Silver Star oddity or new consist? baggage on rear

[wayman]

I had lunch today at Tidewater Grille in Havre de Grace, which has a great view of the NEC bridge over the Susquehanna. During an hour or so lunch, I saw a NB Regional (HHP8), NB Acela, SB Silver Star (AEM7) and NB Regional (HHP8) meeting on the bridge, SB Acela, and SB Regional (HHP8).

View from the restaurant:

(Not actually taken from the restaurant, but the perspective and angle is about the same. You're just a little closer to the bridge when you're in the restaurant.)

Highly recommended for both food and Amtrak trainspotting

But the oddity to me was the SB Silver Star (at 1:31pm): the consist was AEM7, coaches, cafe, diner, two sleepers, baggage. I've never seen a Silver with baggage on the rear. Is this an old change I'd missed, a relatively new change, or a really bizarre one-off?

 

[had8ley]

I had lunch today at Tidewater Grille in Havre de Grace, which has a great view of the NEC bridge over the Susquehanna. During an hour or so lunch, I saw a NB Regional (HHP8), NB Acela, SB Silver Star (AEM7) and NB Regional (HHP8) meeting on the bridge, SB Acela, and SB Regional (HHP8).

View from the restaurant:

(Not actually taken from the restaurant, but the perspective and angle is about the same. You're just a little closer to the bridge when you're in the restaurant.)

Highly recommended for both food and Amtrak trainspotting

But the oddity to me was the SB Silver Star (at 1:31pm): the consist was AEM7, coaches, cafe, diner, two sleepers, baggage. I've never seen a Silver with baggage on the rear. Is this an old change I'd missed, a relatively new change, or a really bizarre one-off?

Sometimes when trains have to be run around before reaching the final terminal (freight derailment ahead, track closed due to weather conditions) the train will stay in tact, just the engines change ends (or run around the train for lack of a wye) thus the bag on the rear. Another reason may be a last minute switch on a bad order and instead of dragging the entire consist they'll just couple up the bag to the rear. it's not all that uncommon!

 

[gdj]

This morning's south bound Silver Star and Silver Meteor both had the baggage car on the rear while going through Georgia. This evening's north bound Silver Meteor again had the baggage car on the rear.

Gary

 

[Green Maned Lion]

I have heard some rumors from within Amtrak that Amtrak is becoming less confident in the Heritage baggage cars ability to hold together. If that rumor is true, it is logical that Amtrak would start placing the baggage cars on the rear so that they don't derail the rest of the train if something goes wrong.

 

[DET63]

Also, by putting the baggage car on the rear, doesn't that reduce the stress on it, as it is pulled but doesn't have to pull anything else? I think I've seen something similar on old freight cars: an order to pull them at the end of the train.

 

[ACVITALE]

Does that mean I should be concerned. I just switched to taking Amtrak over flying and will be on 91/92/97/98 at least once a week indefinately between WPB-RMT in the sleeper cars.

If a derailment were to occur with a Heritage Baggage car wouldnt the rear of the train where the sleepers have been lately catch the brunt over the coach cars up front?

I had just gotten comfortable with sleeping on the train and the more laid back approach without the airline hassles.

With some of the stories of the past this seems a little disconcerting? Should I worry or is this drama?

 

[Crescent ATN & TCL]

The Crescent is also running with baggage on the rear. Wonder if this will happen on the Superliner trains as well?

 

[MattW]

Does that mean I should be concerned. I just switched to taking Amtrak over flying and will be on 91/92/97/98 at least once a week indefinately between WPB-RMT in the sleeper cars.

If a derailment were to occur with a Heritage Baggage car wouldnt the rear of the train where the sleepers have been lately catch the brunt over the coach cars up front?

I had just gotten comfortable with sleeping on the train and the more laid back approach without the airline hassles.

With some of the stories of the past this seems a little disconcerting? Should I worry or is this drama?

Don't worry at all. Remember, you're being pulled in front of the baggage car. If it were to derail, it'd have more force pushing back on it (friction, drag etc.) so rather than be pushed into the sleepers, it'd be yanked off them, the brake line would snap, the air would dump, and the train would come to a stop, but leaving the baggage car behind. So in other words, no need to worry and enjoy your tip!

