ColdRain&Snow
Lead Service Attendant
Nothing new. Nothing insightful. Nothing informative. Cue the yawn.
Last I knew that was the policy at Boston, but I freely admit that information is now about 4 or 5 months old. So it is possible that it has since changed.How do you do that? I've only used the CA and Acela F twice out of BOS, but each time the only pax permitted to board ahead of general boarding were those being escorted by Red Caps. Others, including F pax, were told to wait by the agent at the ribbon barrier....
I also like how you skipped right over the fact that I get priority boarding in Boston whether I use a Redcap or not, since of course that takes the wind right out of your sails.
Part of the reason at this point in time is simply because Boston is inconsistent and constantly changing their policies. So rather than worry about what attendant is guarding the gate and what rules they may or may not choose to enforce, I just go with a Redcap. I also do it because carrying my bags up the stairs to the lounge is a hassle, I'm getting lazy. And I do it now because I know all the guys there and, contrary to the belief of some, I know that I'm not hurting/depriving someone else of Redcap service.But, given that being the case, why then do you use a Red Cap when you have minimal luggage? Believe me, I would not use a Red Cap ever if it were just for handling luggage. My wife and I travel light, and not needing luggage assistance is a huge benefit of that behavior (for convenience, not cost). I don't use bell service at hotels, or curbside luggage service at airports (never check bags anyway). The only place I have ever used a Red Cap was at BOS, and the only reason was to get early boarding and hopefully grab a decent seat in F (of which there are relatively few). The only "luggage" we had was a single, 21" roll-aboard. I certainly do not need help with that.
Bill, I wouldn't argue against this at all. And perhaps after the eTicketing is done, this will be something that Amtrak finally does do. After all, they still have the software available to them and the displays in the Acela cars to indicate occupied seats. I for one loved the short period of time during which I was able to select my seat when booking.I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Acela needs pre-assigned seats. It does not have to be every seat. It could be half the F car, and two of the four BC cars. I'd be willing to pay a service charge for the privilege. When I pay $300+ for travel for two, and purchase that travel weeks in advance, I don't want to have to bribe a baggage handler to get decent seat (and maybe still not get it). With assigned seats, the whole Red Cap bribery deal goes away.
Same here. You still haven't proved a thing! You tell me that my observations are anecdotes, yet somehow your lopsided, one sided story from Seattle is supposed to be fact. I at least have more details about my use of the Redcap than you have for your story. So if mine is but an anecdote, your's doesn't even measure at all on the Richter scale of evidence.Nothing new. Nothing insightful. Nothing informative. Cue the yawn.
You've made the charge, now back it up with real facts and not nonsense about 40 trips in 8 months and lopsided observations in Seattle that prove nothing. Prove that people aren't being helped or stop posting in this topic!
The disconnect is at a very fundamental level. You claim that unless the activity is specifically permitted by Amtrak, it's against "the rules".
My claim is that unless it is expressly forbidden, Red Caps are allowed to serve whomever they please.
Since obviously, Red Caps serve people without bags all the time, the real world seems to agree with Alan and I.
You're entitled to distort these made up rules in your head all you like, but I wouldn't suggest trying to enforce them on anyone around you.
That street goes both ways.Nope, you had it wrong the first time and merely repeating your claim it doesn't substantiate its efficacy.
That's a ridiculous bar that is impossible to achieve.they are acting with 100% certainty every time that they are in no way ever negatively impacting others in need. And if they can't provide this guarantee 100% of the time, then I am saying to put the interests of others ahead of their own self-interests.
Because, once again, I do know for sure that I'm not negatively impacting others in Boston. Not withstanding your refusal to believe me, I'm quite sure that I'm not impacting others when I ask for help in Boston.If it's impossible to know for sure how much you're negatively impacting others, why not just err on the side of putting the needs of others ahead of your own self-interests, some of which are awfully hard to defend such as laziness? It's just not a major sacrifice to make. Not in my book anyway.
So I should never sit on the lower level of a Superliner, because that might harm some theoretical passenger with limited mobility? I should never book the family bedroom because that might inconvenience a possible family that would prefer to book that room? Heck, I shouldn't even book a bedroom because that might push the price up past what some imaginary couple can afford to pay?If it's impossible to know for sure how much you're negatively impacting others, why not just err on the side of putting the needs of others ahead of your own self-interests, some of which are awfully hard to defend such as laziness? It's just not a major sacrifice to make. Not in my book anyway.
