

Having the double window allows you a better angle to see things that are coming. With the single window you view is almost straight out the window. It’s much harder to see ahead or behind. Of course frankly the view from the room should not be your biggest issue. You will wish to spend time in the dining car eating your meals, plus for the best scenery you should be in the lounge cars. They really off the best views of the passing scenery.

 

[amtrakadirondack]

Rooms are booked on a first-come, first-serve basis, I think people can book the side of the car they want.

 

[AlanB]

Rooms are booked on a first-come, first-serve basis, I think people can book the side of the car they want.

Well you can't book which side you want. However you can via the phone or in person at a station, request a specific room number. That does not guarantee which side you will end up on though, as the sleeper can run with the deluxe rooms nearest the head end or it can run with the standard rooms nearest the head end.

 

[Viajero Joven]

Hi everyone,

As an update, we've decided to first fly to LA and take the train from there, and we're going with the Duluxe Bedrooms as much as possible-- for now, only a Standard is available for Portland to Spokane, but we'll live. Thanks for your tips- I won't worry about the side of the train since it's luck of the draw.

I'm just tweaking a few more things, but I will post the final itinerary. Planning on leaving LA June 28.

The Guest Rewards agents have been great!! You guys have been great!! Thanks!

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

I like the way you are doing it---fly first,---get on out here---and then get started on the fun part.....the destinations themselves and then the luxury of the train on the way back.

That way you are saving the best till last..I have sometimes used that format myself.

 

[Viajero Joven]

Bill,

My rationale is that I'm the sort who would worry much more about a possible missed flight on a delayed train than vice versa-- my comfort zone is airlines, so I can handle any weather delay/flight cancellation/reroute, etc. thrown our way to make the train on time.

AlanB's post about the guaranteed connection and backup plans for the 1 hour CS to EB Portland connection also relieves my fears about that. Once we make the CS (no oversleeping!) we should be set.

All in all, I think the plan to fly first will help us to relax and enjoy the trip more.

 

[Viajero Joven]

2 things to give credit where credit is due:

-- Thanks to pismobum for details on the CS to EB connection.

-- Alan, sorry I misspelled your name last week!

 

[steve_relei]

My suggestion would be to take the Empire Builder westbound to Portland and then south on the Coast Starlight and then fly home from LA. The ride on the Builder is scenic through Glacier National Park and through the Columbia River Gorge on the Washington side almost into Portland. I would probably choose a room on the left side of the train (going west) so that when the sun comes up, I cab open my shades, and there is the Columbia River right outside my window. The train reaches the River at Pasco and follows it as far as Vancouver, WA.

Southbound on the Starlight from Portland, I usually choose the the right side of the train to be on the water side (Puget Sound, Columbia River, Willamette River, San Francisco Bay, the Pacific Ocean (south of San Luis Obispo), but the mountains(Mt. Rainier, Hood, Shasta) are usually seen from the left side of the train. The ride usually pretty nice which ever way you look. On the Starlight, there is the Parlour Car Lounge--which is a good place to be for the most scenic part--the highlights--of the trip.

The Builder also has the wrap-around lounge car for sightseeing, especially through Glacier Park.

One reason for this direction is that the Starlight is constantly late--northbound getting into Portland, sometimes missing its connection to the Builder (connections are no longer guaranteed); although the Starlight is usually on time getting into Portland southbound, I sure it has the same problems in California and getting into LA rather late. It used to connect to the Southwest Chief and the Sunset Limited, but those connections are no longer guaranteed either. So, I would keep those in mind.

Also keep in mind UP's construction project in the Oregon Cascades, which is supposed to last until the end of June. During construction, the Starlight runs as far as Eugene, bus to Klamath Falls, train again in Klamath Falls for the rest of the trip. The northbound train follows the same pattern (in reverse). If that is an issue to you, I would check those dates.

 

[amtrakadirondack]

One more note:

If you have a Deluxe Bedroom, you can see out both sides of the car, one out the window, and one out the door or the window on the door to look through the window on the aisle.

Hope this helps,

Amtrakadirondack

 

[yar]

Bill and Allen,
I checked a few things this afternoon.... looks like there's more sleeping car availability than there was last time I looked. I am leaning toward Deluxe over Standard rooms. And, if we get Deluxe rooms, since the side of the train is luck of the draw, I guess there's no use in worrying about it.

I'm hoping someone can add input on the CS to EB connection-- how padded are the schedules? Are connections bussed, or the train held? Is there a substancial number of people making the connection?

Our likely dates will be leaving LA June 27 or 28- right after the track work is scheduled to be finished north of Sacramento.

I put a spot on hold for the June 28 date-- it's deluxe LA to Portland, Standard Portland to Spokane on train 28 (all that was available) then a midnight move in Spokane to a deluxe on Train 8.

For June 27, though, there's a Family Bedroom on the CS-- that would guarantee an ocean view. Then deluxe from Portland to St. Paul. What do you think?

Sorry for all the questions.... don't mean to sound like a newbie, but I'm trying to make everything just right.

I officially owe you one when you pop over to flyertalk.com

no kidding! i once was on it and it was about 14 hours late -_- stuck in klamath falls...

 

[yar!]

quoted the wrong one

 

[steve_relei]

Westbound on the Empire Builder and southbound on the Starlight: The Builder arrives Portland at 10:10am. The Starlight departs Portland at 2:25pm, so there is a 4-hour cushion between trains. As I said above, the northbound Starlight is supposed to arrive Portland at 3:40pm, and the eastbound Builder leaves at 4:45pm. The Starlight is rarely on time and often arrives after the Builder has left. Amtrak no longer guarantees connections between the two trains. If you go this way, perhaps you can plan to spend the night in Portland. That way you don't have to worry so much about connecting between trains. There is plenty to do and see in Portland--Grayline has 4-hour tours that show off the city and Mt. Hood and the Columbia River Gorge. If you have all day, there are trips to the Ocean beaches.

Similarly, you could go all the way to Seattle and spend the night there before continuing east on the Builder. The Seattle section of the Builder travels along the Puget Sound and then through the Washington Cascades, including the 8-mile Cascade Tunnel, and then onto Seattle. The Seattle and Portland sections combine at Spokane.

There are a number of ways to do this. It would depend on how much much you have, money, time, desires.

 

[Viajero Joven]

There are a number of ways to do this. It would depend on how much much you have, money, time, desires.

Isn't that always the case???

Well, as an update, we've decided to postpone the trip for now--- later when we do it, hopefully we can build in extra time to spend an extra day or two en route. Especially if we go westbound into LA, if we have a full day before our flight, we won't have to worry about the connections.

The advice here continues to be top notch, and I will refer to this thread when we have new dates. We'll miss out on the 20% discount, but I think the trip will be more relaxing and enjoyable. Myself, I'm thinking of taking loads of vacation time (a couple weeks off) in October, so that may be when we do it. Still warm with good scenery, but maybe fewer crowds.

Again, I invite you over to flyertalk.com to check out discussions on airlines and travel around the US and the world.

 

[Morris&Essex]

Excellent site, Viajero