NEC on Standby for a few hours, another PED Killed

Shop deals on ebay
Advertise with us
shop deals on amazon
Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum

Help Support Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Status
Not open for further replies.
rrdude

rrdude

Engineer
Joined
Aug 10, 2009
Messages
3,707
Location
Baltimore/DC Area
Here's the story as of 11:31AM today:

Baltimore County police said a 14-year-old girl was hit and killed by an AMTRAK train while on her way to school Tuesday morning.

It happened at about 9 a.m. near Old Orems Road and Middle River Road.

AMTRAK said its Northeast Regional train No. 181, traveling from New York to Washington, struck and killed a person 11 miles outside the Penn Station.

All trains through the area were halted to allow investigators to check out the scene.

AMTRAK said none of the 123 passengers onboard the train was hurt.

A police spokesman said it's not clear how fast the train was going but said trains tend to move very quickly through that area.
 
If my timetable weren't in a box in preparation for me to move Thursday I'd look it up. However, from what I remember the Maximum Speed Permitted in this area is a decent clip, somewhere in the 110 MPH range IIRC.
 
rrdude said:
Baltimore County police said a 14-year-old girl was hit and killed by an AMTRAK train while on her way to school Tuesday morning.
It happened at about 9 a.m. near Old Orems Road and Middle River Road.
Click to expand...
This article strongly implies that she was walking along the road between her home and her school ... without pointing out that there is no grade crossing here that would have her crossing the railroad tracks while on her way. The only way to get to where she was struck is to leave the road, sidewalk, whatever, and trespass -- I don't know to what extent there are fences that had to be crossed or warning signs that had to be passed in this area, but the key here is that she was not merely "on her way to school" -- she was knowingly breaking laws or else she couldn't have been where she was -- and to say things as this article does is extremely sloppy journalism.
 
Here's a google maps overhead of the area. Not sure exactly where she was crossing.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Middle+River...mp;t=h&z=18

Edit: Can anyone find a school in the area? I'm not seeing one right offhand.

Edit 2: Not much in the way of street view there, but if you look at where Martin Blvd goes under the tracks, there appears to be no fencing in this section.

Edit 3: If you go SE on Orems Road from the intersection, there is fencing there, through. I haven't seen any gaps in that stretch that could be used to gain access to the tracks. I'd say based on the fact that the train was headed south, that Old Orems and Middle River is where the girl and the train ended up, but that she was trying to cross up near Martin's Blvd. Just a wild guess on my part.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Here's Bing's Birds-eye view: http://www.bing.com/maps/?v=2&cp=qjnq6...lvl=1&sty=b

Doesn't matter if there were or were not fences, the parents should have taught her that a thousand ton train moving 110mph is deadly and unpredictable (even with schedules, trains can be delayed). Regardless of GML's "natural selection" opinion, it is nevertheless sad about what happened, sad in multiple ways.
 
I just got to add in here, that if this girl was walking to school, I am sure she has walk this path over a 1,000 times without incident. IMHO, that might have led to a false sense of security on her part.
 
how long before parents demand amtrak slow all trains on the NEC to 5MPH to prevent things like this from happening.
 
OK, found the book, somehow it didn't get packed. Regardless, from CP Bush at 71.6 to the Signal Bridge at 87.7 you've got all 125 MPH operation on Tracks 2 & 3 with the exception of the first curve north of CP Gunpow which is 115 MPH. Track 1 from CP Gunpow to CP Point is rated a 110 MPH.
 
i found what looks like the school. move the map left and keep going till you see a whole bunch of school buses. thats the school.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Does the Northeast Regional train No. 181 ever do 125MPH? Don't know, just asking. However, I thought actual speeds like that were more an Acela thing.
 
All Regional trains are cleared for 125MPH operations when track conditions allow. Most Regionals for example run at 125 MPH pretty much the whole way from Metropark to Trenton.

Acela's top speed south of NY is 135 MPH, and 150 north of NY, again when track conditions allow.
 
Another unfortunate incident due to human stupidity. You know, most people wouldn't even consider crossing a German Autobahn. But crossing a mainline with tracks where much heavier objects move at speeds well in exceess of a hundred miles an hour? That's ok.

I don't mean to sound callous, but her potential offspring's loss is not a bad thing.
 
Green Maned Lion said:
Another unfortunate incident due to human stupidity. You know, most people wouldn't even consider crossing a German Autobahn.
Click to expand...
Of course, there are exceptions ... like this guy...

When the car with Wilkinson (armed robber involved in car chase) hit a curb, a tire blew.
...

That's when Wilkerson and company apparently decided to cross I-95.

He made it across the northbound lanes, but was struck by a 1997 Chevrolet Tahoe in the southbound lanes.

Wilkerson was pronounced dead at the scene.
Click to expand...
 
Ryan said:
Here's a google maps overhead of the area. Not sure exactly where she was crossing.
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Middle+River...mp;t=h&z=18

Edit: Can anyone find a school in the area? I'm not seeing one right offhand.
Click to expand...
There's an elementary school, Martin Blvd. Elem., not too far away. There are a couple of other elementary schools a bit further away. However, given that the victim was 14, it's not likely she was headed there. She would have been in high school or middle school at least.

Kenwood High School appears to be the closest, about a mile or so southwest. Eastern Tech is about a quarter-mile or so west of Kenwood.

