Lakeshore Limited Review

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Gingee

OBS Chief
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Nov 21, 2004
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Just got off the Lakeshore Limited yesterday. Took it from Chicago to NYC.

When we left Chicago, they first called for the handicapped people, then the seniors, then the people with children ten and under, then finally us. We got the last car with weak air conditioning and no outlets. The food was better going to NYC.

Coming back it was basically anyone who did not have a sleeper could get on. We got in a car (last one like last time) with outlets and air conditioning so that was better. They did run out of food very early on. Not sure why.

I should mention that we took coach both ways. Asked for sleeper availability but they never came back and told us.

We can understand why they switched engines going from Chicago to NYC but why did they switch engines in New York (Albany) when we had only been on the train for one hour?

Also in Erie Pennsylvannia the immigration people came on the train and questioned the people behind us. They were a young couple from Poland. Supposedly students. They didn't have their visas. Supposedly they said that where they go to school, it wasn't that important. Anyway, they took them off the train with their luggage. The big guy told them that they could get thirty days in jail, $5000 charge and/or sent back home. Now on the way back (different location) these guys came on again but basically just walked through the car. Has this happened to anyone else?
 
Gingee said:
We can understand why they switched engines going from Chicago to NYC but why did they switch engines in New York (Albany) when we had only been on the train for one hour?
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If memory serves, the units operating on the LSL out of NYP are dual-mode - electric and diesel electric - and are taken off at Albany for replacement by straight diesel electrics. You can spot the dual-mode units by their third rail pickup shoes. Again, this is from memory, and I could be wrong.
 
Gingee said:
We can understand why they switched engines going from Chicago to NYC but why did they switch engines in New York (Albany) when we had only been on the train for one hour?
Click to expand...
The engine used between Albany and New York City is dual mode: it has a diesel prime mover, but it can also operate off of third rail power. Third rail power is needed in the tunnels in New York City where operating diesels (except in emergencies) is not allowed.

Between Albany and Chicago, a regular diesel locomotive (actually, two, I think) is used.

Amtrak has a finite number of dual mode locomotives, and with the current inventory, they can't run the dual mode locomotives all the way to Chicago because they don't t have enough. But the dual mode locomotives also are somewhat lower horsepower, probably so that the extra equipment for third rail operation can be accomodated within the weight limit.
 
Gingee said:
Just got off the Lakeshore Limited yesterday. Took it from Chicago to NYC.
When we left Chicago, they first called for the handicapped people, then the seniors, then the people with children ten and under, then finally us. We got the last car with weak air conditioning and no outlets. The food was better going to NYC.

Coming back it was basically anyone who did not have a sleeper could get on. We got in a car (last one like last time) with outlets and air conditioning so that was better. They did run out of food very early on. Not sure why.

I should mention that we took coach both ways. Asked for sleeper availability but they never came back and told us.

We can understand why they switched engines going from Chicago to NYC but why did they switch engines in New York (Albany) when we had only been on the train for one hour?

Also in Erie Pennsylvannia the immigration people came on the train and questioned the people behind us. They were a young couple from Poland. Supposedly students. They didn't have their visas. Supposedly they said that where they go to school, it wasn't that important. Anyway, they took them off the train with their luggage. The big guy told them that they could get thirty days in jail, $5000 charge and/or sent back home. Now on the way back (different location) these guys came on again but basically just walked through the car. Has this happened to anyone else?
Click to expand...
I would assume the engine change at Albany would be due to the end of the cantenary - they use electric locomotives out of New York and diesels beyond Albany.

Not that I've taken this route but I do know that there is no overhead power in Chicago and the have to use electrics in the New York tunnels. Locomotive change used to take place at Harmon in the 'olden days'.
 
Konrad said:
I would assume the engine change at Albany would be due to the end of the cantenary - they use electric locomotives out of New York and diesels beyond Albany.
Click to expand...
The Lake Shore Limited does not use catenary power at all. And the electrification doesn't come anywhere close to reaching Albany.
 
Joel N. Weber II said:
Konrad said:
I would assume the engine change at Albany would be due to the end of the cantenary - they use electric locomotives out of New York and diesels beyond Albany.
Click to expand...
The Lake Shore Limited does not use catenary power at all. And the electrification doesn't come anywhere close to reaching Albany.
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That's what I thought. All third rail, electrification doesn't go that far, and Albany is just the first convenient engine changeout point.
 
The change was originally made at Harmon, from the late 1800's. The whole point was to keep steam engines (and , later, pure diesel engines) from overwhelming steaming up and smoking up the tunnels under New York City. It was an early attempt to stave off pollution, well before that became "fashionable".

Even the fabled, almost non-stop 20th Century Limited had to stop at Harmon to have the engines changed. The electric engines used at that time were stubby, funny-looking little critters that mostly only a mother could love. Hopefully someone can produce a picture of one---- try looking under New York Central locomotives.
 
