Chicago to Miami

[VentureForth]

If one were to plan an all new route between Chicago and Miami without taking into consideration what the legacy railroads did ('casue honestly, they all went all over the place and seemed to be anything but efficient), what would be the most successful route with the least amount of infrastructure improvement required?

Driving - the biggest competitor to the train - takes you through these major metropolitan areas: Indianapolis, Louisville, Nashville, Chattanooga, Atlanta, Macon and Jacksonville. Amtrak already runs from Chicago to Indianapolis and from Jacksonville to Miami (let's even pretend that it will be on the FEC, but if not, at least Amtrak already goes between those two stations).

There is a huge chasm between Indianapolis and Jacksonville. Are there any quality tracks that go directly through the towns listed above?

CSX could host from CHI to MIA but would have to skip big population centers like Indianapolis and Louisville in favor of the smaller town of Evansville. From Nashville, the rest would be the same as driving. Actually, the route would probably be a bit shorter, but again would touch fewer potential huge revenue potentials.

Finally, just because I'm in Savannah and would love to see a Savannah-Atlanta connection, I would route Macon - Savannah - Jax rather than the more direct route of Macon - Waycross - Jax.

Any ideas what the most probable routing could be doable in less than 10 years?

 

[Monon81]

You're correct that the easiest, quickest route from Chicago to Nashville is CSX through Evansville, bypassing Indianapolis and Louisville.

Indy to Louisville is a shortline in need of major upgrading. I understand from another forum that CSX is interested in contributing toward some upgrading so it can run intermodal between Indy and L'ville. (It already runs trains from Seymour to L'ville, having inactivated the old Monon from Mitchell to New Albany.) I doubt that those upgrades would bring that track up to reasonable passenger standards.

From L'ville to Nashville, capacity is the issue. More upgrades in the form of passing sidings.

Another routing on the north end is through Cincinnati. That would bypass Louisville and Nashville, however, and I would guess capacity on the NS rathole is also an issue.

Don't know anything about areas south of Nashville. Suspect the picture is bleak.

 

[nightrider]

Easiest to implement would not be as described above, but rather restore service NOL-JAX, with thru service Chicago to Miami. True, would be not as direct, and not serve major route without service, but then again, would take a fraction of the cost or time necessary to implement...

 

[Gingee]

Gad I would love a route that went south to Miami.

 

[VentureForth]

Easiest to implement would not be as described above, but rather restore service NOL-JAX, with thru service Chicago to Miami. True, would be not as direct, and not serve major route without service, but then again, would take a fraction of the cost or time necessary to implement...

I don't disagree with you. However, I believe that the only way to justify CHI to MIA would be to add large population centers that don't exist in the rail network today.

Currently one can make the trip from CHI to MIA via the Capitol Limited and the Silver service in about 46 hours - 40 on the train and 6 hours in DC. I don't know if the timing was any better going through NOL. I believe a direct route could be done in as quick as 35 hours.

 

[jphjaxfl]

This has been discussed ad nauseam. I was a frequent traveler on the Southwind/Floridian from 1971 to 1979. Amtrak would need to do significantly better than they did with the Floridian to get anyone to ride. All of the tracks would need either an upgrade or additional capcity. CSX and NS are not going to fund. Amtrak is not going to fund. With some many states involved, they are unlikely to come to an agreement to fund, so in reality it is very unlikely to happen.

 

[Guest]

I would think that the least ammount of infrastructure to make a viable route between Chicago and Florida would be to just increase speeds on the existing routes. The current dog leg route is out of the way, but that is how the airlines do it as well. So if you put high speed rail between CHI to DC and DC to FL then you would not only get a CHI-FL route that is just as good as a slow direct route that needs all new stations and basically new tracks in some parts, but also the benefits of high speed connections for passengers only doing CHI-DC or DC-FL.

 

[VentureForth]

Well, you're right. I don't disagree. But there is some movement in some of the areas concerned that may get the discussion going again.

Tennessee is becoming increasingly more rail friendly. Not to say they're all gung ho, but they've managed to pull together a heavy rail commuter train in Nashville. CSX has talked about improving the line from Indianapolis to Lexington. CSX already has pretty good trackage between Nashville and Jacksonville (via Chatanooga, Atlanta, Macon, and Waycross).

I didn't particularly care for the routing of the Floridian because of it's route through Montgomery vs Atlanta. That being said, I'm sure the trackage from Nashville to Chatanooga is slow and winding.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

Actually, even though there is one windy spot way south of Murfreesboro, the alignment is pretty good. It quickly ducks down into Alabama and back to get to Chattanooga, but it is good.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Well, you're right. I don't disagree. But there is some movement in some of the areas concerned that may get the discussion going again.

Tennessee is becoming increasingly more rail friendly. Not to say they're all gung ho, but they've managed to pull together a heavy rail commuter train in Nashville. CSX has talked about improving the line from Indianapolis to Lexington. CSX already has pretty good trackage between Nashville and Jacksonville (via Chatanooga, Atlanta, Macon, and Waycross).

I didn't particularly care for the routing of the Floridian because of it's route through Montgomery vs Atlanta. That being said, I'm sure the trackage from Nashville to Chatanooga is slow and winding.

It is straight for awhile out of Nashville but does get slow and winding near Chattanooga.

Lots of CSX freight.

BTW Chattanooga is spelled with two "t's".

.

 

[Chuck Till]

First problem with Atlanta is that the existing Amtrak station is in the wrong place. Backup moves would be required through a very busy Howell interlocking, and NS won't be keen about having another 2 passenger trains a day tie up their mainline. Atlanta has been talking about a replacement station for 30 years. Talk, talk, talk, no action.

Second problem with Atlanta is that all the tracks to get into Atlanta from the north (CSX or NS) are exceptionally busy with freight. All tracks going south from Atlanta have the same problem -- except the ex-CofG to Macon, which would require $$$$ to upgrade.

The alternative gateway city is Birmingham. Unfortunately CSX Birmingham-Manchester-Jacksonville is also very busy with freight, and the City of Miami route is impossible because of abandonments and downgrades east of Albany.

The most feasible route, operationally speaking, is still the 1979 Floridian route: Birmingham-Montgomery-Waycross-Jacksonville. There's plenty of capacity, at least south of Nashville, but it's 300 miles of unsignalled track between Montgomery and Waycross. OK now, but not OK with the mandate for PTC arrives.

Short answer: forget it.