Second Sleeper Added to the Cardinal in 2 Weeks?

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Philly Amtrak Fan said:
jis said:
Why do you think anyone would want to tick you off? I am sure all the people going to White Sulphur Springs have zero concern about your mental state. :p
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All three of them?
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A few more than that actually. White Sulphur Springs had 5,165 boardings and alightings in FY2014. With 3 day a week service, that works out to 33 passengers a day. Some of them are likely taking the Cardinal to the famed and pricey Greenbrier resort, so, yes, they are not likely to be concerned about your mental state. ;)

If the Cardinal were to ever go daily with somewhat improved trip times between WAS and WSS due to VA funding for ALX to Orange track improvements and upkeep of the Buckingham Branch, WSS would be a good candidate for a more than 2.33x increase in passenger traffic as the train would be an option for trips to Greenbrier on any day of the week.
 
jimhudson said:
Nice trip jis! We're envious.

And this thread makes one realize that not everyone in PHL believes in that

" City of Brotherly Love" Motto.
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In a past life I worked out of an office in Philadephia and made 5-6 trips a year, I learned about the "City of Brotherly Love" motto and as I told one Philadelphian that remember that Cain and Able were brothers!
 
I didn't pay the 1300 dollars (and certainly wouldn't have cash) just 20000 well earned by riding trains (I can't seem to qualify for the credit card) under the new AGR system and my earlier tentative plans were ABQ-CHI (most of which is one of the few LD stretches I haven't ridden) by train and then flying home for $99 probably on the Delta "Shuttle" (curious to see how premium it is). I've done the LSL and CL more times than I can count and assumed the cardinal would be a no go.

I assume yesterday Amtrak simply added a second sleeper to the Cardinal for more of the schedule.

I've only ridden the Cardinal once before in Ocean View (and a coach seat), bringing all my own food. I'm curious to hear the dos/don'ts of the cafe car sleeper menu?
 
I don't remember what I wound up with on the Card, but I do recall it was the worst food I've ever had on Amtrak. Not to say that it was inedible, though. I survived and it was a great trip!
 
It may be Amtrak is selling one sleeper at a time and waits until first sleeper almost sells out before selling 2nd sleeper. So if 2nd sleeper is not sold on same date each way can run just one sleeper and leave other for PM maintenance ?
 
The second sleeper on the Cardinal is scheduled to operate through mid-October to trains 50(20) and 51(18).
 
Yup. That is what I heard from the train crew on the Cardinal this last weekend too. They have been running regularly with two Sleepers. No second guessing about second sleeper added after first sleeper sold out etc.
 
I was in the second Cardinal sleeper 5001 on 9/3-4. There were 5-6 empty roomettes most of the trip. The conductor used one for his "office" between station stops. I got to hear his radio a lot.
 
On a Cardinal trip in May several years ago there was only one sleeper, while our last two trips in August there was always two. I guess that one of the silvers gives up a sleeper for the summer months but if and when new Viewliner II sleepers are delivered, the Cardinal should have two all year. What results from having two sleepers is that the "diner Lite" car is only one half of a cafe car and it seats maybe 30? With two sleepers full, and only one employee acting as waiter/ cook, /busperson things can get very crowded and service slow. The Cardinal also needs a diner but again it falls back on CAF to deliver, which they apparently are not doing and no one seems to know why. .
 
Probably not unless it goes daily. Wouldn't bother me to see Cardinal go daily and end at Washington, and the Penn to pick up through cars to attach to the CL at PGH. I'm sure someone has passenger figures that tell me I'm wrong, but it is ok to hope. If it ended at WAS it could use a SL CCC. Lots of things have to fall in place. If things had gone better we'd have more VL sleepers and bag dorms, and the NS bi-levels would have freed up a bunch of Horizons for conversion to LD coaches. That would have made converting the CL or CONO to single level freeing up SL cars reasonable. Oh well.
 