Since my wife and I always use LL Seating on the CL as we ride CLE to TOL and return, we have never been asked to move upstairs due to mobility problems of another passenger. Since buying those LL tickets online, there is no way for the computer to gauge whether one is handicapped or unable to climb the stairs.Conductors will move you out of Lower Level if they determine the space is needed for mobility impaired passengers, so I don't think that's an issue. That's fair that your observations have shown that Red Caps are prioritizing correctly. My observations have shown me differently at times, hence my concerns.So I should never sit on the lower level of a Superliner, because that might harm some theoretical passenger with limited mobility? I should never book the family bedroom because that might inconvenience a possible family that would prefer to book that room? Heck, I shouldn't even book a bedroom because that might push the price up past what some imaginary couple can afford to pay?If it's impossible to know for sure how much you're negatively impacting others, why not just err on the side of putting the needs of others ahead of your own self-interests, some of which are awfully hard to defend such as laziness? It's just not a major sacrifice to make. Not in my book anyway.
Your rectitude seems excessively fastidious to me. In my experience redcaps (including those in Boston) are very good at setting priorities, and helping those in order of need.
Here's my beef with this argument: no one is claiming that LL seating is unduly restricting anyone. They sell them online as an advantage if you want well-appointed restrooms within the car or accessible seating for passengers with mobility impairments, along with stating that they provide convenience. They don't restrict you from booking them because anyone may want that convenience. Thus, there's no spirit to break with sitting in the lower level unless, for some reason, you're sitting on the lower level despite not wanting "convenience" or not having a mobility impairment (and, if you don't meet either of those two criteria, I'm guessing you're already choosing to sit in the upper level.)Again, Amtrak provides a service (Red Cap or LL Seating-- and those who use the service must determine whether they are "With The Spirit"
ColdRain&Snow' some people just cant do the long walk,I haven't seen any name-calling going on here. But as one poster pointed out earlier today about whether using help when you don't need it delays or denigrates service levels to those who do, "There is no way to prove in this court of public opinion which is true." I agree that it cannot be ruled out. And that's enough for me to have strong concerns about putting one's self ahead of others here. Insofar as Conductors moving a passenger so someone with mobility problems can take their seat in the LL, my thinking was more along the lines of the obvious. If I'm sitting in the LL with no other seats available and someone with crutches boards, I agree that our conscience should demand that we move out of consideration for that passenger. But if we refuse to do that, a Conductor wouldn't think twice about making it happen. As it should be.
dont know about ny or boston but in chicago the train is a half mile walk to the station so anyone takeing a red cap is justified dont matter if they are able bodied or notIf you're having problems with your legs or they are not serving you at the standard of a normal, healthy, functioning adult, then that would certainly constitute a genuine need in my mind. You do need the help in this case, and you're asking for and getting it. I don't see a problem there.ColdRain&Snow' some people just cant do the long walk,I haven't seen any name-calling going on here. But as one poster pointed out earlier today about whether using help when you don't need it delays or denigrates service levels to those who do, "There is no way to prove in this court of public opinion which is true." I agree that it cannot be ruled out. And that's enough for me to have strong concerns about putting one's self ahead of others here. Insofar as Conductors moving a passenger so someone with mobility problems can take their seat in the LL, my thinking was more along the lines of the obvious. If I'm sitting in the LL with no other seats available and someone with crutches boards, I agree that our conscience should demand that we move out of consideration for that passenger. But if we refuse to do that, a Conductor wouldn't think twice about making it happen. As it should be.
i use red caps in chicago just to avoid the long walk into the station
my legs are not great so the red cap ride into the amtrak station from the train
helps me, i am not gonna walk if i dont have to
Wabbit, don't answer if you don't want to but as a user of red cap service have you ever not gotten the appropriate level of service because of a person, or persons, using a red cap to butt in line? Just curious, again, don't answer unless you want to :hi: If there are other viewers that needed red cap service has this ever happened to you?ColdRain&Snow' some people just cant do the long walk,I haven't seen any name-calling going on here. But as one poster pointed out earlier today about whether using help when you don't need it delays or denigrates service levels to those who do, "There is no way to prove in this court of public opinion which is true." I agree that it cannot be ruled out. And that's enough for me to have strong concerns about putting one's self ahead of others here. Insofar as Conductors moving a passenger so someone with mobility problems can take their seat in the LL, my thinking was more along the lines of the obvious. If I'm sitting in the LL with no other seats available and someone with crutches boards, I agree that our conscience should demand that we move out of consideration for that passenger. But if we refuse to do that, a Conductor wouldn't think twice about making it happen. As it should be.
