Crying Shame the Sunset Doesn't Run East of NOL

[George Harris]

I ended up talking to a federal judge from Texas the day before yesterday (and NO, I was not a 'customer' in her courtroom, ^_^ but enroute to a baseball game and we happened to strike up a conversation) and she said something that I thought was interesting about the Texas governorship, that people who are not from Texas generally don't realize: That the governor is very limited in the power he/she has to actually govern. :lol:

That is true for almost all states.

There are some experiences in life I don't mind missing. Being a customer in a courtroom or a guest of somebody's government is one. Being shot is another.

 

[The Davy Crockett]

...she said something that I thought was interesting about the Texas governorship, that people who are not from Texas generally don't realize: That the governor is very limited in the power he/she has to actually govern. :lol:

That is true for almost all states.

Her point was that the governor of Texas' power is more limited than in other states.

 

[saxman]

Which Rick Perry doesn't like so he just vetos everything.

 

[henryj]

LOL George, I did some quick research on this one and it is recreating the Frisco's KC-Florida special, which did go through Atlanta. It left Memphis at 10:25am, Birmingham at 4:25pm and Atlanta at 10:25pm. Arriving at Jacksonville at 7:30am. West/north bound it left Jacksonville at 9:20pm, Atlanta at 7:30am, Birmingham at 12:05pm and arrived in Memphis at 6:45pm. It's a perfect fit with the CONO's current schedule and connects with the existing Florida trains. You would probably have to run it down to Orlando(three more hours only) and turn it there since Amtrak is so much against doing switching on it's Florida trains. We need you to head up the LD division at Amtrak.

Rode the KC-Florida special by myself just after I got out of high school (1962) took the overnight Sunnyland south to B'ham, wandered around till noon and took the KC Fla north. Had my first meal in a dining car.

It could go through Atlant, but the problem is the excruciatingly slow line between B'ham and Atlanta. A connection to the current CNO schedule, assuming about the same 6.5 hour time on the ex-Frisco, should get it into B'ham about 2:00 or a little earlier, makeing for a good connection to the Crescent. Following the ex South Wind Route would give service to Montgomery AL and should get it into Jacksonville about 3:00am, and give an early morning arrival into Orlando. Likewise, the NB train would be about 4 hours later than the KC-Fla.

Well George, yesterday we appointed you the head of the LD train dept. Today your fired. :wacko: Reason....Atlanta pop = 5million+, Montgomery, Al pop = 375k. Track time B'ham to Atlanta for the Crescent is 4 hours not 6. And finally, no one wants to arrive in Jacksonville at 3 in the mornning. Stick to the old KC - Florida Special schedule. It makes more sense. Also gives Chicago and Atlanta passengers access to each other. One little interesting note on this for Florida fans. If this train ever came about you could now get from Florida to NOL without going through DC and without running the Sunset east or the former Gulf Wind. So the train would serve multiple purposes just like Amtrak likes it.

And if they restored the Eagle connection between Little Rock and Memphis you would have the equivalent of the 'Meridian Speedway' connection to the Crescent, thus DFW could now connect to either Atlanta, Florida or DC and New York without going through Chicago.

 

[henryj]

...she said something that I thought was interesting about the Texas governorship, that people who are not from Texas generally don't realize: That the governor is very limited in the power he/she has to actually govern. :lol:

That is true for almost all states.

Her point was that the governor of Texas' power is more limited than in other states.

That was done for a reason in that early Texans did not trust their government. The lieutenant Governor wields the power over the legislature. The Governor however, has the power of 'line item veto' so that makes the legislature behave. It apparently all works out as we are not broke like a lot of states. It also takes a constitutional amendment to change almost anything. There have been plenty of attempts to change all this but they have all failed totally as has any attempt to impose an income tax.

Rumor has it now that Chris Christi of New Jersey may enter the GOP race for President because the GOP isn't happy with Rick Perry. It's turning in to a 'free for all'. lol.

 

[Ryan]

It apparently all works out as we are not broke like a lot of states.

They're not?

http://www.texastribune.org/texas-taxes/2011-budget-shortfall/

I think that the GOP is realizing that holds true to their values and wants to run is going to have an electability problem.

I don't think that Christie is going to match on all 3 criteria either.

(Graphic taken from here: http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/17/pondering-perrys-electability/ )

 

[henryj]

As I believe I have made clear on here, I don't vote for Communists, socialists or DEMOCRATS. I believe in putting my state and my country before trains. If that is somehow bad for Amtrak then so be it.

