Amsnag

[Edgar Wooodhead]

It says that the bus is free and is included when you book the train, does it still count as a segment?

Is there any other way of getting from the station to the town centre.

 

[Edgar Woodhead]

It says

Passengers destined for Williams, AZ, will detrain at the Williams Junction stop. A free shuttle van will be waiting at Williams Junction to take passengers to the Grand Canyon Railway Hotel in Williams.

Departures from this station are at the Grand Canyon Railway Hotel only. A van will connect passengers from the hotel to the Williams Junction platform to board the train.

 

[Ryan]

Segment count only matters for the rail pass, which you're not using (although Anderson's idea may have some merit).

But yes, it does count:

What is a Travel Segment?

Amtrak considers a travel segment any time you get on and then get off a vehicle (train, bus, ferry or other allowable leg) regardless of length.

This location serves passengers traveling on the Southwest Chief to/from Williams, AZ. A free shuttle van connects passengers to/from the Grand Canyon Railway Hotel in Williams. Private vehicle access to this stop is not allowed.

Travel should be booked to/from the Williams Station (WMA) to ensure the free shuttle is waiting for connections to the train.

When you book CHI-WMA it clearly shows 2 segments:

 

[Ryan]

OK, now I've got some time to look at your trip - it's cheaper at the current prices to not use a rail pass.

Here are the fares I got online - I also checked a single in a roomette to ensure that the pricing bug doesn't screw things up (they don't).

Just an observation: Maybe use a 15-day railpass and simply pay cash for the LAX-SAN legs?

Good thought, but that doesn't seem to help. The coach fares from NYP-LAX (the first time) fit within the 15 day window, but total $1512 (for 4 people). The 15 day rail pass is $449/ea for a total of $1796.

If coach prices rise any before he books, the rail pass may become the better option.

 

[Edgar]

Iam booking it in the next few days, so the individual tickets look better

 

[the_traveler]

The bus to and from the Williams Junction stop I don't think counts as another segment. The only way to get to/from the stop is via the shuttle bus. The quoted example is for something like the LAX to Bakersfield bus or the EMY to SF bus or the Raton to Denver bus.

 

[Ryan]

That's not what the website says.

 

[the_traveler]

A free shuttle van connects passengers to/from the Grand Canyon Railway Hotel in Williams. Private vehicle access to this stop is not allowed.Travel should be booked to/from the Williams Station (WMA)

To use your quote posted above.
Has anyone who has taken the SWC from WMA received the 100 point minimum for that segment? :huh: I think no. Plus since it states that "... Private vehicle access ... is not allowed ...", I think that says it is not a segment. There are additional ways to get from LA to Bakersfield or Raton to Denver or ORL to TPA, but there is not from WMA to WMJ.

 

[Ryan]

Segment count only matters for the rail pass, which you're not using (although Anderson's idea may have some merit).

But yes, it does count:

What is a Travel Segment?

Amtrak considers a travel segment any time you get on and then get off a vehicle (train, bus, ferry or other allowable leg) regardless of length.

It doesn't say anything about "unless there's no other way to get to/from there".

There are also segments that don't earn the 100 point minimum (7000-series Thruway, for example).

At the end of the day it doesn't matter, as the rail pass is more expensive for him and if prices change and the rail pass works out to be cheaper, he falls under the segment limit even if WMA-WMJ counts.

This post from 3 years ago also suggests that the segment counts:

I would be happy to say hi to you if you are going to be on any of these segments! Leave me a private message and let me know if you are.

I learned a couple of things about the USA Rail Pass. You get 8 segments to use in 2 weeks for $389. But if you don't make your reservations very early, they sell out on the Rail Pass seats, and you have to pay extra!!! I had made half my reservations, and waited until last week to make the reservation for the Empire Builder from Seattle to Chicago. The Rail Pass seats were sold out, so I would have had to pay an extra $80 to get a seat. Instead, I chose to add an extra segment. So I have to go from Seattle to Spokane, and Spokane to Chicago.

Also, there are hidden segments that are really stupid. To get from the train station at WIlliams Junction, Arizona to the town of Williams, Arizona, where I am staying for my Grand Canyon visit, there is a bus for a 10 minute, 2 mile trip. I asked if I could pay separately for the bus, and was told no, so I have to use up 2 segments on the bus to get there and back!

July 10 - Segment 1 - Southwest Chief - Chicago to Williams, Arizona

July 11 - Segment 2 - Shuttle Bus - WIlliams Junction, Arizona to WIlliams, Arizona

July 12 - Segment 3 - Shuttle Bus - Williams, Arizona to Williams Junction, Arizona

July 12 - Segment 4 - Southwest Chief - Williams Junction, Arizona to Los Angeles, California

July 13 - Segment 5 - Coast Starlight - Los Angeles, California to San Jose, California

July 19 - Segment 6 - Coast Starlight - Sacramento, California to Seattle, Washington

July 21 - Segment 7 - Empire Builder - Seattle, Washington to Spokane, Washington

July 21 - Segment 8 - Empire Builder - Spokane, Washington to Chicago

So really, I wasted 3 segments, and only ended up getting 5 segments. Also I had to pay $35 extra because the Coast Starlight from Sacramento to Seattle's rail pass seats were sold out! So I highly recommend that if you want to use a rail pass, book your reservations early! If I had known about the extra charges I would have done so.