Edit 2: Not much in the way of street view there, but if you look at where Martin Blvd goes under the tracks, there appears to be no fencing in this section.
Edit 3: If you go SE on Orems Road from the intersection, there is fencing there, through. I haven't seen any gaps in that stretch that could be used to gain access to the tracks. I'd say based on the fact that the train was headed south, that Old Orems and Middle River is where the girl and the train ended up, but that she was trying to cross up near Martin's Blvd. Just a wild guess on my part.
Click to expand...
It doesn't look to be a highly developed suburban area (no sidewalks along the streets, for example), so it's possible that any fence there might have been along the railroad track was not all that well maintained, meaning that pedestrians could cross in any number of places where they weren't supposed to.
 
for heaven's sake, gml, she was a CHILD. i'm sure you never did a single stupid thing as a child, but some of us did and don't think we particularly deserved to die because of it.

not saying this is the train's fault, but i'd be interested to know what it would have cost to put up a fence that would have been harder to cross -- compared to, say, the wasted societal cost of educating, etc., this child who didn't survive to be part of the tax base (if you need a perfectly misanthropic reason to care).
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Usually I'd scarf a bit at such trespassers too, but this one is tough call for me.

There is a duckunder just west of Martin Blvd., but I seem to recall it has a very bad reputation as being a crime hotspot, so many avoid it and take the chance. Not that one would expect lurkers on a bitter cold morning like today, but there is some cultural baggage in the community to avoid the duckunder.

This section of Baltimore County was built between 1940 and 1960 and is very much an auto oriented suburb, hence the lack of real pedestrian options.
 
sweet tea said:
for heaven's sake, gml, she was a CHILD. i'm sure you never did a single stupid thing as a child, but some of us did and don't think we particularly deserved to die because of it.
Click to expand...
No, no room for any compassion in the GML Social Utopia, only the fittest survive, no room for idiots or people with a limp.
 
When I was in high school, the only way for many walking students to get to campus was to use a makeshift cut across over 3 tracks of the Chicago and Northwestern Northwest line which was busy with commuter traffic and a few freights mixed in. But the railroad realized this was an "essential" even though unmarked walkover and trespassing was never an issue. But on the same hand, constant reminders were given in school and home mailings to "Stop, Look and Listen" and as a result, I never recall any accidents or even close calls. Finally, in my senior year that crossing "closed" when the city finally put a true grade crossing in.

But then again, there was a lot more common sense back in the 70s than there is now!
 
OlympianHiawatha said:
When I was in high school, the only way for many walking students to get to campus was to use a makeshift cut across over 3 tracks of the Chicago and Northwestern Northwest line which was busy with commuter traffic and a few freights mixed in.
Click to expand...
While waiting for trains at Bryn Mawr, I've seen kids cross two mainline tracks, scale a fence, then cross the other two mainline tracks ... while not twenty feet away there's a well-lit pedestrian underpass. I've timed Keystones that come through Bryn Mawr (at speed, it's not a stop for them), and from the time you first see one coming around the bend to the time it passes through the station is under ten seconds. And that's if you're looking for it. From the time you hear it is under five seconds. Generally, these kids are drunk and wearing high heels. They're not moving quickly, they're not paying attention, and they're uncoordinated between the alcohol and the high heels (or bare feet) on ballast, not to mention they spend at least twenty seconds getting up and over the fence. I can't believe nobody's been killed there yet (to my knowledge). And there's a well-lit underpass Right There!

Sigh. When I see this about to happen, I shout "hey, use the underpass for safety!" but have always been ignored. Then I watch for a headlight, but know that if I see one, nothing I could say or do will save their lives because there's no time.
 
Makes me think of my childhood in the 50s when we walked to/from school ON the MKT tracks! It was like 2 miles by road and sidewalk, 1/2 mile by rr! Of course we knew about the trains/schedules etc. since we lived right beside them but still was youthful stupidity so I cant call the kettle black!

In the case of the British, just have to say I believe that their sarcasm is stronger and different than ours, GML can be pretty far out it;s true but heis, as he's said, consistent! I dont know Neil but I'm fairly sure he's not cruel, just realisticlly British! ;)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Have I done stupid things when I was a child - certainly! (I even do stupid things now! :lol: ) Could I have died from them - possibly. Did I deserve to die - no.

Even as a youngster, I learned that I should not play in the streets, walk down the middle of the interstate, stay off airport runways and not cross train tracks except at grade crossings!

Also don't forget the girl's age. She was 14. If it was someone who was (say) 4 or 7 - it could be excused more. I don't know the age in Maryland, but if the driving age is 16 - that means that she could have been on the road in just over a year or two! If someone is old enough to drive, I would assume that they could reason that there may be a reason why these numerous pair of steel rail are where they are! :rolleyes:

And unlike Pudunkville, where you may see 1 train every day or so, this is not the case here. This track has MULTIPLE Amtrak trains EVERY HOUR! So I think that she may have seen trains on this stretch before!
 
the_traveler said:
Have I done stupid things when I was a child - certainly! (I even do stupid things now! :lol: ) Could I have died from them - possibly. Did I deserve to die - no.
Even as a youngster, I learned that I should not play in the streets, walk down the middle of the interstate, stay off airport runways and not cross train tracks except at grade crossings!

Also don't forget the girl's age. She was 14. If it was someone who was (say) 4 or 7 - it could be excused more. I don't know the age in Maryland, but if the driving age is 16 - that means that she could have been on the road in just over a year or two! If someone is old enough to drive, I would assume that they could reason that there may be a reason why these numerous pair of steel rail are where they are! :rolleyes:

And unlike Pudunkville, where you may see 1 train every day or so, this is not the case here. This track has MULTIPLE Amtrak trains EVERY HOUR! So I think that she may have seen trains on this stretch before!
Click to expand...
But the really sad thing is...no matter how many times people are told not to cross live tracks or drive around crossing gates, people just do dumb things! "It won't happen to me."

Sometimes mistakes are very costly, unfortunately.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Latest posts

Back
Top