The NARP Blues ...

[Montanan]

So I finally joined the National Association of Railroad Passengers two months ago -- mostly because I support the cause of an expanded intercity passenger rail network in America, and partly because of the 10% discount Amtrak offers to people who present NARP membership cards when purchasing a ticket.

And therein lies the problem: NARP seems either completely unable or unwilling to send me a membership card! Unlike other organizations I belong to, I didn't even receive an acknowledgement after making my contribution -- but they've started sending me junk mail requests for more money, so I know that I'm on their membership list. I've phoned their main office twice and sent them an e-mail, but the promised card has never been sent ... and now my next round of Amtrak travel is coming up in a couple of weeks. I'm going to try calling them again this morning, but I'm starting to lose hope.

NARP's apparent lack of regard for its new members is discouraging ... but it also tells me that there's an inherent inefficiency in the group, and that makes me wonder if they have the slightest hope of being an effective lobbying body. But I guess it's all that we have. On a personal level, though, I know that unless something changes they're not going to get any more money from me.

Anyway, this message was partly just to vent, but if anyone has some ideas on how I might actually get my !@#$%!! membership card, it would be appreciated. And does anyone know of any other rail passenger organizations in America that might be worthy of my support?

 

[Rafi]

Most of the NARP team has been out in Oregon for the past week or so at the annual NARP board meeting, which means they had a skeletal staff at the office in DC. Call today and ask for Matt. He should be back by now and should be able to help you out.

Rafi

 

[Montanan]

Most of the NARP team has been out in Oregon for the past week or so at the annual NARP board meeting, which means they had a skeletal staff at the office in DC. Call today and ask for Matt. He should be back by now and should be able to help you out.
Rafi

That would explain why they're not answering their phone this morning ... but this has been going on for a month, now.

Many thanks for the lead, though. I'll give it another try tomorrow, and see what happens.

 

[Rafi]

Most of the NARP team has been out in Oregon for the past week or so at the annual NARP board meeting, which means they had a skeletal staff at the office in DC. Call today and ask for Matt. He should be back by now and should be able to help you out.
Rafi

That would explain why they're not answering their phone this morning ... but this has been going on for a month, now.

Many thanks for the lead, though. I'll give it another try tomorrow, and see what happens.

Well, you should never have a problem getting someone to pick up the main line's phone; that desk is pretty much staffed full time during normal business hours. The folks who can ultimately figure out why you haven't gotten you card yet (Dave or Matt) are the ones who probably have been at the meeting. In any case, make sure you're dialing 202-408-8362.

Rafi

 

[had8ley]

I've reported this lack of customer or membership service some time ago~ it just isn't an "overnight" occurrence.

 

[Montanan]

Well, you should never have a problem getting someone to pick up the main line's phone; that desk is pretty much staffed full time during normal business hours. The folks who can ultimately figure out why you haven't gotten you card yet (Dave or Matt) are the ones who probably have been at the meeting. In any case, make sure you're dialing 202-408-8362.
Rafi

That's the number I have. I just tried it for the third time this morning, and they're definitely not bothering to pick up.

 

[guest]

I had a similar experience when trying to get some NARP brochures to share at a travel class I was teaching for our community education department. Calls and emails not answered or returned, no brochures ever sent after several attempts. Amtrak, VIA, and many tourist railroads were more than happy to send everything and anything I wanted to pass out because they knew it might drum up some business for them!

 

[wayman]

I had a similar experience when trying to get some NARP brochures to share at a travel class I was teaching for our community education department. Calls and emails not answered or returned, no brochures ever sent after several attempts. Amtrak, VIA, and many tourist railroads were more than happy to send everything and anything I wanted to pass out because they knew it might drum up some business for them!

What a shame.

And how can one even contact NARP to discuss/complain about their inaccessibility when one can't contact them at all?

 

[Montanan]

As a follow-up to my rant, I can report that yesterday afternoon I finally got through to somebody at NARP, and the guy promised to immediately e-mail me a membership card ... and of course I didn't receive a thing! Grr!!!

