jis
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I think of Alan as more like Scotty!And Alan as Mr. Spock. :wub: :giggle:
I think of Alan as more like Scotty!And Alan as Mr. Spock. :wub: :giggle:
That is quite possible. I am not familiar with their operations. Then such collector people would be equivalent to TTEs (Traveling Ticket Examiners)in India.Many US commuter railroads like the LIRR and Metra have "collectors' that do just that--collect tickets and fares, and perhaps open coach doors. I don't think they are all even qualified to be 'assistant conductor's"......
Conductor gives the highball by handsignal or radio (or on commuter trains closes the doors) and engineer proceeds. Of course the engineer also obeys signals and instructions from the dispatcher, but the conductor is the boss of the train.Maybe as a matter of rule, but as a matter of practice? The Engineer is talking with dispatchers and looking at signals and everything else Forward. The Conductor, while maybe trying to keep up with that is also dealing with lineup asking for an onboard upgrade. I really do not think the Engineer needs Conductor approval to stop at a red signal, or start up again after being put on a siding. At a station, sure ... but out on the open rails? Really?The engineer cannot do anything, and that includes moving the train without the conductor's permission. The engineer is just the driver; the conductor is in charge of the train.
I've been on all the Western LDs, talked with several and every one of them had just the one engineer.I am pretty certain there are still Assistant Engineers (firemen). Perhaps not on every route. I could not imagine them only having one person in the cab on LD routes.You are mistaken! There is no OBS Chief! And there is no fireman in the cab either.Please advise if I am mistaken.
Course, I have been wrong a few times in my life.
That is incorrect: although the train operator actually moves the train, the conductor has to give him/her permission first. Officially, the train operator's job is to move the train, but the conductor's (besides closing doors and making announcements) is to keep the train operating safely. So the conductor is superior, although to go from conductor to train operator is considered a promotion.One place where the conductor is subordinate to the train operator, is the New York City Subway system....
I believe the official reason for not using OPTO is safety during evacuations. One person is needed to control the crowd (can be over 1000 people) and the other to, for example, go up a staircase to see if it is suitable to evacuate passengers.jis said:Even on NYCTA, if they can ever get over 19th century union operating rules and actually operate OPTOthere will be no conductor. Most other modern subway systems, specially those with ATC do not have conductors.
Are you sure the train operator on NYC Subway is not in charge? IIRC, in times of irregular operations, evacuations, etc.; it is the train operator that issues instructions to the conductor....I will try to get an answer from the source some time in the next few days....That is incorrect: although the train operator actually moves the train, the conductor has to give him/her permission first. Officially, the train operator's job is to move the train, but the conductor's (besides closing doors and making announcements) is to keep the train operating safely. So the conductor is superior, although to go from conductor to train operator is considered a promotion.One place where the conductor is subordinate to the train operator, is the New York City Subway system....
It's odd, but true.
I believe the official reason for not using OPTO is safety during evacuations. One person is needed to control the crowd (can be over 1000 people) and the other to, for example, go up a staircase to see if it is suitable to evacuate passengers.jis said:Even on NYCTA, if they can ever get over 19th century union operating rules and actually operate OPTOthere will be no conductor. Most other modern subway systems, specially those with ATC do not have conductors.
It's not like the guard is actually guarding the train with a gun! The "guard" is similar to Amtrak's conductor, but the difference being, he does not go around the train checking tickets and boarding passengers. He sits in the Guard Cabin at the end of the train and monitors its run and communicates with the engineers.Why do the Indian trains have a Guard?! :blink: Is it like they think the train will be robbed or something? :excl: If it's like a Conductor, why call it a Guard? I also hear that there are window bars on non-AC trains and on some locomotives. Do all this have to do with a big safety issue?
The same reason there are no police in England. We call then "Bobbies"! And in England, there are no lawyers - they are "Solicitors". (If you ask for a "Solicitor" on the street in the US, I'm almost certain you will not get a lawyer! Well after you're arrested probably!Why do the Indian trains have a Guard?! :blink: Is it like they think the train will be robbed or something? :excl: If it's like a Conductor, why call it a Guard?
