LSL Michigan Reroute Rumors & Speculation

[afigg]

So a question that I have forgotten to ask any of my sources:

What happens to Bryan, OH?

One presumes the CL will stop there. Simplifies stopping anyway; the LSL often has to stop twice (or three times in one case I remember) and the CL probably wouldn't.

Bryan OH had 5,608 passengers either boarding or alighting in FY2015. How many of them traveled to & from Erie and the Empire corridor stops? If this indeed becomes a permanent shift of the LSL, trips to NY state become a problem from Bryan. Same goes, of course, for Waterloo, Elkhart. South Bend IN. I suspect most passengers at those stops are heading toward CHI, but there must be some who travel to NY state.

Even if this is more than a rumor, and is a temporary trial shift for October, got to be some who have booked tickets who may find themselves out of luck when/if Amtrak contacts them only days in advance of their trip. Maybe Amtrak will arrange the CL & LSL schedules for transfers in Toledo or Cleveland, but that could be rather tricky, especially westbound.

 

[jis]

Frankly, Elkhart and South bend are no big deal. you'd just go to Niles to get the LSL if needed (assuming it will stop there of course). So unless you are within walking distance of Elkhart station, and you have to drive to the station anyway, it just involves a little longer drive north west. There are very few people that can get to South bend station without driving since it is in the ex-Bendix industrial wasteland, though there appears to be some small amount of gentrification happening around there of late. I am kinda sorta familiar with South Bend/Elkhart since I visit there somewhat often to visit my college friend who is a Professor in Notre Dame. Have also rented car in O'Hare and driven down to south bend and explored the are quite a bit by road. It really is not that bad a drive either from South Bend or Elkhart to Niles.

The real loss will be to Waterloo (Fort Wayne) and Bryan.

 

[kneemeister]

Bryan is only an hours drive to Toledo. Heck, I work in Bryan, and live about halfway between it and Jackson but always use Waterloo going east, and Jackson going west as it gives me more options now, I always like to go east on the LSL and back On the CL.

Bryan is 60 miles up 127 to JXN and Waterloo is a about the same to Battle Creek via I-69 and I-94

Someone needs to start a van service WTI-BYN-TOL for LSL passengers.

 

[PerRock]

From the other forum in which I opened this thread with a link to.

peter

 

[neroden]

So a question that I have forgotten to ask any of my sources:

What happens to Bryan, OH?

One presumes the CL will stop there. Simplifies stopping anyway; the LSL often has to stop twice (or three times in one case I remember) and the CL probably wouldn't.

Bryan OH had 5,608 passengers either boarding or alighting in FY2015. How many of them traveled to & from Erie and the Empire corridor stops?

That's a great question, and sadly, Amtrak has not published that data.
However, we do have some information, thanks to NARP:

76.7% of travellers from Bryan travelled 100-199 miles. In other words, they mostly went to Chicago.

Top city pairs by ridership, 2015

1. Chicago -- 180 miles

2. New York -- 779 miles (4.7% of travellers in this range)

3. Albany -- 638 miles (5.5% of travellers in this range, also includes Schenectady)

4. Syracuse -- 488 miles (4.3% of travellers in this range, also includes Rochester)

5. Toledo -- 54 miles (3.4% of travellers in this range)

6. Buffalo -- 348 miles (2.1% of travellers in this range)

7. Utica -- 542 miles (1.6% of travellers in this range)

8. Schenectady -- 620 miles (5.5% of travellers in this range, also includes Albany)

9. Rochester -- 409 miles (4.3% of travellers in this range, also includes Syracuse)

Looks like we're talking about fewer than 800 passengers per year from Bryan to upstate NY + Erie. I guess one passenger a day has to drive to or from Toledo? I have to drive the same distance from Ithaca to Syracuse, and Ithaca is much bigger than Bryan..

----

Regarding that new schedule:

-- It should not take 1:40 to go from Toledo to Dearborn, and if they plan to do this long term, they will have to fix this. This isn't really viable with this delay.

-- NS and CSX better not delay the train, because the connections to the western trains are quite tight. Now that Amtrakdelays is down permanently, it's impossible to easily find out how often it would have misconnected. Anything over 1 1/2 hours breaks the Texas Eagle connection. The LSL was 3 hours late yesterday, apparently thanks to CSX. Most of the delays lately are in the vicinity of Buffalo.

-- They seem to have squeezed time out of the schedule from Battle Creek to Niles (presumably the upgrades). East of Battle Creek, I guess the upgrades aren't done.

-- Hammond-Whiting, really? I thought the railroads didn't like stopping trains there.

-- It's skipping all the unstaffed stations -- except Hammond-Whiting?!? It seems like an odd choice.

-- The schedule which would be more interesting is the eastbound schedule.

A lot of the problems would be alleviated by upgrading the "Junction Yard Branch" and knocking at least 12 minutes out of Toledo-Dearborn quite cheaply.

 

[TylerP42]

This only shows NY-CHI.. What about CHI-NY?

 

[keelhauled]

This only shows NY-CHI.. What about CHI-NY?

Why don't you ask your SourcesTM?

