WAS-EWR(Newark Int'l Airport) is $108, can I buy WAS-NHV(New

[TimSpencer]

I'm planning to take Amtrak from Washington Union Station(WAS) to Newark Int'l Airport(EWR).

The one-way fare is $108 on the afternoon train number 178.

The fare from WAS to NVH(New Haven, CT) is only $72, on the same train #178.

That will save me $36....

Can I just buy the $72 ticket for WAS to NVH, and just get off at Newark Airport Station?

Or do they check the tickets of people getting off at the airport station?

Thanks!

P.S. I have no luggage to check.

 

[PRR 60]

I'm planning to take Amtrak from Washington Union Station(WAS) to Newark Int'l Airport(EWR).The one-way fare is $108 on the afternoon train number 178.

The fare from WAS to NVH(New Haven, CT) is only $72, on the same train #178.

That will save me $36....

Can I just buy the $72 ticket for WAS to NVH, and just get off at Newark Airport Station?

Or do they check the tickets of people getting off at the airport station?

Thanks!

P.S. I have no luggage to check.

Absolutely. You can get the ticket to New Haven, or any station from EWR north (or east to purists) and just get off at Newark Airport. An Amtrak ticket with EWR as the destination includes the AirTrain fare to the airport terminals. A ticket for destinations other than EWR will not. So you will have to buy a ticket for the AirTrain shuttle to the airport terminals, but that is only $5.50 so you will still be way ahead.

 

[user 1359]

I have also noted that the fare on the Vermonter is a little cheaper into Brattleboro, than the fare into the stops just south of it. I had always assumed it was due to a subsidy from the state of Vermont.

 

[caravanman]

Similarly, travel back and forth from New York Penn station to the Newark Airport on NJ transit costs $15 one way. If you are using the cheaper airport hotels as a base for New York sightseeing, this is a big daily cost. Although I haven't tried it myself, there is a regular bus service to Newark Penn station from the airport, and the fare on NJ transit into NY Penn is now only $4.00. each way!

Ed B)

 

[daveyb99]

That will save me $36....
Can I just buy the $72 ticket for WAS to NVH, and just get off at Newark Airport Station?

That an old airline ticketing trick called "hidden city". And the airlines have been very aggressive in back charging those who cheat in this way.

I am not sure how AMTRAK would ever catch you doing this, but I DO NOT agree with PRR60 that you can "absolutely" do this as that seems to promote a practice that I am sure AMTRAK does not condone.

Maybe I am solo here, but I for one would not cheat the system like that.

 

[Dan O]

I am not sure how AMTRAK would ever catch you doing this, but I DO NOT agree with PRR60 that you can "absolutely" do this as that seems to promote a practice that I am sure AMTRAK does not condone.
Maybe I am solo here, but I for one would not cheat the system like that.

I am not sure how it is cheating Amtrak to get off sooner than the stop you paid for. I did this with Amtrak's approval this summer. I told the coach attendant that I wanted to get off a few stops early and he made sure the train stopped long enough for us to get off.

I think the suggestion would be similar to buying a round trip airline ticket because it was cheaper than a one way ticket and then just using the round trip ticket to go one way.

Just my two cents,

Dan

 

[TimSpencer]

I am not sure how it is cheating Amtrak to get off sooner than the stop you paid for. I did this with Amtrak's approval this summer. I told the coach attendant that I wanted to get off a few stops early and he made sure the train stopped long enough for us to get off.
Dan

What if the conductor looked at all the ticket stubs and found none that showed final destination as EWR,

and the station staff also radioed ahead to tell him that nobody is getting on.... can the conductor just

keep going without stopping? I realize this probably won't happen at a major station like EWR, but what

about smaller stations where nobody is getting on or off?

Thanks!

 

[ralfp]

I'm planning to take Amtrak from Washington Union Station(WAS) to Newark Int'l Airport(EWR).The one-way fare is $108 on the afternoon train number 178.

The fare from WAS to NVH(New Haven, CT) is only $72, on the same train #178.

That will save me $36....

Can I just buy the $72 ticket for WAS to NVH, and just get off at Newark Airport Station?

Or do they check the tickets of people getting off at the airport station?

They [probably] do. NJT to EWR has a ticket that gets you onto the Airtrain (to get to the terminals). I imagine that if you buy an Amtrak ticket to EWR they must have a way to check.

This trick works fine with every other station, just not EWR.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

I am not sure how it is cheating Amtrak to get off sooner than the stop you paid for. I did this with Amtrak's approval this summer. I told the coach attendant that I wanted to get off a few stops early and he made sure the train stopped long enough for us to get off.
Dan

What if the conductor looked at all the ticket stubs and found none that showed final destination as EWR,

and the station staff also radioed ahead to tell him that nobody is getting on.... can the conductor just

keep going without stopping? I realize this probably won't happen at a major station like EWR, but what

about smaller stations where nobody is getting on or off?

