Dining Car Ordering Latitude?

[JoelG]

My thanks to all on this forum that share their experience and expertise about all things Amtrak. Over the years I've benefitted mightily from your accumulated knowledge!

Questions about ordering meals:

1) Are item substitutions allowed? For example, for breakfast say I'd like to order French toast, but instead of a side of meat, could I get the fresh fruit that's is offered with the continental breakfast? Or at lunch, instead the fried chicken tenders on the entrée salad, would they be willing to substitute a veggie burger patty so I can get my protein fix? (I'm not a vegetarian, just like to avoid not-so-lean meat.)

2) If you're a single traveler booked into a two-person roomette (as I am on the CS on 4/8), does the dining car staff ever make allowances considering that the traveler's actually paid for two meals? Not that I'd want to double-order, but it would help support the item substitution requests should the server say each meal is packaged separately and can't be broken apart unless I'm willing to pay for the second meal.

I assume the answers will be along the lines that "you're only entitled to one meal, exactly as described on the menu." Any additions or substitutions are simply up to the whims of the SA or LSA, but generally expect a "No." Guess I'm getting overly fussy in my old age, and this is Amtrak, not the Orient Express.

Thanks again, team!

 

[BeckysBarn]

I think as long as it is on the menu, you should be able to order it. Using your example, French toast does not automatically come with a side of meat; as long as fresh fruit is on the menu, you could also order it. As long as you are reasonable, the staff should be accommodating. You say you will be on the Coast Starlight. If you eat in the Parlor Car, the menu selection is much more limited. Just stop by & talk to the attendant. S/he will show you the PPC menu.

 

[dlagrua]

I believe that the official Amtrak policy is one menu item per meal (with the trimmings) is included with a sleeper fare. However, for a meal like breakfast where you might desire a side of something, the waiters will probably accomodate you. The waiters/waitresses rely on tips so they tend to be accomodating. If they accomodate your request just tip them well !

 

[jmbgeg]

I think as long as it is on the menu, you should be able to order it. Using your example, French toast does not automatically come with a side of meat; as long as fresh fruit is on the menu, you could also order it. As long as you are reasonable, the staff should be accommodating. You say you will be on the Coast Starlight. If you eat in the Parlor Car, the menu selection is much more limited. Just stop by & talk to the attendant. S/he will show you the PPC menu.

I agree with Becky.

 

[daveyb99]

1) Are item substitutions allowed? For example, for breakfast say I'd like to order French toast, but instead of a side of meat, could I get the fresh fruit that's is offered with the continental breakfast? Or at lunch, instead the fried chicken tenders on the entrée salad, would they be willing to substitute a veggie burger patty so I can get my protein fix? (I'm not a vegetarian, just like to avoid not-so-lean meat.)

My opinion is MAYBE. Fruit for Meat I think could be done. But mixing salad and what would be a second entree, likely not. Ask anyway, one never knows.

2) If you're a single traveler booked into a two-person roomette (as I am on the CS on 4/8), does the dining car staff ever make allowances considering that the traveler's actually paid for two meals? Not that I'd want to double-order, but it would help support the item substitution requests should the server say each meal is packaged separately and can't be broken apart unless I'm willing to pay for the second meal.

One meal per person, even if you are solo in a room. But ask anyway, on never knows.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

I can't seem to find it right now, but I seem to remember reading a very specific list by Amtrak of what Sleeper passengers are entitled to order in the dining car. In that, I thought it mentioned a breakfast entree and a meat side (bacon or sausage).

I am sure you all will attack me if my memory is faulty. In the mean time, I will continue to look for that list.

 

[jmbgeg]

1) Are item substitutions allowed? For example, for breakfast say I'd like to order French toast, but instead of a side of meat, could I get the fresh fruit that's is offered with the continental breakfast? Or at lunch, instead the fried chicken tenders on the entrée salad, would they be willing to substitute a veggie burger patty so I can get my protein fix? (I'm not a vegetarian, just like to avoid not-so-lean meat.)

My opinion is MAYBE. Fruit for Meat I think could be done. But mixing salad and what would be a second entree, likely not. Ask anyway, one never knows.

2) If you're a single traveler booked into a two-person roomette (as I am on the CS on 4/8), does the dining car staff ever make allowances considering that the traveler's actually paid for two meals? Not that I'd want to double-order, but it would help support the item substitution requests should the server say each meal is packaged separately and can't be broken apart unless I'm willing to pay for the second meal.

One meal per person, even if you are solo in a room. But ask anyway, on never knows.

I concur on the one meal ruling. On a 2009 trip, I paid for a second meal when my order exceded one meal. (at dinner).

