Wireless Internet on Trains

[transit54]

EDIT: MARC also has Quiet Cars on some runs. Me and the girlfriend were talking. Guy across the aisle, who was reading, said "This is the quiet car." Replied, "Quiet car. Not SILENT car." Glared at each other. Then the guy got up to go use the restroom, slammed and locked the door. "Hey pal, keep the noise down! Quiet Car, remember?"

I'm not sure what MARC's policy is on this, but Amtrak's is as follows:

Quiet Talking Only, Please: Customers must strictly limit conversation and speak only in quiet, subdued tones. If you'd like to carry on an extended conversation, please relocate to another car.

from http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServe...08&ssid=349

Which I agree with. I have no problem with people whispering in the quiet car from time to time, but if people want to do it for the whole trip, go elsewhere. I located to the quiet car for a reason - usually because I'm working something that requires substantial concentration or that I want to sleep. Why locate in a quiet car if you want to talk the whole time? On the other side of things, people shouldn't flip out if you're exchanging a few lines of conversation in "quiet, subdued tones."

On another note, I couldn't find a quiet car on the Acela two Sundays ago. Almost always there's a car with quiet car signs but there was none, I walked the whole length of the train. Interestingly enough, the Vermonter, which is supposed to have one, didn't on either train that weekend. I hope they're not doing away with the ones on the Vermonter - I don't know what I'd do without them!

 

[Green Maned Lion]

I was watching a hilarious scene near the boardwalk recently. A cop had pulled over a woman for some offense, and she was slow to roll down the window, and was jabbering away into her cellphone about personal nonsense. The police officer requested to her to hang up the phone about 5 times, then commanded her to do so, and finally, after being completely ignored, grabbed the cellphone out of her hand, threw it on the ground, and stomped on it several times until it was a bunch of pieces.

I know where he's coming from. Wish I could do that.

 

[Guest_TransAtlantic_*]

One of the Pacific Surfliner sets already has functioning - and free - wi-fi, and the others will be retrofitted for it this fall. The repeater is in Business Class, but is generally available throughout the train.

 

[battalion51]

The quiet car is a nice ammenity, and whoever came up with the concept is genius. However, there is a caveat with the service. Based on ridership and demands on a particular trip, the Conductor does have the authority to suspend Quiet Car service (for example Sold Out trains when seating is needed).

As far as the Cell Phone topic is concerned, I have used my phone many times on the train, and will continue to. I think the biggest thing is the nature of the conversation you're having, and the volume you're using. As long as the person on the other end can hear you, then you're fine. If the person on the other end is using a jackhammer, maybe have the conversation at a later point in time. I dont think texting or using Blackberry internet (god's second best gift to man, behind beer of course) is obtrusive in anyway, as long as you have your ringer on vibrate or silent while you're doing so. The phone plays Bootylicious everytime you get a text, that would be a bit annoying. When it comes to using your phone, use restaurant ettiqute and you're fine IMHO.

 

[WhoozOn1st]

I was watching a hilarious scene near the boardwalk recently. A cop had pulled over a woman for some offense, and she was slow to roll down the window, and was jabbering away into her cellphone about personal nonsense. The police officer requested to her to hang up the phone about 5 times, then commanded her to do so, and finally, after being completely ignored, grabbed the cellphone out of her hand, threw it on the ground, and stomped on it several times until it was a bunch of pieces.
I know where he's coming from. Wish I could do that.

In L.A. the cop woulda just shot her.

 

[battalion51]

I was watching a hilarious scene near the boardwalk recently. A cop had pulled over a woman for some offense, and she was slow to roll down the window, and was jabbering away into her cellphone about personal nonsense. The police officer requested to her to hang up the phone about 5 times, then commanded her to do so, and finally, after being completely ignored, grabbed the cellphone out of her hand, threw it on the ground, and stomped on it several times until it was a bunch of pieces.
I know where he's coming from. Wish I could do that.

In L.A. the cop woulda just shot her.