Thanks!

Nope. They gotta stop unless its a flag stop. Even if stopping is mainly theoretical. I've seen a train stop for the total time it takes to do a dance step in and out of the door, and release the brakes.

 

[p&sr]

Can I just buy the $72 ticket for WAS to NVH, and just get off at Newark Airport Station?

That an old airline ticketing trick called "hidden city".

Maybe I am solo here, but I for one would not cheat the system like that.

Maybe it's a problem with Airlines, but for Train Travel I cannot see how that would be cheating.

Just because I bought a ticket, nobody can force me to ride.

And just because my ticket allows a long trip, nobody can force me to stay on board. (Very different for Airplanes, of course).

If you decide not to travel as far as your ticket permits, it is even possible to get part of your fare refunded. To do this, be sure to have someone at your point of departure note on the tickets that part of the journey you paid for went unused. Then you can send them in and request a partial refund. But don't do this if the refund would be in Negative Dollars!

 

[Dan O]

I am not sure how it is cheating Amtrak to get off sooner than the stop you paid for. I did this with Amtrak's approval this summer. I told the coach attendant that I wanted to get off a few stops early and he made sure the train stopped long enough for us to get off.
Dan

What if the conductor looked at all the ticket stubs and found none that showed final destination as EWR,

and the station staff also radioed ahead to tell him that nobody is getting on.... can the conductor just

keep going without stopping? I realize this probably won't happen at a major station like EWR, but what

about smaller stations where nobody is getting on or off?

Thanks!

I don't know how it works. I asked the attendant if it was okay the night before and he said fine, just remind him in the morning. I did and he was very helpful. The stop I got off at was a rather small station. I did notice one or two people were scheduled to get off at the same station. But, I asked because I wasn't sure they might not get off early like I did. It was much closer to my home and saved me about 3 hours of train rides plus about $20. Someone picked me up at the smaller station.

Dan

 

[ralfp]

Maybe it's a problem with Airlines, but for Train Travel I cannot see how that would be cheating.
Just because I bought a ticket, nobody can force me to ride.

And just because my ticket allows a long trip, nobody can force me to stay on board. (Very different for Airplanes, of course).

Why is it different from hidden city ticketing with airplanes? What is so different between getting off a train a few stops early and not taking one or more flights? (To be clear I think a pricing structure that encourages hidden city ticketing is silly.)

The only real difference that I see is that it's harder for Amtrak to track (pardon the pun) where people leave the train (and thus hard to catch the practice), while airlines can easily see that you failed to board a flight.

 

[BaltimoreTraveler]

I am not sure if the original post was answered, but if you want to go to EWR, and your ticket doesn't say EWR, you can get off at the Newark Airport Train Station, but can't get to the Newark Airport. The only exit from the train station is the "air train" and to get to that, you have to pass through a gated area, where they check the tickets. The EWR fares include air train fare, so if you don't have an EWR ticket, you will have to pay that (I believe it's $11.00, but can't remember.)

This is the only station that I know of like this, and I know this because I tried to use a Newark Penn ticket to get off at the EWR stop.

 

[p&sr]

Just because I bought a ticket, nobody can force me to ride.

And just because my ticket allows a long trip, nobody can force me to stay on board.

Why is it different from hidden city ticketing with airplanes?

I'll answer your question with a question. What is the difference between using "hidden city ticketing" with one airline versus with another?

The difference is that some airlines have a rule against it. Others do not, and either do not care or else encourage the practice.

Found on line:

"Although the issuance and usage of hidden city tickets is not illegal in the sense that one could be fined or sent to jail by the government, it is unethical and a breach of a passengers contract with (airline). Both tariff rule (##) and (airline's) Condition of Carriage, which are incorporated into every ticket sold by (airline) as part of our agreement to carry the passenger named on the ticket, bar hidden city ticketing."

Amtrak has NO such rules or policy. In fact, if there is any dispute as to whether you have or have not paid the appropriate fare, the penalty is to drop you off at the next "inhabited place". Which is probably just what you were intending.

 

[p&sr]

Amtrak has NO such rules or policy. In fact, if there is any dispute as to whether you have or have not paid the appropriate fare, the penalty is to drop you off at the next "inhabited place". Which is probably just what you were intending.

On the other hand, they DO have a policy that if you are a "no show" for ANY leg of a reservation, that ENTIRE reservation is cancelled. This could prove awkward, eg for your return trip...

 

[p&sr]

Amtrak has NO such rules or policy.