i use red caps in chicago just to avoid the long walk into the station
my legs are not great so the red cap ride into the amtrak station from the train
helps me, i am not gonna walk if i dont have to
as for the metro lounge the perk of the lounge is u get to pre board that is a perk u get from the lounge
'no there are plenty of red caps in chicago and i we have picked up other seniors who flaged the red cap who stoped to get them alsoWabbit, don't answer if you don't want to but as a user of red cap service have you ever not gotten the appropriate level of service because of a person, or persons, using a red cap to butt in line? Just curious, again, don't answer unless you want to :hi: If there are other viewers that needed red cap service has this ever happened to you?ColdRain&Snow' some people just cant do the long walk,I haven't seen any name-calling going on here. But as one poster pointed out earlier today about whether using help when you don't need it delays or denigrates service levels to those who do, "There is no way to prove in this court of public opinion which is true." I agree that it cannot be ruled out. And that's enough for me to have strong concerns about putting one's self ahead of others here. Insofar as Conductors moving a passenger so someone with mobility problems can take their seat in the LL, my thinking was more along the lines of the obvious. If I'm sitting in the LL with no other seats available and someone with crutches boards, I agree that our conscience should demand that we move out of consideration for that passenger. But if we refuse to do that, a Conductor wouldn't think twice about making it happen. As it should be.
i use red caps in chicago just to avoid the long walk into the station
my legs are not great so the red cap ride into the amtrak station from the train
helps me, i am not gonna walk if i dont have to
as for the metro lounge the perk of the lounge is u get to pre board that is a perk u get from the lounge
Those "small number of people" represent thousands of trips covering hundreds of thousands (probably millions of miles) of Amtrak travel. Heck, in this thread you've talked about how well travelled you are, yet can't produce anything.Not to assert the obvious, but the experiences of a very small number of people from AU
And therein lies the difference between you and I (and the whole reason that I felt compelled to join the conversation). Given that lack of knowledge, you're casting a heck of a lot of judgement on folks here based on nothing but a gut feeling. That ain't cool.Short of omniscience, there's simply no way to truly know the negative impact that this practice may be having on others in need
Given that the potential is virtually non-existant, I'm OK with it.So then the question becomes whether or not your own self-interest should override its potential to negatively impact others who do need the help.
And here is the answer:I have heard that at stations with Red Caps it is possible to ask the Red Cap to take you to the train early even if you do not have anyluggage or otherwise require assistance. Is this correct?
Now, you can certainly quibble with the wording of my question...but as I said I tried to pose it neutrally. It's possible that youDear fairviewroad,
Thank you for your inquiry.
Yes it is possible for a Redcap to take you to the train, Redcaps assist individuals in many ways.
We hope this information will assist you.
Sincerely,
[name redacted]
Amtrak Customer Service
Awesome and thank you for doing that!First, let me start off by saying I have no particular horse in this race. I have never used a Redcap, and I really don't care one whit
how others use them. But somewhere 3 or 4 pages ago, amidst the back and forth on the proper role of Redcaps, I decided to...
you know...ask Amtrak. So I emailed them a question in what I thought was as neutral a tone as possible. Here was my question:
And here is the answer:I have heard that at stations with Red Caps it is possible to ask the Red Cap to take you to the train early even if you do not have anyluggage or otherwise require assistance. Is this correct?
Now, you can certainly quibble with the wording of my question...but as I said I tried to pose it neutrally. It's possible that youDear fairviewroad,
Thank you for your inquiry.
Yes it is possible for a Redcap to take you to the train, Redcaps assist individuals in many ways.
We hope this information will assist you.
Sincerely,
[name redacted]
Amtrak Customer Service
could get a different answer if you asked it differently. But my take is that unambiguously it is within the role of the Red Caps
to take people to the train early even if they do not have luggage or otherwise need assistance. YMMV.
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