 

[Amtrak839]

Why are the baggage cars such a concern? What about the heritage diners, they can't be in much better shape? I could understand worries about the 1700 series, considering that they had holes cut in their sides 15 years ago and were never intended to be baggage cars, but I don't see why the baggage cars are any more of a threat than the diners. Until I see them moving the baggage cars to the rear on Superliner trains, I'm just gonna figure the baggage cars are at the rear so the Viewliners don't bounce so much over all of that crappy CSX track.

 

[The Davy Crockett]

Why are the baggage cars such a concern? What about the heritage diners, they can't be in much better shape? I could understand worries about the 1700 series, considering that they had holes cut in their sides 15 years ago and were never intended to be baggage cars, but I don't see why the baggage cars are any more of a threat than the diners. Until I see them moving the baggage cars to the rear on Superliner trains, I'm just gonna figure the baggage cars are at the rear so the Viewliners don't bounce so much over all of that crappy CSX track.

I agree. Nobody has posted anything here, other than speculation, as to why the baggage cars have been moved to the back of the train. The possibility that it was done to help smooth the ride when the viewliners are aft makes a lot of sense, but even that is conjecture. In fact, the only thing we know for sure is that the view from the railfan window has been blocked! :angry:

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

..., I'm just gonna figure the baggage cars are at the rear so the Viewliners don't bounce so much over all of that crappy CSX track.

Amtrak experimented with the Viewliners on the rear before, but they "tail wagged" too much. So, that experiment ended.

Apparently, Amtrak is trying again, but with baggage car at the very end to minimize/eliminate the "tail wag".

From the first experiment, many speculated that the reason Amtrak wanted the Viewliners on the rear, was to distance their higher paying passengers from the sleep-disturbing engine horn.

 

[Trogdor]

The baggage on the rear has to do with the ride quality of the rear Viewliner. When the Viewliners move to the front, so will the baggage car.

The idea that Amtrak is concerned about the cars' ability to hold together is laughable. If the cars were really in that questionable of condition, they would be parked.

 

[dlagrua]

No matter how old the car, it still has to pass federal inspection. If it doesn't it is sent out for repair/refurbishment. Pulling the baggage car at the rear puts the least amount of stress on it. If the trucks have been maintained it should not derail. Derailments are rather scarce so I would not worry.

Two years ago the AutoTrain car carriers were pulled from service because cracks were discovered in the truck frames. The trains were cancelled until the repairs were done. Amtrak is diligent about safety.

On the other point, I too gave up flying completely. I cannot see myself being groped and submitting to the filthy, humiliating and degrading security procedures administered by the TSA thugs to their slaves (the airline passengers). I see videos of the slaves totally sumitting and giving up their 4th amendment rights and I say no way. If they start doing this at the train station, I'll travel 100% in my car.

 

[had8ley]

Sounds like a few SCA's screamed about getting knocked around in the 'death room" on the rear end of the Heritage trains. I've ridden the # 11 car on the Crescent quite often lately and its knocked me down! I can only remember falling down on a train after it derailed in years past.As far as the mechanics of the baggage cars~ all one has to do is look at how unmaintained they are to see that they belong on the hind end. It's a fabulous idea to which I give Amtrak a rare A plus because if there is a stress fracture in a 50 plus year old car's trucks or wheels and it derails it won't take the entire train and pax into the weeds with it!

 

[Green Maned Lion]

The FRA safety guidelines, like most safety guidelines, are a crock of poop. And I am sure our train engineers will concur with me on that one.

Actual cracks on the frames of the almost new trucks on these cars will have them parked. Yes. Metallurgical stress on the part of stainless steel body structures some 60-70 years old can not be detected without the use of ultrasonic machines. Amtrak knows that if they park these cars, they are going to lose a lot of money from Amtrak Express. Moreover, they will lose a considerable amount of ridership.

Jay agrees with me. As a retired railroad engineer, I'd place some value in what he says on the subject. I'd assume he has experienced some of this in the field as it were.

 

[had8ley]

Also, by putting the baggage car on the rear, doesn't that reduce the stress on it, as it is pulled but doesn't have to pull anything else? I think I've seen something similar on old freight cars: an order to pull them at the end of the train.