It's always a good idea to keep the Train Crew informed. Sometimes I ride with a ticket beyond my destination, so the trip can be easily extended if I choose. Then when it came time to exit, I realized very few others were getting off. I went to the next car to check with the Conductor and found that they would NOT open the doors to my coach. Knowing which car would allow me to exit made all the difference.

Only once have I been asked for identification on exiting. On my recent Feather River trip, I was getting off at Elko around 1:00 AM. Perhaps six people were ticketed to Elko, but only four of us showed up at the doors. The crew was busy searching the Train for the missing passengers so they would not miss their stop and end up next morning in Salt Lake City. They gathered together all their ticket stubs, sorted by destination, and asked everybody's name when we stepped off the train. So at least they knew WHO the missing passengers were, if not WHERE they were.

Likely enough they had already gotten off at Winnemucca, a much more popular turn-around for that Trip, but one that had some difficulty with Ticketing. They could have saved people a lot of trouble if they had just let the Crew know they were getting off. And taking their Seat Check Tags with them would also help.

 

[ralfp]

I'll answer your question with a question. What is the difference between using "hidden city ticketing" with one airline versus with another?
The difference is that some airlines have a rule against it. Others do not, and either do not care or else encourage the practice.

You'll get no argument from me on that; I was simply talking about the practice itself, not any prohibitions of the practice.

In practice hidden city ticketing on airlines can be done without consequences, as long as one doesn't do it too often, only skips the last segment(s), and doesn't try to check bags (except when skipping US domestic segments of a US-bound international flight).

It's always a good idea to keep the Train Crew informed.

I imagine crews on the NEC would beg to differ.

 

[PRR 60]

...The EWR fares include air train fare, so if you don't have an EWR ticket, you will have to pay that (I believe it's $11.00, but can't remember.)

The AirTrain fare is $5.50 and yes, if your ticket is not for EWR, you have to buy it to access the airport (I think I made that pretty clear in my original reply).

Amtrak NEC has no idea what station you actually use to exit, and they don't care. They only care that you have a ticket valid from your originating station (or a station prior to your origination) and that you don't travel beyond you ticketed destination. If you have a WAS to BOS ticket and you take your seat check and get off in Baltimore, they not only will not know, they could care less. There are no "hidden city" issues with Amtrak NEC.

 

[Tony]

I have also noted that the fare on the Vermonter is a little cheaper into Brattleboro, than the fare into the stops just south of it. I had always assumed it was due to a subsidy from the state of Vermont.

I guess if one gets a lower fare due to a subsidy, and then de-trains at a different station, I guess one is then cheating the subsidizer.

If New Haven, CT, or some other authority is subsidizing that rail fare to bring tourism there, and one does not then stay at a hotel in New Haven, CT, and eat at New Haven, CT restaurants, the subsidy isn't producing the expected results.

However, I do agree that Amtrak itself probably doesn't care. Though, if wide spread, Amtrak could loose the ability to offer a subsided rail fare.

 

[caravanman]

Many airport rail stations cost extra to arrive or depart from, over and above the rail stations either side of them. This is an extra "tax" which is passed on to

the airport operator, etc, to part pay for whatever facilities are provided to travelers. The airport rail station for Sydney, Australia, proved to be a lot more expensive to use than the next one, for example... I think the extra costs there are imposed to part pay for the improvments made for the Olympic Games.

I think most people would accept, say, $5, to cover the Newark airtrain fee. However, bumping up fares just because it is a take it or leave it destination is sharp practice, and I for one don't see why it should cost $4 to alight at Newark Penn, and $15 at Newark Airport, if the airtrain is only $5. (NJT fares).

Ed B)

 

[PRR 60]

...I think most people would accept, say, $5, to cover the Newark airtrain fee. However, bumping up fares just because it is a take it or leave it destination is sharp practice, and I for one don't see why it should cost $4 to alight at Newark Penn, and $15 at Newark Airport, if the airtrain is only $5. (NJT fares).
Ed B)

Even more interesting, you can buy an NJT peak one-way from New York Penn to Elizabeth for $5.50. Get off at EWR. Pay the $5.50 Airtrain fare, and get to the airport for $11.00. Or you can buy the through fare for $15.00. Gee, I wonder who is getting the extra $4?

 

[ralfp]

Even more interesting, you can buy an NJT peak one-way from New York Penn to Elizabeth for $5.50. Get off at EWR. Pay the $5.50 Airtrain fare, and get to the airport for $11.00. Or you can buy the through fare for $15.00. Gee, I wonder who is getting the extra $4?

Idiots like me.

Thanks for the tip, though I've realized that the bus ($15 o/w) is a better deal for me, as I'm usually headed to GCT anyways.