The Empire Builder has one engineer for most of its route. The one segment that is an exception is between Shelby, MT and Minot, ND. This segment has two engineers.I've been on all the Western LDs, talked with several and every one of them had just the one engineer.I am pretty certain there are still Assistant Engineers (firemen). Perhaps not on every route. I could not imagine them only having one person in the cab on LD routes.You are mistaken! There is no OBS Chief! And there is no fireman in the cab either.Please advise if I am mistaken.
Course, I have been wrong a few times in my life.
Quote from rulebook of NYC Transit:Are you sure the train operator on NYC Subway is not in charge? IIRC, in times of irregular operations, evacuations, etc.; it is the train operator that issues instructions to the conductor....I will try to get an answer from the source some time in the next few days....
So is that what "the Penthouse Suite" means?The same reason there are no police in England. We call then "Bobbies"! And in England, there are no lawyers - they are "Solicitors". (If you ask for a "Solicitor" on the street in the US, I'm almost certain you will not get a lawyer! Well after you're arrested probably!Why do the Indian trains have a Guard?! :blink: Is it like they think the train will be robbed or something? :excl: If it's like a Conductor, why call it a Guard?)
Yes. Apparently you are correct. I asked a conductor on a 'C' Train that question today, while waiting for my 'E' to come. He confirmed that he is in charge of the train.Quote from rulebook of NYC Transit:Are you sure the train operator on NYC Subway is not in charge? IIRC, in times of irregular operations, evacuations, etc.; it is the train operator that issues instructions to the conductor....I will try to get an answer from the source some time in the next few days....
Conductors who are assigned to revenue train service have charge of trains and are responsible for the safety, regularity and proper care and condition of trains and such orders as they may give…must be obeyed
Source
Because when this forum was first started, OBS Chief was still a valid position. So we thought it would be fun to sort of move through the "ranks" as it were as people make posts and contribute to the forum. In real life however, it would actually be very unlikely that someone would go from being an OBS Chief to a conductor and then onto an engineer.And why is OBS Chief a title on AU?
Well I can't do the Scottish accent, sorry!I think of Alan as more like Scotty!And Alan as Mr. Spock. :wub: :giggle:
Well at least when the the DC Metro was operating on automatic the only delay would be in opening the doors. As soon as the motorman closed the doors, the automatics took over and started moving the train before the motorman ever got back to the actual controls. So that minimized the dwell times.Regarding the NYC subway and OPTO, it also reduces station dwell. As a DC Metro rider, I've gotten used to waiting for the operator to switch from the right side of the cab to the left to open and close doors at island platforms (of which there are many), then back to the right. It may be a few seconds at each stop, but it adds up... In NY the conductor switches cabs between stations. I'd also argue that the conductor, located mid-train, can see doors better but maybe good mirrors take care of that.
Well you just have to learn that Scottish accent, because you are as good as Scotty in making those website "buckets of bolt" hold together and not fall apart.Well I can't do the Scottish accent, sorry!I think of Alan as more like Scotty!And Alan as Mr. Spock. :wub: :giggle:
However, I can do the Vulcan hand salute.
So I don't know where that leaves you guys. :lol:
If you're talking about the last stop on the train, it always takes a while to open the door because the conductor has to switch to the cab in the next car. This is done so that the next conductor can just get in and be ready to operate.And I've been on plenty of subway trains in NY where it seemed like the conductor couldn't find the door open button.
Nope, not talking about end terminals. I've seen delays at stops along the route. Additionally, what you describe at the end terminals wasn't even possible on the older cars and I've never seen it happen on the newer cars. There are no end points where they must change conductors so fast that there is such a need. My line, the #7, at Times Square probably has the fastest turnover of any line during rush hour and there is still enough time to swap out conductors in the same cab.If you're talking about the last stop on the train, it always takes a while to open the door because the conductor has to switch to the cab in the next car. This is done so that the next conductor can just get in and be ready to operate.And I've been on plenty of subway trains in NY where it seemed like the conductor couldn't find the door open button.
Note that the doors must all be closed and the train stopped for the conductor to switch positions.
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