"BAD ORDER" or damaged freight cars (draw bar missing, no brake rigging and a host of other unfixables not capable of being repaired at outlying points) put these freight cars on the hind end of trains and usually behind the caboose. We don't notice them today because there are few, if any, cabooses running and all we see is a freight car with a red light.

 

[had8ley]

No matter how old the car, it still has to pass federal inspection.

Carmen, Amtrak employess, inspect the cars UNDER Federal guidelines. There are no stationary Federal inspectors at originating stations in this region. They rove from town to town and only once, in almost 40 years, did I have one climb on my engines to inspect them. So...you are dependent on Amtrak to maintain a 50 plus year old piece of equipment and I've seen brake shoes worn to a nub on # 20 coming into Slidell~ less than an hour from its originating station (NOL). The carmen usually beat me to the coffee pot in the Metropolitan Room in NOL....

 

[had8ley]

The baggage on the rear has to do with the ride quality of the rear Viewliner. When the Viewliners move to the front, so will the baggage car.

The idea that Amtrak is concerned about the cars' ability to hold together is laughable. If the cars were really in that questionable of condition, they would be parked.

I don't laugh when it comes to safety....

 

[Trogdor]

Nor does Amtrak. I guess I should have rephrased that as saying the idea that the baggage cars were moved to the rear out of fear of them breaking apart is laughable.

If the cars were in that bad of shape, they would be parked. Period.

The cars were moved to the rear because of ride comfort issues on the tail Viewliner. Period. When the Viewliners return to the front, so will the baggage cars. Meanwhile, Superliner trains continue to operate with the baggage cars at the front, and except for special circumstances (unable to wye the train, or for whatever reason they need they need the baggage in back for a specific trip), they will continue to do so for the foreseeable future.

Chicken-Little proclamations resulting from rumors from some "inside source" that seems to be wrong more often than not doesn't change the reason that the baggage cars were moved to the rear on the single-level trains.

 

[had8ley]

Does that mean I should be concerned. I just switched to taking Amtrak over flying and will be on 91/92/97/98 at least once a week indefinately between WPB-RMT in the sleeper cars.

If a derailment were to occur with a Heritage Baggage car wouldnt the rear of the train where the sleepers have been lately catch the brunt over the coach cars up front?

I had just gotten comfortable with sleeping on the train and the more laid back approach without the airline hassles.

With some of the stories of the past this seems a little disconcerting? Should I worry or is this drama?

Don't worry at all. Remember, you're being pulled in front of the baggage car. If it were to derail, it'd have more force pushing back on it (friction, drag etc.) so rather than be pushed into the sleepers, it'd be yanked off them, the brake line would snap, the air would dump, and the train would come to a stop, but leaving the baggage car behind. So in other words, no need to worry and enjoy your tip!

WOW !!! I don't know where you are getting your information from but any heavy object doesn't stop on a dime especially at 79 mph. I've investigated a freight derailment where the 108th car was AHEAD of the 97th car and 85'7" from the outside rail and this was at 48 mph !

 

[Tony]

... , but leaving the baggage car behind. So in other words, no need to worry and enjoy your tip!

I don't know.....leaving the baggage car behind would mean leaving my luggage behind. If I wanted to loose my luggage, I would fly!

 

[Crescent Mark]

The Crescent yesterday in Atlanta had a baggage car behind the engines and one on the end. Just thought I'd note that. I guess they were transporting one? I hadn't seen this thread so I was curious as to why the baggage car had suddenly shown up on the end when I was seeing the train in Atlanta.

 

[Trogdor]

Extreme danger is coming to the eastern LDs this week, as the baggage car returns to the front (along with the sleepers). Be careful, as those things might break in half and derail the train.

 

[Hanno]

... , but leaving the baggage car behind. So in other words, no need to worry and enjoy your tip!

I don't know.....leaving the baggage car behind would mean leaving my luggage behind. If I wanted to loose my luggage, I would fly!

Speaking of losing your bags, I was very surprised that one of my bags was missing on the Silver Star on a recent trip from DLD to BAL. They found it later in the evening so no harm done but like I said I was really surprised that a bag was lost!

 

[BobWeaver]

My contact within Amtrak told me that the baggage cars have been on the rear of the eastern LD trains for ride quality when the Viewliners are on the rear. However, they are apparently being moved back to the front this week along with the sleepers.