Googled around for awhile looking for that early electric engine to no avail however I did find something more interesting then an electric Engine an ROCKET POWERED one!! which blew my mind it hold the rail speed record in the USA 183.85 in the 60s

m497.jpg


now thats high speed rail
 
As far as the immigration people go that would seem to be normal.

Whenever you are near a border on public transportation you are likely

to get questioned.

They stopped an on duty Los Angeles Airport Policeman last year and

wanted to question him. Caused a big standoff between the two agencies.

It has always seemed strange to me that someone who was safe in Canada

suddenly becomes dangerous when they walk across the border.
 
We were surprised to see the immigration people. Never have seen that before.
 
On the way back, the immigration people just walked through the car and that was about it.
 
I promise you they were as mean an engine as they looked. They shook so violently you could not stand up at track speed. (My hoghead said, "We don't look at the speedometer we go until we can't count the telephone poles.") They were hot, dreary and loud as they could get but they were the power to be between Harmon/White Plains and GCT for many a year.
 
had8ley said:
I promise you they were as mean an engine as they looked. They shook so violently you could not stand up at track speed. (My hoghead said, "We don't look at the speedometer we go until we can't count the telephone poles.") They were hot, dreary and loud as they could get but they were the power to be between Harmon/White Plains and GCT for many a year.
Click to expand...


I am not a locomotive expert but I seem to recall pictures of something dark green, rather than NYC colors, and maybe even stubbier looking than that. Probably in the 40's, maybe gone by the 50's.

I can picture it in books at home but have not found it on the net, so far.
 
The NYC had a real stubby electric box that drug trains from Mott Haven yard to GCT. I think it was #100 but I don't remember the color. It was supposedly the first electric cab on the property from the teens.
 
rogers55 said:
As far as the immigration people go that would seem to be normal.Whenever you are near a border on public transportation you are likely

to get questioned.
Click to expand...
Anytime you are within 100 miles of a US border you can be stopped and subject to questioning and search by US Customs. And it's not just public transportation either. One can find check points on many highways, like for example I-87 just south of the Lake Placid area. They make everyone stop and usually ask each car at least a question or two before allowing one to proceed. But there are usually a few cars that get singled out for one reason or another for further questioning and possibly searched.

rogers55 said:
They stopped an on duty Los Angeles Airport Policeman last year and wanted to question him. Caused a big standoff between the two agencies.
Click to expand...
No contest there and I'm surprised that the LA police didn't know that they loose in that situation. Customs is Federal and that always trumps anything State or City. That officer is lucky he's not cooling his heals in a Federal jail and facing Federal prosecution for his refusal.

rogers55 said:
It has always seemed strange to me that someone who was safe in Canadasuddenly becomes dangerous when they walk across the border.
Click to expand...
Not that strange at all considering how many terrorists have been caught at the US border or even later, that got into the US via Canada.
 
rogers55 said:
It has always seemed strange to me that someone who was safe in Canadasuddenly becomes dangerous when they walk across the border.
Click to expand...
Not too many people are that interested in terrorizing Canada. Rather more are interested in terrorizing the United States. Still not that many, but decidedly more.
 
I took the Lake Shore Limited on Sunday, August 24th - to arrive in Albany on the 25th. On Monday morning in Erie, PA, the border patrol also boarded our train and questioned everyone their nationality. They scrutinized anyone that spoke with an accent, (except for two English students who they gave a quick look at their passports and handed them back, no questions asked). They woke up a woman who was Brazilian and apparently did not have the proper papers and pulled her and her baggage off the train.

Ridiculous.

Gingee said:
Just got off the Lakeshore Limited yesterday. Took it from Chicago to NYC.
When we left Chicago, they first called for the handicapped people, then the seniors, then the people with children ten and under, then finally us. We got the last car with weak air conditioning and no outlets. The food was better going to NYC.

Coming back it was basically anyone who did not have a sleeper could get on. We got in a car (last one like last time) with outlets and air conditioning so that was better. They did run out of food very early on. Not sure why.

I should mention that we took coach both ways. Asked for sleeper availability but they never came back and told us.

We can understand why they switched engines going from Chicago to NYC but why did they switch engines in New York (Albany) when we had only been on the train for one hour?

Also in Erie Pennsylvannia the immigration people came on the train and questioned the people behind us. They were a young couple from Poland. Supposedly students. They didn't have their visas. Supposedly they said that where they go to school, it wasn't that important. Anyway, they took them off the train with their luggage. The big guy told them that they could get thirty days in jail, $5000 charge and/or sent back home. Now on the way back (different location) these guys came on again but basically just walked through the car. Has this happened to anyone else?
Click to expand...
 
jm said:
They woke up a woman who was Brazilian and apparently did not have the proper papers and pulled her and her baggage off the train.
Ridiculous.
Click to expand...
Why is it ridiculous to take into custody someone who doesn't have the proper paperwork and isn't a US citizen. That's what its all about. The only way they will catch folks breaking the law is to come aboard and search.
 
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