So I'll try again later today. It's probably a waste of my time, but it's getting to be a matter of principle at this point. :angry2:

 

[frj1983]

So I finally joined the National Association of Railroad Passengers two months ago -- mostly because I support the cause of an expanded intercity passenger rail network in America, and partly because of the 10% discount Amtrak offers to people who present NARP membership cards when purchasing a ticket.
And therein lies the problem: NARP seems either completely unable or unwilling to send me a membership card! Unlike other organizations I belong to, I didn't even receive an acknowledgement after making my contribution -- but they've started sending me junk mail requests for more money, so I know that I'm on their membership list. I've phoned their main office twice and sent them an e-mail, but the promised card has never been sent ... and now my next round of Amtrak travel is coming up in a couple of weeks. I'm going to try calling them again this morning, but I'm starting to lose hope.

NARP's apparent lack of regard for its new members is discouraging ... but it also tells me that there's an inherent inefficiency in the group, and that makes me wonder if they have the slightest hope of being an effective lobbying body. But I guess it's all that we have. On a personal level, though, I know that unless something changes they're not going to get any more money from me.

Anyway, this message was partly just to vent, but if anyone has some ideas on how I might actually get my !@#$%!! membership card, it would be appreciated. And does anyone know of any other rail passenger organizations in America that might be worthy of my support?

Thanks for venting Montanan!

This is a problem I have had with NARP for quite some time. You can't get ahold of them when you need some help, but boy they sure can send out mail asking for more money! In fact, it was amusing to me that I just read through this entire discussion a few days ago; and then low and behold I got a mailed piece from them asking for more money...it went in the circular file.

I must admit that I am now seriously considering NOT renewing my Membership which will come due shortly. I too wonder about their inefficiency and effectiveness. Besides 10% off travel is not such a big thing to me anymore!

 

[wayman]

This is a problem I have had with NARP for quite some time. You can't get ahold of them when you need some help, but boy they sure can send out mail asking for more money! In fact, it was amusing to me that I just read through this entire discussion a few days ago; and then low and behold I got a mailed piece from them asking for more money...it went in the circular file.
I must admit that I am now seriously considering NOT renewing my Membership which will come due shortly. I too wonder about their inefficiency and effectiveness. Besides 10% off travel is not such a big thing to me anymore!

I've noticed that trend with several non-profits I've given money to (through "becoming a member") over the years. Most egregious are the ACLU and EFF, which I joined in approximately 2003. I got mailings from them about every two weeks basically asking for money. And the mailings continued for about four years after that one year of membership in each--I never renewed. They just kept spending their money on me... instead of using that money for actual useful work

Other organizations, like Doctors Without Borders and the Oregon Humane Society, are remarkably good about not sending paper mail. I get precisely one email a month and it includes updates on specific projects they're working on. I think that's great. No "ZOMG intellectual freedom will die without your support", just "here's what we're doing with your generous gift, thanks again".

Now, I understand that there's a well-known equation that non-profits have to spend on mailings in order to receive donations, and that it does work out for them (they pay very little per mailing and expect a very low number of people to actually give money in response, but it more than covers the costs of the mailing).

At one point I must have signed up on NARP's website (I forget), or maybe they just have my name through a list they got from Amtrak or AGR. They've been sending me mail, though only five or six times a year (far less frequently than the ACLU) for years. I keep thinking "maybe I should join, they support a cause that I think is valuable", but I'm never quite sure enough (given what I hear about them, and given the volume of paper mail they send to someone who's never even given them money) that they'll use my money wisely.... Though I know NARP does have an extremely informative newsletter which includes both up-to-the-minute notes on Amtrak as well as notes on what NARP itself is doing, and I do think that's fantastic.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

Most of the NARP team has been out in Oregon for the past week or so at the annual NARP board meeting, which means they had a skeletal staff at the office in DC. Call today and ask for Matt. He should be back by now and should be able to help you out.
Rafi

That would explain why they're not answering their phone this morning ... but this has been going on for a month, now.

