Exploring America

Advertise with us
shop deals on amazon
Shop deals on ebay
Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum

Help Support Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
battalion51

battalion51

Engineer
Joined
Aug 23, 2002
Messages
7,193
Location
USA
Don't you love how indecisive I am? Well it looks my summer plans have changed yet again. I've been told to be prepared to spend most of June in Phoenix. From there I'm free to do what I want. I'd like to be back in Florida by August, so I have essentially all of July to do as I wish. I'd likely go from Phoenix to Martinez, CA spend a few days with my Aunt & Uncle. From there head east on the Zephyr to Chicago and then catch the LSL to Springfield. Spend a week or two in Springfield. Then head south on Silver Service to Winter Park where I'd pick up my car and drive back to South Florida. Does anyone have any suggestions. I'm looking at doing this in coach (insane I know) due to the sheer cost of doing this cross country. Also, I do have the option of going to an Explore America Fare for about $200 more if anyone sees any inclination for me to ride a bunch of other trains. I'm open at this point.
 
battalion51 said:
I'd likely go from Phoenix to Martinez, CA spend a few days with my Aunt & Uncle.
Click to expand...
I've done the Phoenix to Martinez trip a number of times since I used to live in Martinez and have an aunt/uncle in Phoenix. I assume you'll be taking the Sunset from Winter Park, FL into Maricopa, AZ (Phoenix)? This trip shouldn't be too bad since you'll be getting on the train near the beginning. Just advise your family in Phoenix to expect you the morning after your scheduled evening arrival.

On the trip from Phoenix to Martinez, I would HIGHLY recommend you take the Amtrak Thruway Van from Phoenix to Flagstaff to connect to the WB Southwest Chief to Los Angeles. The 2 1/2 hour thruway ride travels through some of the most changing dynamic scenery in Arizona and I have really enjoyed my rides on this portion of the trip. The Southwest Chief leaves Flagstaff around 9:30pm and it rarely ever late. You should wake up the next morning with an early train arrival in Los Angeles if things go as they usually do. This option would give you the choice to easily connect to the Starlight at Los Angeles to Martinez (getting you into MTZ around 11:00pm, but often late), or the more timely San Joaquins. Since the San Joaquins have additional frequencies you would have a choice of trains and the trip to Martinez on the San Joaquins is about 6 hours faster than if you take the Starlight. The trade off is definitely the lack of scenery if you take the San Joaquins, though.

Whatever you do, I would NOT take the Sunset between Maricopa and Los Angeles if I were you! I have done this, too and it is a MISERABLE trip. The train crews are grouchy by this point and the train is almost always 12-24 hours late. If you are trying to connect to the Starlight you'll be taken off the train at Palm Spings and treated to an unexpected 5 hour ride on an old, ancient bus to catch up to the Starlight or forced to stay overnight at Los Angeles. This is if you're lucky. The crews could also pull you off the Sunset and take you to the San Joaquin (making the trip even worse if you were planning on taking the Starlight up the coast).

Whatever you decide, I just thought it was important you know a little more about how this works. Let us know the routing you decide on.

B)
 
Crew on my train wasn't grouchy by Maricopa, or even into Los Angeles. Everyone I came in contact with was still friendly and professional (despite being 13 hours late and hitting a car on the way).
 
I hadn't thought about going up to Flagstaff, but that does seem like a good suggestion. I would like to squeeze in a Surfliner trip if I can (possibly go up to Santa Barbara and the get on the Starlate there. I would be flying to Phoenix though, it's a long complicated situation, too much speculation as to what the sequence of events will be at this point. There is a northbound Surfliner I could catch at 9:05, but the Chief arrives at 8:20, but with the guaranteed connection program I wouldn't make that connection. I would likely ticket myself as connecting to the Starlight, then if I can catch the Surfliner buy the $15 ticket.
 
I'd book the thruway/Chief to Los Angeles, Surfliner to SBA, and then Starlate SBA to MTZ. If for some rare reason the Chief was too late to connect to the 9:05am NB Surfliner departure from Los Angeles, the conductor on the Starlate would pull your Surfliner LAX-SBA and Starlate SBA-MTZ tickets without a problem.

The thruway service from Phoenix to Flagstaff is a comfortable mini-bus style van with 2-1 seating operated by Open Road Tours (you still purchase tickets through Amtrak). You can board in Phoenix at Sky Harbor Airport (any terminal, go to ground transportation intercity shuttles desk) or in the parking lot adjacent to the city bus station at the Metro Center Shopping.

The station in Flagstaff is quite nice (a real, remodeled, staffed train station in downtown) compared to Maricopa's old ancient train car trash heap of a station 30 miles in the middle of the desert where the Sunset shows up whenever it feeld like, if at all.

