Talgo vs Acela

[ARBKAL]

In your opinion, which is the nicer consist? Talgo or Acela?

Also, will either of these be chosen to replace the aging coaches currently in use? (I am talking in particular those used in the Midwest).

I apologize as these questions may seem elementary. I have been an avid aviation enthusiast for years now, and a strong supporter of Amtrak. However my actual interest in passenger rail has been a fairly recent occurance, so my knowledge of anything in use outside of Michigan (and Europe) is minimal.Thanks for all your insights.

 

[Steve4031]

The Acela train sets run on electricity from overhead cantanary, and thus only operate on the NEC between Washington and Boston. I have not heard of a plan to make a diesel version of this that would operate on any line. IMHO, I like the Acela cars better than the Talgos. They ride better.

The Talgo trains are can be pulled by diesel or electric locomotives, and so far are only used in the Northwest. Wisconsin has entered a deal with Talgo to purchase two trainsets that will be used in the Chicago-Milwaukee-Madison service that is scheduled to start in 2012. IMHO, the Talgos will be a vast improvement over the horizon and Amfleet cars used now. The windows are bigger.

I think Talgo has positioned themselves to be a strong candidate for building additional trains for Illinois and maybe even Michigan. They have a head start with plant already being built in Milwaukee.

A third possibility would be double deck cars like the ones used in California. These cars have done well out and California. I have only ridden them a few times, but I prefer them over horizon and Amfleet cars.

I am sure others will add their opinions. I hope this helps.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

In your opinion, which is the nicer consist? Talgo or Acela?Also, will either of these be chosen to replace the aging coaches currently in use? (I am talking in particular those used in the Midwest).

I apologize as these questions may seem elementary. I have been an avid aviation enthusiast for years now, and a strong supporter of Amtrak. However my actual interest in passenger rail has been a fairly recent occurance, so my knowledge of anything in use outside of Michigan (and Europe) is minimal.Thanks for all your insights.

Last I heard, the plan was to make the midwest trains of the Surfliner-style car. The Viewliner will be the car that replaces the Amfleets. The Acela cars are too heavy to be used when Tier II isn't in effect. Talgos are useful, but only on curvey lines. I think Amtrak would prefer the cheaper to operate Surfliner type. 7

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

Anybody know about the Talgo's performance in winter months? It seems to me that sending one through Mich. in December wouldn't be such a good idea...

 

[Eric S]

Anybody know about the Talgo's performance in winter months? It seems to me that sending one through Mich. in December wouldn't be such a good idea...

I suppose we will find out in a few years when they start running between Chicago and Milwaukee (and Madison).

 

[PerRock]

I believe the Chi-Milw Talgos are a different type of Talgo than the Cascades. Although I haven't seen anything saying which Talgo version WI has bought; Talgo does have a newer build of consist that they are advertising as being FRA compliant.

The Cascades uses Series VI cars; whereas the Series 8 cars (yes they switched out of roman numerals) are their big pusher. There are also Series VII cars which are available; but I doubt WI will be getting those; as well as either of the High Speed Talgo trainsets that Talgo makes.

Seriers8 Consist

peter

Edit: I take back my earlier statement. Talgo says that the Series 8 cars ARE what WI has bought at the bottom of the Series 8 page.

Edit2: Personally being a fan of most of the European stuff; I think these cars (assuming they'll look like they do in the pictures) will be quite nice to ride in.

 

[daveyb99]

TALGO seems more a niche train. Not much of a midwest commuter train.

I bet on the double-deck Calfornia service style Superliners to win - which would be great. My one ride out there was cheery and very pleasant.

 

[VT Hokie]

It's tough to do a fair comparison, when Acela runs at up to 150 mph and the Talgos top out at 79 (in the US). Who's to say how the Talgo would ride at 150? I guess one could go to Spain to find out!

 

[MattW]

I'm frankly pulling for the Bilevel cars. Fixed trainsets don't make sense to me unless you're doing it like France, Germany, Japan just to name a few. You lose operational flexibility the way the current American system is setup.

 

[the_traveler]

It's tough to do a fair comparison, when Acela runs at up to 150 mph and the Talgos top out at 79 (in the US). Who's to say how the Talgo would ride at 150? I guess one could go to Spain to find out!

I believe the Talgos run at 90 MPH! In fact, the speed limit signs out in the NW have 3 lines.

They may say something like

• F(reight) 70
  
• P(assenger) 79 (such as the CS)
  
• T(algo) 90
  

 

[NorthCoastHiawatha]

It's tough to do a fair comparison, when Acela runs at up to 150 mph and the Talgos top out at 79 (in the US). Who's to say how the Talgo would ride at 150? I guess one could go to Spain to find out!

I believe the Talgos run at 90 MPH! In fact, the speed limit signs out in the NW have 3 lines.

They may say something like

• F(reight) 70
  
• P(assenger) 79 (such as the CS)
  
• T(algo) 90
  

It doesn't, the highest ive seen posted is 79

 

[zephyr17]

It's tough to do a fair comparison, when Acela runs at up to 150 mph and the Talgos top out at 79 (in the US). Who's to say how the Talgo would ride at 150? I guess one could go to Spain to find out!

I believe the Talgos run at 90 MPH! In fact, the speed limit signs out in the NW have 3 lines.

They may say something like

• F(reight) 70
  
• P(assenger) 79 (such as the CS)
  
• T(algo) 90
  

There are no lines in the Northwest with ATS or cab-signals which allow the speed restrictions to be raised above 79. The Talgos can go faster on curves due to their passive tilt technology -- that is the main difference. They do have the T speed restriction signs but they are more like this:

F-60

P-70

T-79

On tangent track, the P and T speeds are usually the same. It is only in curvy territory do they differ, with P having a lower speed restriction. Like most passenger trains, the physical top speed is dependent on locomotive gearing, and Talgos are generally pulled/pushed by F59s, which are physically capable of speeds well over 79.

I also don't think the Talgo is a particularly good choice for midwest corridor service. The advantage they hold is higher speeds in curvy territory, which doesn't apply nearly as much in the midwest as it does in the northwest. Also, while they are fine on well maintained track, the ride is truly awful if the track isn't maintained in top shape. Any other Amtrak cars ride better on less than top-notch track. The fixed consist is also detrimental, as noted by MattW. I, too, think bilevels are a better choice for midwest corridor services.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

The Talgos offer a excellent aesthetic upgrade, but only a modest performance increase. Couple that with other drawbacks mentioned above and I would think that there will be very few Starbucks on Rails in CUS.