Many thanks for the lead, though. I'll give it another try tomorrow, and see what happens.

Well, you should never have a problem getting someone to pick up the main line's phone; that desk is pretty much staffed full time during normal business hours. The folks who can ultimately figure out why you haven't gotten you card yet (Dave or Matt) are the ones who probably have been at the meeting. In any case, make sure you're dialing 202-408-8362.

This thread discusses my experiences with trying to get a membership card, as well as having at least three other forum members report that NARP failed to automatically send them membership cards. This problem really needs to be solved in the general case, and not in a way that pretends that each individual who hasn't gotten their card is unique.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

I've noticed that trend with several non-profits I've given money to (through "becoming a member") over the years. Most egregious are the ACLU and EFF, which I joined in approximately 2003. I got mailings from them about every two weeks basically asking for money. And the mailings continued for about four years after that one year of membership in each--I never renewed. They just kept spending their money on me... instead of using that money for actual useful work

I'm not sure how true this is, but I have heard that signing up for automatic monthly donations will reduce the amount of effort these types of organizations spend on trying to get a donor to give more money. I have certainly seen some evidence that the EFF does not send paper mail every two weeks to people making monthly donations, though maybe that also depends on which checkboxes you pick when signing up. I don't think the ACLU's mailing frequency is every two weeks for monthly donors, but I may not have been paying enough attention.

There is also the possibility that part of doing useful work includes telling Congresspeople ``we represent X members''. Making X larger can probably help the organization, even if many of those members aren't substantially helping the organization's overall cash flow.

 

[Montanan]

Well, I finally got an e-mailed membership card this afternoon ... slightly blurry, but hopefully it'll work. It looks like a jpg scan of a blank card, with my name typed onto the image using word-processing software or something.

 

[NARP]

Well, I finally got an e-mailed membership card this afternoon ... slightly blurry, but hopefully it'll work. It looks like a jpg scan of a blank card, with my name typed onto the image using word-processing software or something.

Montanan, it was a pleasure to speak with you by phone this afternoon. As I explained, NARP is well aware that many members have had membership administration issues since our membership database migration and modernization began several months ago. We're working very hard to make things right and I offer no excuses for poor customer service. As Rafi said, don't hesitate to call our office and ask for me (Matt) if you have any sort of issue or feedback; I'll work with our staff to ensure it's resolved after the first phone call.

We welcome being held accountable as the only national, member-based passenger train advocacy organization. We want and need the support and trust of the traveling public. Please let me know how we can achieve that.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

Montanan, it was a pleasure to speak with you by phone this afternoon. As I explained, NARP is well aware that many members have had membership administration issues since our membership database migration and modernization began several months ago. We're working very hard to make things right and I offer no excuses for poor customer service. As Rafi said, don't hesitate to call our office and ask for me (Matt) if you have any sort of issue or feedback; I'll work with our staff to ensure it's resolved after the first phone call.
We welcome being held accountable as the only national, member-based passenger train advocacy organization. We want and need the support and trust of the traveling public. Please let me know how we can achieve that.

Do you have any plans to send, via US postal mail, a membership card to every person who has a current membership who you are not absolutely certain has already recieved a card via the postal service? It seems to me that if there are some members who get duplicate cards as a result of doing this, that would be better than leaving some members without their cards.

 

[Montanan]

Do you have any plans to send, via US postal mail, a membership card to every person who has a current membership who you are not absolutely certain has already recieved a card via the postal service? It seems to me that if there are some members who get duplicate cards as a result of doing this, that would be better than leaving some members without their cards.

That would be a very appropriate thing to do ... my blurry little pdf file is going to be a little embarrassing to present at the ticket counter. But I'll be surprised if I get a real card, at least before they need to hit me up for a renewal.

And I have a couple of final thoughts about this thread. First off, I want to say that I really did appreciate the phone call from NARP -- it was a nice gesture, and their representative was sincerely apologetic. But ... the reason he called (and the reason I got my e-mailed card) was because someone from Amtrak Unlimited had forwarded this message thread to them. So NARP's response yesterday wasn't an attempt at member service as much as it was an attempt at damage control.

