China Hi-Speed Puts US to Shame

[tp49]

Just because I believe the Chinese have a more efficient government than we do does not mean I want to live in China. The American tendency to say "if you don't like it here, leave!" amuses me, always. Since, after all, this society was theoretically based on the idea that all people can have an share their own opinions.

Volkris wants to unleash his libertarian views on us. We aren't a libertarian country. I haven't asked him to leave. Why is Communism any worse than the sheer logical fallacy of libertarianism?

Chinese government isnt efficient, its corrupt.

Believe it or not the Chinese government in my personal experience is very efficient...and corrupt.

 

[AC4400]

One major difference: Not just anybody in the country can go there. If you are a Chinese citizen, you must have the appropriate stamp in your internal passport to be allowed into the city.

Every Chinese citizen can get anywhere they want to go, including Shanghai, but if you want to settle there for more than 3 months, you must apply a "temporary resident permit" which is sometimes difficult to get.

 

[Shawn Ryu]

Just because I believe the Chinese have a more efficient government than we do does not mean I want to live in China. The American tendency to say "if you don't like it here, leave!" amuses me, always. Since, after all, this society was theoretically based on the idea that all people can have an share their own opinions.

Volkris wants to unleash his libertarian views on us. We aren't a libertarian country. I haven't asked him to leave. Why is Communism any worse than the sheer logical fallacy of libertarianism?

Chinese government isnt efficient, its corrupt.

Believe it or not the Chinese government in my personal experience is very efficient...and corrupt.

Well depends on what area I guess. Chinese government may look efficient because its not a Democracy and few people in charge run the whole country.

But its definitely corrupt.

and honestly democracy doesnt mean inefficiency. Look at Japan and South Korea, full democracy yet they still manage to build and maintain great railroad systems.

 

[tp49]

Just because I believe the Chinese have a more efficient government than we do does not mean I want to live in China. The American tendency to say "if you don't like it here, leave!" amuses me, always. Since, after all, this society was theoretically based on the idea that all people can have an share their own opinions.

Volkris wants to unleash his libertarian views on us. We aren't a libertarian country. I haven't asked him to leave. Why is Communism any worse than the sheer logical fallacy of libertarianism?

Chinese government isnt efficient, its corrupt.

Believe it or not the Chinese government in my personal experience is very efficient...and corrupt.

Well depends on what area I guess. Chinese government may look efficient because its not a Democracy and few people in charge run the whole country.

But its definitely corrupt.

and honestly democracy doesnt mean inefficiency. Look at Japan and South Korea, full democracy yet they still manage to build and maintain great railroad systems.

Then it is hard to understand what you are trying to say. Maybe what you are referring to is governmental priorities of which in China HSR is very high on the list, unlike in the US. In this area the Chinese government is very efficient as it takes them very little time to acquire the land needed for the tracks because the government owns all the land in China and has no problem forcing people and businesses to move on their whim. In the US an eminent domain battle can and usually does take many years to complete and costs a lot of money to litigate.

The speed at which the Chinese can get the HSR lines built may lean more to lax standards or rushing to complete the project without proper checks to ensure the safety of the infrastructure but that leans more towards moving too quickly or to corruption at its worst.

 

[dimsum]

With the Ma regime in Taiwan, relations with China have improved greatly to the point where China Airlines and Eva Airlines and their Chinese counterparts actually are allowed to fly between Taiwan and China. Next month I'm visiting friends in Taipei flying from Hongquiao airport here to Shongshan in Taipei. I too understand the mindsets on both sides of the strait but am at a loss for how to explain it as well.

Interesting. It is also interesting that the flights are going into Sungshan Airport at Taipei, as that is the domestic airport. International flights go to international airport out near Taoyuan.

Though, being in China I need to be careful about how I phrase things but I will say this. Shanghai as a city is very much like New York and very free market capitalist. I'm seriously considering remaining here for awhile.

One major difference: Not just anybody in the country can go there. If you are a Chinese citizen, you must have the appropriate stamp in your internal passport to be allowed into the city.

There's no such thing like“internal passport" and you don't need any special permit to enter another city except for Hong Kong.

 

[George Harris]

Though, being in China I need to be careful about how I phrase things but I will say this. Shanghai as a city is very much like New York and very free market capitalist. I'm seriously considering remaining here for awhile.

One major difference: Not just anybody in the country can go there. If you are a Chinese citizen, you must have the appropriate stamp in your internal passport to be allowed into the city.