 

[had8ley]

It honestly depends on the crew at the time you travel. It's almost like a crap shoot~ sometimes you win and sometimes you come up box cars :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

One meal per person, even if you are solo in a room. But ask anyway, on never knows.

Maybe this is just another way of saying the same thing, but I believe it is one meal per Sleeper ticket stub. I mean, if you are traveling solo, you can't invite a coach passenger to a free meal.

 

[EB_OBS]

Substitutions are generally not able to be accommodated because Amtrak's revenue accounting system in the dining car is archaic. We're still using pencil and paper. Amtrak assigns most entrees with a dollar value equal to the menu price. There are a few menu items though, that the menu price is split up amongst multiple items, for example the continental breakfast. This quirkiness and Amtrak's policy of charging the LSAs and chefs for inventory shortages prevents most substitutions. Anything that has a dollar value assigned to it on the paper work will be a definite no can do, sorry. Keep in mind though, that a second entree revenue item isn't prohibited it just isn't included in the price of the sleeper. You'll have to pay cash for the extra item(s).

So to specifically answer your examples, getting a piece of grapefruit is probably likely depending upon the crew. Substituting any burger patty for the salad topping is a definite no. Meals are included for sleeping car passengers ticketed in a room. Each passenger is entitle to one entree, one side, one revenue beverage, soda or bottled water, one dessert at lunch and/or dinner. This is written policy and is not up to the whims of any of the attendants on-board.

 

[jmbgeg]

One meal per person, even if you are solo in a room. But ask anyway, on never knows.

Maybe this is just another way of saying the same thing, but I believe it is one meal per Sleeper ticket stub. I mean, if you are traveling solo, you can't invite a coach passenger to a free meal.

To try otherwise would be bold.

 

[Guest]

The waiters/waitresses rely on tips so they tend to be accomodating.

They don't rely on tips, they accept them. Amtrak wait staff, just like most Amtrak jobs start around $15 an hour. It is not the peanuts that a regular waiter earns per hour.

 

[Guest]

So to specifically answer your examples, getting a piece of grapefruit is probably likely depending upon the crew. Substituting any burger patty for the salad topping is a definite no. Meals are included for sleeping car passengers ticketed in a room. Each passenger is entitle to one entree, one side, one revenue beverage, soda or bottled water, one dessert at lunch and/or dinner. This is written policy and is not up to the whims of any of the attendants on-board.

I don't know about this. I always order multiple drinks and have never been charged with a sleeper ticket.

 

[EB_OBS]

So to specifically answer your examples, getting a piece of grapefruit is probably likely depending upon the crew. Substituting any burger patty for the salad topping is a definite no. Meals are included for sleeping car passengers ticketed in a room. Each passenger is entitle to one entree, one side, one revenue beverage, soda or bottled water, one dessert at lunch and/or dinner. This is written policy and is not up to the whims of any of the attendants on-board.

I don't know about this. I always order multiple drinks and have never been charged with a sleeper ticket.

You are correct. The written policy goes on to state that sleeping car passengers can have an additional revenue beverage, during the meal period, at no additional charge. There are additional revenue beverage boxes on the meal checks.

Only just a few years ago however, it was one soda or water per meal. Additional soda or water had to be paid for.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

Each passenger is entitle to one entree, one side, one revenue beverage, soda or bottled water, one dessert at lunch and/or dinner. This is written policy and is not up to the whims of any of the attendants on-board.

True. I guess it depends if the fruit is a "side", or a part of the continental breakfast "entree". I don't think one can combine different parts of various entrees, into a unique and personalize entree.

 

[JoelG]

Many thanks, all, for your thoughtful replies!

Bon Appetit!

 

[amtrakwolverine]

One meal per person, even if you are solo in a room. But ask anyway, on never knows.

no you get free breakfast lunch and dinner thats more then 1 meal per day.

 

[pennyk]

I have food sensitivities and, in a restaurant, I always have to substitute, but however, I am rarely able to substitute on the Silvers (the trains on which I routinely travel). There have been times when I was able to substitute, but generally not at breakfast. I think they do not like to "break up" portions of the meal. If they gave someone the fruit from the continental breakfast, at the end of the morning they might not have the fruit to go with the cereal and yogurt for another customer. I have tried to sub yogurt for potatoes, but was not able to do so. However, at dinner, I was able to substitute vegetables for rice or potatoes that was included with an entree.

As was previously stated, I think it depends on the staff in the dining car (and possibly how nice you are)

 

[alanh]

So why is the ordering so regimented? No other restaurants I go to use the "bingo card" for taking orders, and never did even prior to getting computer terminals.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

Antiquated ordering process due to limited space for food storage.

 

[Guest]

So why is the ordering so regimented? No other restaurants I go to use the "bingo card" for taking orders, and never did even prior to getting computer terminals.

agreed, it makes you feel more like you are in a cafeteria than a restaurant. Amtrak apparently doesn't understand how presentation affects perception.