Still, maybe this will be a reminder to them that they need to make member relations one of their priorities. We'll see ... and for now I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

[had8ley]

I'll say one more thing and let this dead horse lay. At the beginning of this year I had a major issue that I needed to convey to NARP. Over the space of a month I called four times and faxed three times. I got less response than the Sunset is getting ready to be extended to Orlando. I don't think damage control is the the correct term in my book~ Mission Impossible would be more like it because if you can't depend on a person or organization to communicate with the membership then just how effective do you think they are at communicating their messages to other people that NEED to hear your message ???

P.S. I an NOT a member of NARP and doubt I ever will be.

 

[p&sr]

Besides 10% off travel is not such a big thing to me anymore!

Go with AAA instead! You get the same 10% discount for Amtrak (which quickly covers the cost of your membership), plus free maps and good service in case you ever have car trouble.

 

[sechs]

Go with AAA instead! You get the same 10% discount for Amtrak (which quickly covers the cost of your membership), plus free maps and good service in case you ever have car trouble.

That's California car culture for you.

You join NARP because of what they do for passenger rail, not the discount.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

Go with AAA instead! You get the same 10% discount for Amtrak (which quickly covers the cost of your membership), plus free maps and good service in case you ever have car trouble.

That's California car culture for you.

You join NARP because of what they do for passenger rail, not the discount.

what the do for passenger rail BUT NOT THERE MEMBERS. all they care about is $$$$ they need to work on there customer service.

 

[Madbuster]

I joined on the internet and according to the website was supposed to immediately receive my membership number. Guess what? I got an email thanking me for joining with no membership number. I emailed them asking them when I might expect it and never heard back. Now, I'm going to call. My first impressions are not very positive. Hopefully my second will be better.

 

[sechs]

Go with AAA instead! You get the same 10% discount for Amtrak (which quickly covers the cost of your membership), plus free maps and good service in case you ever have car trouble.

That's California car culture for you.

You join NARP because of what they do for passenger rail, not the discount.

what the do for passenger rail BUT NOT THERE MEMBERS. all they care about is $$$$ they need to work on there customer service.

They're a non-profit, not a company here to serve you. If you don't like how they work, then don't join; it's as easy as that.

 

[Montanan]

They're a non-profit, not a company here to serve you.

For me, at least, NARP's poor member service is frustrating, but it isn't the final point here. Rather, it makes me wonder about the efficiency and efficacy of the organization in a broader sense: if the NARP staff can't even manage to send a membership card to a donor who asks for one three times, how in the world are they going to be successful in something as complicated as influencing national transportation policy?

Like most of us, I have a variety of good causes that I believe in and want to support, and most of those causes are backed by nonprofit organizations asking me for money. I can only respond to a small number of those requests, so I want to support organizations that appear to be making good use of my donations. NARP appears to have a fairly systemic problem with inefficiency, here, and it makes me question whether they're worthy of such a donation.

 

[Ispolkom]

They're a non-profit, not a company here to serve you.

For me, at least, NARP's poor member service is frustrating, but it isn't the final point here. Rather, it makes me wonder about the efficiency and efficacy of the organization in a broader sense: if the NARP staff can't even manage to send a membership card to a donor who asks for one three times, how in the world are they going to be successful in something as complicated as influencing national transportation policy?

Like most of us, I have a variety of good causes that I believe in and want to support, and most of those causes are backed by nonprofit organizations asking me for money. I can only respond to a small number of those requests, so I want to support organizations that appear to be making good use of my donations. NARP appears to have a fairly systemic problem with inefficiency, here, and it makes me question whether they're worthy of such a donation.

I don't think of NARP as a good cause -- like you, their remarkably casual behavior makes me doubt that they are more effective in lobbying or other activities. But I figure I come out ahead on the deal when I compare the savings I get from the 10% discount to the $45 cost (actually more like $30-35 given that membership is deductible). I wish they were more effective, but there you have it.