 

[PerRock]

This only shows NY-CHI.. What about CHI-NY?

Oh good point, I was reading it like a regular Amtrak TT, with the LH side being NYP-CHI and the RH side being CHI-NYP... explains my confusion as to why most stops in MI happened at the same time.

peter

 

[TylerP42]

This only shows NY-CHI.. What about CHI-NY?

Why don't you ask your SourcesTM?

I never specifically ask for information like this because I know at times it can be very sensitive. If they chose to give it to me, so be it.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Yes page two would be much more interesting.

Even more intriguing is the fax is page one of one.

Dare I think it's a fake?

 

[amtrakpass]

It's 3 main tracks by Hammond Whiting now. I don't see an issue with stopping the trains here. The platform is just on track 1 although last year there were temporary platforms on track 2 also but i think they were removed. Interlockings with crossovers immedietely on either side of the station so it should be no problem for the dispatcher anyway. If the general public knew it was there and all the trains stopped there it probably would have fairly decent ridership eventually since it would be easier to drive and leave your car there than get downtown for many folks on that side of the city. But with zero marketing, no agent and a facility that's showing it's age, it'a potential is somewhat limited. There is a road crossing that would be blocked by a long train but it is not a busy street at all and that should be no issue for a couple minutes. Incidently this area if you are unfamiliar is nicer than it looks from the train. Downtown mainstreet Whiting is cool, a nice lakefront park is close by and a Casino is next door to the station.

 

[Ryan]

This only shows NY-CHI.. What about CHI-NY?

Not going to run in that direction. They'll just keep piling up in Chicago until they run out of equipment.

(although if I remember the old joke correctly, aren't the westbound trains all Superliners?)

 

[SarahZ]

(although if I remember the old joke correctly, aren't the westbound trains all Superliners?)

I forgot about that. :-D

 

[TylerP42]

I do not recall saying that.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

I do not recall saying that.

Nobody said you did. They're referring to someone else, possibly before you even joined AU.

 

[Ryan]

Yes, a very old joke, back in the days of guest posting, IIRC...

There was a discussion about what trains had superliners and what trains had view liners, and our intrepid guest insisted on saying "westbound" and "eastbound" instead of western and eastern. When the logic of the situation was pointed out, you would have trains stranded on the coast, much hilarity ensued.

 

[JayPea]

Yes, a very old joke, back in the days of guest posting, IIRC...

There was a discussion about what trains had superliners and what trains had view liners, and our intrepid guest insisted on saying "westbound" and "eastbound" instead of western and eastern. When the logic of the situation was pointed out, you would have trains stranded on the coast, much hilarity ensued.

One of the classics.

 

[Palmetto]

There are some cuckoo booking options in October. For example, I looked up Buffalo to Niles, MI. One option was to take 49 all the way to Chicago, lay over for the day, and come back east on the Bluewater. Meanwhile, a person could've gotten off 49 at Niles early that morning.

Eastbound, the only options presented to go from Niles back to Buffalo is to go west to Chicago, and come back through Niles in the evening. Simply does not make sense.

 

[jis]

Clearly the diversion of 48/49 is not final enough yet for it to have found its way into the reservation system.

 

[Palmetto]

Clearly the diversion of 48/49 is not final enough yet for it to have found its way into the reservation system.

Yes it has. 49 the first option westbound between the two burgs.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Clearly the diversion of 48/49 is not final enough yet for it to have found its way into the reservation system.

Yes it has. 49 the first option westbound between the two burgs.

Translation needed.

 

[Palmetto]

Clearly the diversion of 48/49 is not final enough yet for it to have found its way into the reservation system.

Yes it has. 49 the first option westbound between the two burgs.

Translation needed.

Sorry. Train 49 comes up as the first option for travel between Buffalo and Niles. And a room is sky high if you'd like to go in a sleeping car, I might add.

 

[jis]

Interesting! It has on the full web site but not on the mobile site! I was looking at the mobile site initially.

And the hopelessly screwed up site shows that the LSL arrives at both Toledo and Niles at 5:55am! It still leaves NYP at its current scheduled time and arrives in Chicago at 9:45.

If you call that as having been added, OK!

 

[brianpmcdonnell17]

Clearly the diversion of 48/49 is not final enough yet for it to have found its way into the reservation system.

Yes it has. 49 the first option westbound between the two burgs.

Translation needed.

Sorry. Train 49 comes up as the first option for travel between Buffalo and Niles. And a room is sky high if you'd like to go in a sleeping car, I might add.

I just searched it and all options still show bus from TOL and transfer to Wolverine or are via CHI.

 

[A Voice]

Clearly the diversion of 48/49 is not final enough yet for it to have found its way into the reservation system.

Yes it has. 49 the first option westbound between the two burgs.

Translation needed.

Sorry. Train 49 comes up as the first option for travel between Buffalo and Niles. And a room is sky high if you'd like to go in a sleeping car, I might add.

I just searched it and all options still show bus from TOL and transfer to Wolverine or are via CHI.

I'm seeing the same thing. Number 49 indeed shows as the first option (obviously), but requires a Thruway and Wolverine connection.

What dates show something different? I tried 10-12 and 10-20.