Don't forget planting a gun to make it look like a suicide. :lol:

 

[JohnExeterNH]

Thanks for the info in this discussion thread. I rode the 7:20 am Exeter NH to Boston North Station trip ("Downeaster") this morning, Aug 20. My laptop found a Secured Amtrak wireless service on board, but no one knew the passphrase. Does anyone know it?

Two days ago I was on the Downeaster from Boston to NH, and there was an Unsecured Amtrak wireless that I connected to. The signal was pretty good, but during the 90-minute trip the connection dropped a few times. Still, better than nothing, and if Amtrak is listening, having wireless available is MUCH APPRECIATED.

If anyone knows the passphrase for the Secured wireless, please reply. Thanks. Not sure why the Unsecured wireless wasn't available on this morning's train.

 

[AlanB]

I'm not sure why you saw an unsecured signal that one time, sounds like something was wrong or you got very lucky, unless they are testing something new and as yet unannounced. But as for the secured one and the passphrase, you won't get that. That secured net is for the onboard credit card system that Amtrak has installed on most of its trains now. It's not intended for internet usage, only for credit card authorizations.

 

[Ryan]

EDIT: MARC also has Quiet Cars on some runs. Me and the girlfriend were talking. Guy across the aisle, who was reading, said "This is the quiet car." Replied, "Quiet car. Not SILENT car." Glared at each other. Then the guy got up to go use the restroom, slammed and locked the door. "Hey pal, keep the noise down! Quiet Car, remember?"

I'm not sure what MARC's policy is on this, but Amtrak's is as follows:

MARC's policy is the same (heck, most of the time the "Quiet Car" signs have Amtrak logos on them).

People are really stiff about the quiet car on the MARC - you're not going to be able to have a loud conversation or talk on your phone for more than about 15 seconds before a passenger gives you the business. I'd never ride in the quiet car with someone I'd plan on conversing with - personally, I think that if the guy across the aisle (or in the next row) can clearly understand what you're saying then it's probably too loud (library voice).

MARC's also planning on starting to intro wireless networking on its trains this year - I've volunteered to be a beta tester for it, so we'll see what comes of it. If nothing else, it'll mean that I can more reliable stream Pandora on my iPhone while I'm on the train.

 

[rogers55]

I took the Surfliner from San Diego to Los Angeles recently. The business class car was full of real estate people.

They were constantly on their cell phones. They were not talking loud and I am sure the calls were very helpful

to there business but they were impossible to ignore.

WiFi would probably divert at least some of the cell phone traffic to e-mail.

It will not be long before WiFi or its successor technology is everywhere so we may as well embrace it.

 

[MattW]

The problem with an external WiFi source is that unless the train has internal boosters and such, the coverage will be pretty spotty. Not only could you be traveling very fast, but the cars are basically rolling faraday cages. The windows don't make them complete faraday cages, but the ideal signal would go more up any ways for the proposed WiMax systems. The antennas don't have to be obtrusive on the cars, just a small rectangle about 15cm on each side of the car called a patch antenna would do.

 

[Konrad]

I was watching a hilarious scene near the boardwalk recently. A cop had pulled over a woman for some offense, and she was slow to roll down the window, and was jabbering away into her cellphone about personal nonsense. The police officer requested to her to hang up the phone about 5 times, then commanded her to do so, and finally, after being completely ignored, grabbed the cellphone out of her hand, threw it on the ground, and stomped on it several times until it was a bunch of pieces.
I know where he's coming from. Wish I could do that.

In L.A. the cop woulda just shot her.

In Australia the fine for using the phone whilst driving is $249 plus a court appearance. Maybe she'd be happier if he just shot her.

It's a proven statistic - driving and cell phones are killers!

 

[HP_Lovecraft]

Thanks for the info in this discussion thread. I rode the 7:20 am Exeter NH to Boston North Station trip ("Downeaster") this morning, Aug 20. My laptop found a Secured Amtrak wireless service on board, but no one knew the passphrase. Does anyone know it?

I've never picked up an unsecured connection, but the passphrase for the secured wireless is written on the wireless router located near the luggage area, or talk to the conductor.