PVD said:
Probably not unless it goes daily. Wouldn't bother me to see Cardinal go daily and end at Washington, and the Penn to pick up through cars to attach to the CL at PGH. I'm sure someone has passenger figures that tell me I'm wrong, but it is ok to hope. If it ended at WAS it could use a SL CCC. Lots of things have to fall in place. If things had gone better we'd have more VL sleepers and bag dorms, and the NS bi-levels would have freed up a bunch of Horizons for conversion to LD coaches. That would have made converting the CL or CONO to single level freeing up SL cars reasonable. Oh well.
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New York City and Chicago are both big enough markets that I think it's a good idea to have (at least!) two one-seat rides between them on different intermediate routings and schedules.

Of course, both I and a Certain Poster Who Shall Remain Nameless wouldn't mind one bit if one of those one-seat rides was routed via Pittsburgh and Philadelphia....
 
A PENN-CL run blows away the Cardinal on time and price if you are going to Chicago. A daily Cardinal with a full time 2nd sleeper would might help on the pricing, but it will still be slower.
 
PVD said:
A PENN-CL run blows away the Cardinal on time and price if you are going to Chicago. A daily Cardinal with a full time 2nd sleeper would might help on the pricing, but it will still be slower.
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NARP's figures show that only 2.3% of the Cardinal's riders go end to end. That's barely two percent. NYC-CHI ranks as the 9th busiest city pair, and even with the higher fares from greater distance, by revenue it's only 3rd ranked.

So remind me why you, or I, or anybody, should give a hoot if it is slower than the Pennsylvania-Capitol Ltd route?

Thinking of this train as NYC-CHI is wrong thinking. The Cardinal and the Pennsylvanian do not operate in the same market. Both routes could be greatly improved with more equipment and a little more money. But unless we have cannibalistic instincts, adding (and subtracting) thru cars at Pittsburgh will be completely unaffected whether or not the Cardinal goes daily, whether the Hoosier State becomes a second or third frequency CHI-Indy or better CHI-Indy-Cincy, or if tweaking schedules gives better connections with the Crescent.
 
After Washington the Cardinal serves it's own territory. As a 3 day a week train it certainly struggles. I'm not sure the system would not be better off with a daily Cardinal terminating in Washington, and improving the other route. I was responding to the poster who believed that there should be 2 one seat rides NYP to Chicago. The big unknown is what effect this would have on traffic/revenue North of Washington to stops before Chicago on the Cardinal. It helps not just NYP, but everything Philly and North. All the improvements can and should be made on the Cardinal route if circumstances allow, but I'm not convinced it needs to come to NYP
 
There is afternoon traffic on the Card from Charlottesville to NYP. Had an in law who used to take that train from visiting her son's family when he was based at the UVA JAG school for four years. Much more convenient than taking the Crescent or Lynchburger which come through CVS by 9AM (if on time).

So I would object to cutting the Card at DC.
 
In one of my earlier posts in this thread I mentioned that I didn't have passenger figures to use. Without real numbers of traffic between station pairs, it is very hard to make realistic judgments as to whether or not the train should continue Northbound, or if the volume is low enough to suggest a transfer to a NEC train in Washington.
 
When the Cardinal switched from Superliners to single-level equipment and was extended from WAS to NYP, ridership shot up.

There is no good reason to shoot yourself in the foot and truncate the train short of NYP.
 
PVD said:
If the numbers actually are much better including the stops North, so be it. If that is the case, lets make it daily when the equipment becomes available for the added sets.
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"When equipment becomes available for the added sets" IMO that is the whole problems with Amtrak nationally. Ever since the V-1 order was reduced and Heritage equipment was sidelined Amtrak has not been able to catch up. If the rebuilding of damaged Amfleet-1s had not occurred the situation would be much worse now.

On the single level car side only it would appear the Amtrak needs 50 more sleepers and 300 more coaches to meet the 90% demand metric. That is can meet demand 90% of time both LD, SD, and NEC regional.
 
My sister-in-law used to live in Charleston, WV and we'd visit her from Philadelphia. My experience with the Superliner incarnation of the Cardinal was that the eastbound was frequently late enough that the only connection was the (then) Night Owl and occasionally late enough that one had to make an unscheduled overnight in WAS. So I'd agree that having it continue to NYP is a plus.
 

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