 

[AlanB]

So why is the ordering so regimented? No other restaurants I go to use the "bingo card" for taking orders, and never did even prior to getting computer terminals.

agreed, it makes you feel more like you are in a cafeteria than a restaurant. Amtrak apparently doesn't understand how presentation affects perception.

The process is the way it is to deter employee theft. The LSA has to account for every item stocked on that train and either has to have money, credit card slips, sleeper guest checks, and a remaining stock that totals to what they were given upon depature.

 

[EB_OBS]

So why is the ordering so regimented? No other restaurants I go to use the "bingo card" for taking orders, and never did even prior to getting computer terminals.

agreed, it makes you feel more like you are in a cafeteria than a restaurant. Amtrak apparently doesn't understand how presentation affects perception.

The process is the way it is to deter employee theft. The LSA has to account for every item stocked on that train and either has to have money, credit card slips, sleeper guest checks, and a remaining stock that totals to what they were given upon depature.

In reality the process actually takes honest people and turns them into creative thinkers or outright thieves in order to cover for past, present and future debits Amtrak is going to issue the LSA for some other crew members taking more than their allowed number of sodas or for that six pack of beer that never made it to the train but you got charged for on the paperwork. On top of that Amtrak spends tens of thousands of dollars shipping LSA and chef packets around the country Fed Ex, incurs the cost of staff and facilities and increases the labor cost of Supervisors at crew bases re-auditing audited packets multiple times to hand an LSA a $5 debit.

No other business I've ever worked in or heard of reconciles it's accounting and inventory in this way. It's just not possible for large operations to be perfect, ever. Every business, whether retail or restaurant has accepted that a small but manageable amount of loss, theft, waste, shrinkage, whatever you want to call it, will occur each and every day, week and month. It's built into the P&L statement. In restaurants I've worked in .5% was our projected stat loss. I've seen a coworker, another supervisor who just happens to be a former bar and restaurant owner, conduct a months long study to track overages and shortages on a lounge car service. The study showed undoubtedly that Amtrak was spending an inordinate amount of money to recover minimal amounts of revenue for missing and/or lost product.

Instead Amtrak continues to issue a train say $8,000 worth of stock and they want exactly $8,000 worth of stock, meal checks, credit card receipts, cash and documented waste, to be returned, or else the crew members pay for the difference.

 

[Tony]

No other business I've ever worked in or heard of reconciles it's accounting and inventory in this way. It's just not possible for large operations to be perfect, ever. Every business, whether retail or restaurant has accepted that a small but manageable amount of lost, theft, waste, shrinkage, whatever you want to cal it, will occur each and every day, week and month. It's built into the P&L statement. In restaurants I've worked in .5% was our projected stat loss. I've seen a coworker, another supervisor who just happens to be a former bar and restaurant owner, conduct a months long study to track overages and shortages on a lounge car service. The study showed undoubtedly that Amtrak was spending an inordinate amount of money to recover minimal amounts of revenue for missing and/or lost product.
Instead Amtrak continues to issue a train say $8,000 worth of stock and they want exactly $8,000 worth of stock, meal checks, credit card receipts, cash and documented waste, to be returned, or else the crew members pay for the difference.

How many other businesses have you worked at, where you had to stay and sleep there, after working hours are over? As your colleague who was a former bar owner how many employees of his lived inside the bar, and had 24/7 access to its inventory.

I believe Amtrak has a very unique working model.

And add to that, a government's required Army style of inventory control.

 

[Guest]

No other business I've ever worked in or heard of reconciles it's accounting and inventory in this way. It's just not possible for large operations to be perfect, ever. Every business, whether retail or restaurant has accepted that a small but manageable amount of lost, theft, waste, shrinkage, whatever you want to cal it, will occur each and every day, week and month. It's built into the P&L statement. In restaurants I've worked in .5% was our projected stat loss. I've seen a coworker, another supervisor who just happens to be a former bar and restaurant owner, conduct a months long study to track overages and shortages on a lounge car service. The study showed undoubtedly that Amtrak was spending an inordinate amount of money to recover minimal amounts of revenue for missing and/or lost product.
Instead Amtrak continues to issue a train say $8,000 worth of stock and they want exactly $8,000 worth of stock, meal checks, credit card receipts, cash and documented waste, to be returned, or else the crew members pay for the difference.

How many other businesses have you worked at, where you had to stay and sleep there, after working hours are over? As your colleague who was a former bar owner how many employees of his lived inside the bar, and had 24/7 access to its inventory.

I believe Amtrak has a very unique working model.

And add to that, a government's required Army style of inventory control.

excuses, that is all you have