EDIT: I was told by the conductor that the reason the wireless connection is "closed" is that it is free for Amtrak passengers only. Thus, they do not want people using it outside the train. (I assuming he was referring to the terminus points, like Portland, or Boston)

 

[jackal]

Thanks for the info in this discussion thread. I rode the 7:20 am Exeter NH to Boston North Station trip ("Downeaster") this morning, Aug 20. My laptop found a Secured Amtrak wireless service on board, but no one knew the passphrase. Does anyone know it?

I've never picked up an unsecured connection, but the passphrase for the secured wireless is written on the wireless router located near the luggage area, or talk to the conductor.

EDIT: I was told by the conductor that the reason the wireless connection is "closed" is that it is free for Amtrak passengers only. Thus, they do not want people using it outside the train. (I assuming he was referring to the terminus points, like Portland, or Boston)

Anyone know what the technology behind the Downeaster's wireless is? Did Amtrak just get a cellular data card of some sort, slap it in a wireless router (like the Kyocera one that accepts PC cards), and off they go?

I'm curious, because the Capitol Corridor in California has been testing much more complicated (and expensive) systems with like three layers of redundancy (including satellite backup). However, they do want to tie it in to the actual train operation itself, with things like video surveillance and even maybe some sort of connection to the locomotive itself (not really a Positive Train Control system, but maybe starting to go towards that?), so they want a system with a bit more bandwidth and reliabiity than an EVDO or HSPA card. Still, those are a couple hundred bucks plus $60 or so per month, and it seems like Amtrak could install those on all of their corridor trains cheaply for now and then go for the full-blown expensive systems once they're developed...

 

[Tony]

When I rode VIA Rail they charged about $7 for the four hour train trip. It seemed to work decently well.

The way I look at that, $7 per trip, and if I made 30 trips a month, would be $210 a month for internet access. I would not pay $210 or its daily equivalent. I would stare out the window and communicate with hand gestures first.

 

[Tony]

Anyone know what the technology behind the Downeaster's wireless is? Did Amtrak just get a cellular data card of some sort, slap it in a wireless router (like the Kyocera one that accepts PC cards), and off they go?
I'm curious, because the Capitol Corridor in California has been testing much more complicated (and expensive) systems with like three layers of redundancy (including satellite backup). However, they do want to tie it in to the actual train operation itself, with things like video surveillance and even maybe some sort of connection to the locomotive itself (not really a Positive Train Control system, but maybe starting to go towards that?), so they want a system with a bit more bandwidth and reliabiity than an EVDO or HSPA card. Still, those are a couple hundred bucks plus $60 or so per month, and it seems like Amtrak could install those on all of their corridor trains cheaply for now and then go for the full-blown expensive systems once they're developed...

Don't freight trains already use satellite uplinks for their engines? One of those tech school commercials they run here, features a young graduate of theirs who claims he now works on train uplinks (and makes so much money, he has a boat, plane, Porsche, four blonds, etc ).

If not already Amtrak should have a satellite, which could easily accommodate both passenger internet access, but also some digital entertainment (both audio and video).

 

[AlanB]

When I rode VIA Rail they charged about $7 for the four hour train trip. It seemed to work decently well.

The way I look at that, $7 per trip, and if I made 30 trips a month, would be $210 a month for internet access. I would not pay $210 or its daily equivalent. I would stare out the window and communicate with hand gestures first.

If one is making that many trips in a month, or for that matter even 3/4ths that number, one should then buy the monthly access plan for $29.95. For a business person traveling at least 4 times a month it would make sense to buy the monthly plan.

 

[battalion51]

Don't freight trains already use satellite uplinks for their engines? One of those tech school commercials they run here, features a young graduate of theirs who claims he now works on train uplinks (and makes so much money, he has a boat, plane, Porsche, four blonds, etc ).
If not already Amtrak should have a satellite, which could easily accommodate both passenger internet access, but also some digital entertainment (both audio and video).