There's no such thing likeinternal passport" and you don't need any special permit to enter another city except for Hong Kong.

OK, I will admit that it was 15 years ago, but if there is no internal passport, then what was the little book people were showing the police that came through the train before the last stop in advance of Shenzhen? Particularly interesting since the foreigners, there were 2 of us on the train, were not asked to show anything.

If it is so wonderful, then why do you need to careful how you phrase things?

 

[jis]

One major difference: Not just anybody in the country can go there. If you are a Chinese citizen, you must have the appropriate stamp in your internal passport to be allowed into the city.

There's no such thing like“internal passport" and you don't need any special permit to enter another city except for Hong Kong.

Has the special paperwork needed to get into TAR (Tibet Autonomous Region) been removed now?

 

[AC4400]

Has the special paperwork needed to get into TAR (Tibet Autonomous Region) been removed now?

I haven't heard of a "TAR paperwork", probably for journalists only. Tourism to TAR is now open all year round.

 

[George Harris]

Has the special paperwork needed to get into TAR (Tibet Autonomous Region) been removed now?

I haven't heard of a "TAR paperwork", probably for journalists only. Tourism to TAR is now open all year round.

Is it for wandering around on your own toruism or guided tour tourism only? There is a huge difference. When limited to guided tours what you can see is controlled.

 

[dimsum]

Though, being in China I need to be careful about how I phrase things but I will say this. Shanghai as a city is very much like New York and very free market capitalist. I'm seriously considering remaining here for awhile.

One major difference: Not just anybody in the country can go there. If you are a Chinese citizen, you must have the appropriate stamp in your internal passport to be allowed into the city.

There's no such thing like“internal passport" and you don't need any special permit to enter another city except for Hong Kong.

OK, I will admit that it was 15 years ago, but if there is no internal passport, then what was the little book people were showing the police that came through the train before the last stop in advance of Shenzhen? Particularly interesting since the foreigners, there were 2 of us on the train, were not asked to show anything.

If it is so wonderful, then why do you need to careful how you phrase things?

Shenzhen was a special case I guess for it was designated as a"special area". I don't remember what happened 15 years ago. Anyway, I've never been to Shenzhen.

I am a Chinese citizen(shanghai resident) and I don't have a "internal passport" for travel. And therefore, there's no internal visa except for Hong Kong and Macau. All you have to bring to travel is you photo ID.

However, if a Chinese citizen needs to stay in another city like Shanghai or Beijing for more than 3 months legally, he/she needs a permit for "temporary stay". In real world, many people living in Beijing/Shanghai without local residence don't apply for the permit and no question is asked by police. Why? Because only lower-level workers like construction workers from remote poor villages will be asked to show their permit by the police. If you have a decent job and live in a decent neighborhood, no question will be asked. This is the way law enforcement system in China works.

 

[AC4400]

Is it for wandering around on your own toruism or guided tour tourism only? There is a huge difference. When limited to guided tours what you can see is controlled.

I believe it is for any kinds of tours. My wife's cousin is currently on his way from Chengdu to Lhasa on foot and by carpooling. But I guess, special permit is required if you want to enter military controled zones, namely along China National Highway 219.

 

[tp49]

Has the special paperwork needed to get into TAR (Tibet Autonomous Region) been removed now?

I haven't heard of a "TAR paperwork", probably for journalists only. Tourism to TAR is now open all year round.

I've heard of it. It is required to go anywhere in TAR outside of Lhasa. It's treated like a "visa" to go within TAR outside of Lhasa.

 

[AC4400]

I've heard of it. It is required to go anywhere in TAR outside of Lhasa. It's treated like a "visa" to go within TAR outside of Lhasa.

Interesting. Is it for foreigners only or for anyone including Chinese citizens?

 

[jis]

I've heard of it. It is required to go anywhere in TAR outside of Lhasa. It's treated like a "visa" to go within TAR outside of Lhasa.

Interesting. Is it for foreigners only or for anyone including Chinese citizens?

When I was last aware of such things it was for anyone who was not a Tibetan born native. Which of course actually meant that even the Tibetans had to have different paperwork to establish they were Tibetan.

Foreigners of course require their passport and either a group visa if on a CTS sponsored tour or individual visas with a Tibet endorsement to get to Tibet. A visa to enter China does not allow you to enter Tibet in and of itself. Entering from Nepal you can get a Tibet only visa that does not allow one to enter rest of China.

Of course all this might have changed since then.