Hope this helps in your planning.

P.S.: Make sure you use the website's multi-city trip page to book your Phoenix-Martinez trip as the fare will be quite a bit lower (I'm sure you already knew that, though).

B)
 
JC, the only thing I think though is that the reservations system won't let me book the Surfliner due to the tight connection of 45 minutes. I believe there has to be a 90 minute minimum for it to be a Guaranteed Connection. Like I said, the Surfliner tickets are cheap enough I'd just buy the extra ticket. Just out of curiosity, do the Surfliners to Santa Barbara run in push mode or pull mode? Also, I would probably catch the bus out of Sky Harbor since I will most likely have easy access to it thanks to our hotel location. What's the policy on bags with these buses? I think I'll probably enjoy the Chief more since it'll A: Be on BNSF tracks, B: be on time, C: new train to add to the list of trains I've been on (by the end of the trip the only Long Distance I trains can think of I wouldn't have been on are the Eagle, Crescent, and Builder), and D: I'll get to go over Cajon Pass. Chances are it'll be in the dead of night when we go over it, but still pretty cool none the less.
 
The new Amtrak.com multi-city reservations page WILL let you book the trip as described (Surfliner from LAX to SBA). You can type it in the following way to verify it:

Segment 1: PHA to LAX leaving around 4pm

Segment 2: LAX to SBA leaving around 9am

Segment 3: SBA to MTZ leaving around 12noon

The system will pull up the itinerary and let you book it this way. Print it out after you book it and carry it with your tickets for your reference (and to show it to the conductor on the Starlate if it would make you feel better, even though he/she probably won't care if you have a Sufliner ticket for the first part). Less restrictions when booking with the multi-city trips page is one of the few major advantages I have found with the new website re-design. Like I noted earlier, even though the connection is not technically guaranteed, the system will now allow you to book it this way and the Starlate conductor will gladly take the Surfliner ticket for the first part as long as you have your Starlate ticket for the second leg of your journey SBA-MTZ. Why spend the extra $15 when you don't need to?

I'm glad to hear you're considering the Chief over the Sunset from Phoenix. The thruway vans from Sky Harbor to Flagstaff are strict on luggage for airport travelers (only so passengers don't travel to the airport with more luggage than the airline will allow on board) but your Amtrak ticket will allow you to bring as many bags as are permitted on the train you are connecting to (the Southwest Chief). The thruway drivers didn't seem really picky when I traveled since they had plenty of room (they tow a luggage trailer behind some of the thruway vans and the others have a large compartment for plenty of bags behind all the seats). As long as you don't have ten bags you should be okay.

The Surfliners are a little complicated because Los Angeles is a stub end terminal. A southbound passenger from Santa Barbara to San Diego (traveling through Los Angeles) would travel with the locomotive on one end to Los Angeles, and then on the other end of the train to San Diego. If my memory is right, I believe the Surfliners NORTH of Los Angeles pull TO Los Angeles and push FROM Los Angeles. If this is the case, your train would push from Los Angeles to Santa Barbara. Hopefully this isn't too unnerving for you... I have traveled on the Surfliners north of Los Angeles many times safely. If you are really concerned I would advise sitting in the coach closest to the locomotive (two away, over the cafe since the closest one is business class) if the train is pushing since you'd be further from the front of the train.
 
rmadisonwi said:
Surfliners: Pull from LAX, push to LAX.
At least, that's as of 24 January, anyway.
Click to expand...
Yes, but this is only true between LAX and SAN, right? If so, the opposite would be true for the Surfliners north of Los Angeles since they operate out of Los Angeles (stub end terminal) in the opposite direction.
 
If you should spend a few days in MTZ I would recommend coming up to SAC and checking out the CSRM, it's only about an hour and 15 minute trip. If you do that I'll even show you around. Also you should BART over to SF and ride the MUNI LRV and F Market lines.
 
jccollins said:
rmadisonwi said:
Surfliners:  Pull from LAX, push to LAX.
At least, that's as of 24 January, anyway.
Click to expand...
Yes, but this is only true between LAX and SAN, right? If so, the opposite would be true for the Surfliners north of Los Angeles since they operate out of Los Angeles (stub end terminal) in the opposite direction.
Click to expand...
LAX is a stub-end terminal, so it holds true for either direction. A train pushes to LAX, cab car faces the stub track. No matter which way (north or south) the train goes out of LAX, the engine pulls.
 
rmadisonwi said:
LAX is a stub-end terminal, so it holds true for either direction. A train pushes to LAX, cab car faces the stub track. No matter which way (north or south) the train goes out of LAX, the engine pulls.
Click to expand...
No, if a train pushes into Los Angeles it will and does pull for its next journey out of the station since many Surfliners (four a day in each direction) continue north of Los Angeles. This is a bit difficult to explain, especially if you're not familiar with the area.
 
jccollins said:
rmadisonwi said:
LAX is a stub-end terminal, so it holds true for either direction.  A train pushes to LAX, cab car faces the stub track.  No matter which way (north or south) the train goes out of LAX, the engine pulls.
Click to expand...
No, if a train pushes into Los Angeles it will and does pull for its next journey out of the station since many Surfliners (four a day in each direction) continue north of Los Angeles. This is a bit difficult to explain, especially if you're not familiar with the area.
Click to expand...
That's basically what I said. Push to LAX, pull from LAX.
 