The amount of data that is currently transmitted between a motor and its mother railroad is fractions of the amount of data that you and I use when viewing even the most basic of websites and e-mail. The idea is for the railroads to be able to receive diagnostic, operating, and location information from the engine, not sit there and watch the in-cab camera like a webcam. Is it possible that the technology could be further developed to create internet access for the train passengers, sure. But that would require a lot of cash which Amtrak currently has very little of.

 

[Walt]

While I would certainly like to see wireless WiFi internet being made available on Amtrak trains, and for that matter some video entertainment like SIRIUS' Nickelodeon, Disney Channel and Cartoon Network, the reality is that we are talking about an organization that can't keep a working coffee maker in each sleeper.

If Amtrak can't keep a coffee maker going, how are the exact same people going to administer a local computer network on a moving train?

Amtrak spending any money at all on this, it a total waste because it is destined to quickly deteriorate and fall into inoperable disrepair. And would just prove yet again, the people running Amtrak on totally incompetent and lack any focus.

 

[HP_Lovecraft]

While I would certainly like to see wireless WiFi internet being made available on Amtrak trains ..... they can't keep a working coffee maker in each sleeper.

I think the only reason wireless has been made availible on the Downeaster is that it has nothing to do with Amtrak. It was setup, paid for, and maintained 100% by NNERPA. (Maine Rail Authority)

It comes down to dollars. Maine really wants to keep the Downeaster, but they also know that funding ends this year. They are desperetly trying every gimmick they can think of to boost ridership. So, I'm sure the cost of the wireless was less then any related increase in riders, but as the budgets were seperate, it still looks like a postive.

Fortunetly, though, I take the Downeaster to work everyday, and find it often -SOLD OUT-. Very good news (except for the fact that a monthly pass does not gaurenntee me a seat....)

 

[Chris J.]

While I would certainly like to see wireless WiFi internet being made available on Amtrak trains ..... they can't keep a working coffee maker in each sleeper.

I think the only reason wireless has been made availible on the Downeaster is that it has nothing to do with Amtrak. It was setup, paid for, and maintained 100% by NNERPA. (Maine Rail Authority)

It comes down to dollars. Maine really wants to keep the Downeaster, but they also know that funding ends this year. They are desperetly trying every gimmick they can think of to boost ridership. So, I'm sure the cost of the wireless was less then any related increase in riders, but as the budgets were seperate, it still looks like a postive.

Fortunetly, though, I take the Downeaster to work everyday, and find it often -SOLD OUT-. Very good news (except for the fact that a monthly pass does not gaurenntee me a seat....)

Does the Downeaser use cellphone or satellite or some combination of both?

 

[HP_Lovecraft]

Does the Downeaser use cellphone or satellite or some combination of both?

I believe the Downeaster uses the same system that the MBTA uses: The Sprint EVDO (Cellular, but a seperate subsystem from Cellphones).

 

[Walt]

What about the Pennsylvanian?

PennDOT gave a company called NRoute a $155,000 grant to provide internet service on Amtrak's Pennsylvanian. NRoute was suppose to install airline like touch screens on the headrests of the onboard seats. NRoute's technology uses geo-positioning and satellite capabilities to distribute high-speed interconnectivity to the train while it is moving. A local caching server on board would hold video content, updated news, weather, sports, and advertising. Large updates to the server would occur when the train is at the station.

Did this ever really happen?

 

[Jersey Jeff]

What about the Pennsylvanian?
PennDOT gave a company called NRoute a $155,000 grant to provide internet service on Amtrak's Pennsylvanian. NRoute was suppose to install airline like touch screens on the headrests of the onboard seats. NRoute's technology uses geo-positioning and satellite capabilities to distribute high-speed interconnectivity to the train while it is moving. A local caching server on board would hold video content, updated news, weather, sports, and advertising. Large updates to the server would occur when the train is at the station.

Did this ever really happen?

This was announced six years ago and I've ridden the Pennsylvanian numerous times since then. No WiFi. :angry:

Click here for the corporate web site of NRoute Communications. Perhaps you can ask them.