June

 

[June the Coach Rider]

I was led to believe that amsnag showed the low bucket fares that were not availibale to view on the Amtrak website, not the same price fares.

No. Amsnag shows what the current fair is, THE SAME AS WHAT IS ON THE AMTRAK WEBSITE.

Edited to add: It just gives you the option of checking days around the date you want to go incase a day or two difference would make a difference in the price.

 

[the_traveler]

To combine the 2 posts:

...could I pay separately for the bus...

A free shuttle van ...

How do you pay for something that is free? :huh:
If it's a segment you pay for (using a rail pass segment), it also should be a segment that you earn points with (if you paid the fare with cash, right? So has anyone received 100 AGR points for this segment? I'd like to here from anyone who has!

And before you say the fare from CHI to SFC is the same as CHI-EMY, let me point out that the fare from MTZ to SFC is more than the fare for MTZ-EMY.

 

[the_traveler]

Please see the "my trip next week" thread, posts #19 & #20. (I can't link from this iPad.)

 

[PaulM]

If someone has already clarified this, I didn't see it. Amsnag shows the current rail fare and sleeping car accommodation supplements. To get the correct total cost you multiply the low bucket (not current, not special discounts) rail fare by the number of passengers booked into the room and then add this to the supplement.

This is the way Amtrak, and pre-Amtrak railroads, published fares, not to mention the way it was when Amsnag was developed. It is only recently that they've done the addition for you.

 

[caravanman]

Well, I did try back in post 9, but your explanation is much clearer!

This whole post has emphasised just how messy the way Amtrak "explains" its operation is:

Wrong prices (sometimes) if you add a second person to a roomette

Wrong prices (sometimes) showing the special discount coach fare is more than the upgrade.

Confusion over free shuttle bus which uses up a railpass segment at around $48 a pop.

For overseas tourists just wanting to see America from ground level, it is an uphill battle!

Ed

 

[Edgar Woodhead]

It is indeed! We are going to book individual tickets- but probably through a uk booking company, who will sport the tickets for us.

 

[caravanman]

Good luck, the train trips should be great fun anyway, even if the ticket purchase has been a bit tricky. Please let us railfans know how you get on with using the UK agent and indeed the usa trip itself once you return!

Ed.

 

[Old MM]

Edgar, I'm coming to this party late, but in my opinion the best use of Amsnag is to obtain guidance on what the availability is. It may or may not match exactly what you find on the offical Amtrak website. The catch phrase "snag that low bucket" has to do with the way the site is helpful at letting you eyeball when, within a given time period for your city pairs, the fares might be lowest. And I've seen their link to Amtrak display different results within a matter of minutes, but that might be due to other people playing around with points or what have you. For example, today i researched an itin on Amtrak that was sold out, then magically seemed to open up again when I used the link from Amsnag. It really didn't matter because it required an agent call anyway but it was interesting.

 

[Makani]

I don't see the AmSnag rates listed on the Amtrak website. They are more than quadruple the prices you have listed. I'm looking at fares from Carbondale, IL to Chicago, IL on 7/15, 16, 17 and 18.

 

[Ryan]

I do.

7/15:

 

[Ryan]

I also don't know what you mean by "you have listed"

We're neither Amtrak nor Amsnag (although the Amsnag developer posts here).

 

[AmtrakBlue]

I don't see the AmSnag rates listed on the Amtrak website. They are more than quadruple the prices you have listed. I'm looking at fares from Carbondale, IL to Chicago, IL on 7/15, 16, 17 and 18.

How many travelers are you putting in? Amtrak's website site has a major problem that makes it miscalculate the total fare if one puts in more than 1 passenger. Put in one passenger then check the "summary" (shown in Ryan's post). If you're booking for more than 1 passenger you'll need to call to book to get the accurate rate.

 

[Ryan]

That only happens when there's one took left in the current bucket , which isn't the case here.

 

[Makani]

Okay. I'm just looking at train only - no roomette, but the only options I see are $34 in coach, $88 and $114.

When I do the search on Amsnag, there is a $26 fair for business class on the Saluki 390 train that leaves at 7:30 am.

What am I missing? I'm just searching Amtrak based on a date of 7/15. Thanks for your help.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

The $26 is the upgrade price for business. And is based on the flexible fare on Amtrak's site. $88+26 = $114.

 

[Makani]

I get it. Thanks.