What's on second Alan. :lol:

Thanks for the advice guys. JC the only issue I have with booking it as you have suggested is that the multi-trip system only allows four trip segments, and it takes three for me to do this whole thing on one reservation. I was kind of hoping for the Cab Car to be leading out of LAX, since it affords a great view of the territory, but you can't win 'em all. I do plan on taking some of the Capitols and San Jaquions, but I think I'll be more likely to head down to San Jose and ride CalTrain (maybe even a Baby Bullet).
 
battalion51 said:
JC the only issue I have with booking it as you have suggested is that the multi-trip system only allows four trip segments, and it takes three for me to do this whole thing on one reservation.
Click to expand...
Huh? You lost me there. If the whole thing takes three segments and the multi-city trip page allows four, where are you stuck?

If you are interested in a nice day trip on the San Joaquins from Martinez I would recommend the Yosemite National Park in a day package. You would leave Martinez in the morning (8:23am) on the San Joaquins, transfer to a motorcoach at Merced (nice box lunch provided on motorcoach) for the remainder of the trip to Yosemite. At Yosemite the trip provides a little time to explore on your own and you can opt for an open air tram tour of the valley. Then the motorcoach will take you back to Merced and the San Joaquin back to Martinez, arriving into MTZ at 8:55pm. I've done this a few times and it's a spectacular trip. You can check the exact schedule MTZ-YOS online, but if you want to book the optional open air tram sightseeing tour while at Yosemite, you will need to call 800-USA-RAIL and tell the agent you want to travel MTZ-YSS in a day (the Yosemite sightseer package).
 
jccollins said:
Huh? You lost me there. If the whole thing takes three segments and the multi-city trip page allows four, where are you stuck?
Click to expand...
Don't forget I still have to get to Springfield, MA and Winter Park, FL.
 
The multi - city page will only allow 4 segments per reservation. So you would have to a create separate reservation. What were your plans when in MA? Boston is is a quick ride done the Pike on Peter Pan Bus. From there you can ride the "T" or ride the Downeaster to Portland. From Springfield the Vermonter is a nice ride also.
 
Well, for my two cents worth, let me get this in here.......I truly recommend the Grand Canyon as a tourism site in the event you are tempted to work that into your plans.

It is one of those things you hear about constantly, but for all the publlicity, I do not consider it over-rated one bit......I consider it well worth it.
 
Bill Haithcoat said:
Well, for my two cents worth, let me get this in here.......I truly recommend the Grand Canyon as a tourism site in the event you are tempted to work that into your plans.
It is one of those things you hear about constantly, but for all the publlicity, I do not consider it over-rated one bit......I consider it well worth it.
Click to expand...
Very good point, Bill. The canyon is so close to the Flagstaff station that it would be sad if Battalion passed right by it without stopping! Batt, check out the schedules from FLG to GCN (Grand Canyon National Park) on the Amtrak website for more info.

I took the Grand Canyon Railway train from Williams to the Canyon and then the attached motorcoach canyon rim tour when I was there but was not all that impressed with it. I would recommend the motorcoach from Flagstaff to the canyon. Amtrak will ticket you for either service, but the Flagstaff to G.C. motorcoaches/tours are operated by Open Road Tours (same as the PHA-FLG thruway shuttle).
 
By all means, visit the Grand Canyon if you are that close. It would be completely crazy not to. I flew a Cessna 172 out there and back in August of 1982, I think it was, and will never forget it. Magnificent!! And take lots of memory (or film) for your camera. I must have taken 6 or 8 rolls of film (back before digital cameras) while we were there, which was three or four days, I think. Makes me want to go back again.
 
When I made the trip, probably mid-80's, I took a rail operated bus from Flagstaff to the Canyon and back and spent the day.

But at the Canyon I flew in a small plane, a cessna or something, over the GC and loved that immensley. It was kind pricey as I recall, but, again, well worth it. Long forgotten the cost, but have not forgotten the sights.

I am sure it must be very easy to get info on that on the net these days.
 

Latest posts

Back
Top