Well, if you believe voting that way puts your country and state first, so be it. But it's complete hypocrisy to vote for politicians who make it a point to oppose Amtrak, and then complain about how Amtrak isn't expanding enough.

I dont either Henry, I live in Texas like you! There is no Socialists, Communists or Democrats on the ballot down here, they all are running for sheriff, bean counter in chief and Holy Preacher!(Oh yeah,Me too! is not a Political Platform!! :help: )The others made good points about those currently in office, and now the ultimate Twilight Zone Show has happened, Rick Perry is running for President of the Confederacy, er ,United States . These guys want what Mica and his corporate owners want, Sell off the NEC, subsidize the heck out of it, make sure the "Private" operators dont pay any taxes once it starts making money, and then do away with all those pesky, money losing LD Trains out there in Flyover Country!Say goodbye to the Sunset Ltd. for sure! :angry:

True Story, you could look it up!!

Jim like we have said before, it's a three ring circus isn't it. Perry also hinted that Texas should secede from the Union. lol. I think the Confederacy is alive and well in the back country. Have you ever been to S. Carolina? when they talk about the whawa over there they mean the War of Northern Agression or the War for Southern Independence. They are still fighting for it. :help:

 

[henryj]

It apparently all works out as we are not broke like a lot of states.

They're not?

http://www.texastribune.org/texas-taxes/2011-budget-shortfall/

A budget shortfall doesn't mean you're broke. Texas has a big surplus sitting in the bank. What it means is they have to balance the budget by reducing spending to equal the revenue coming in. They have no choice. But they can tap into the surplus which I think they did to a certain extent. We are hearing now on the news that many school districts are rehiring some of the teachers the let go because the shortfall is not nearly as drastic as they were led to believe. The beat goes on.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

From my perspective Texas' economy doesn't seem to be the result smart conservative planning so much as we're the inadvertent beneficiaries of geologic luck combined with America's inexplicable reliance on a dark and smelly puss buried deep in our state's underbelly. Even in that sense it's not quite the Christian miracle it's cracked up to be. We rank highly in low pay, poor air quality, poor water quality, the uninsured, scholastic ineptitude, and child poverty. Our education system ranks near the top in its reliance on federal aid and our custodians do such a good job teaching our children about their future that we've been known to pay them more than the actual teachers earn. But that doesn't mean we're all cynical and bitter about it. We have a knack for taking a bad situation and turning it around. Like when our our governor had the wonderful opportunity to refuse federal funds intended for unemployed Texans in the middle of the largest economic collapse since the Great Depression. Everyone was so happy that the money would be refused. Well, except for the unemployed I guess. But that didn't deter us one bit. In fact we're still busy finding new ways to make it harder for people at the bottom of the latter to vote so that we won't risk giving them any sort of voice in the future. Now, don't you want to be a part of this "miracle" we've created?

 

[henryj]

From my perspective Texas' economy doesn't seem to be the result smart conservative planning so much as we're the inadvertent beneficiaries of geologic luck combined with America's inexplicable reliance on a dark and smelly puss buried deep in our state's underbelly. Even in that sense it's not quite the Christian miracle it's cracked up to be. We rank highly in low pay, poor air quality, poor water quality, the uninsured, scholastic ineptitude, and child poverty. Our education system ranks near the top in its reliance on federal aid and our custodians do such a good job teaching our children about their future that we've been known to pay them more than the actual teachers earn. But that doesn't mean we're all cynical and bitter about it. We have a knack for taking a bad situation and turning it around. Like when our our governor had the wonderful opportunity to refuse federal funds intended for unemployed Texans in the middle of the largest economic collapse since the Great Depression. Everyone was so happy that the money would be refused. Well, except for the unemployed I guess. But that didn't deter us one bit. In fact we're still busy finding new ways to make it harder for people at the bottom of the latter to vote so that we won't risk giving them any sort of voice in the future. Now, don't you want to be a part of this "miracle" we've created?

I kind of like Texas personally and don't buy into this totally negative view presented here. I just want everyone to know that his is a totally minority view. Most Texans are very happy with their state, their government and their economy. We just don't have many trains. <_< But it is hot and dry here right now.

 

[Big Iron]

Try electing some pro-rail politicians and see what happens.

As I believe I have made clear on here, I don't vote for Communists, socialists or DEMOCRATS. I believe in putting my state and my country before trains. If that is somehow bad for Amtrak then so be it.

Seeing as I've never seen 2 out of the 3 ever run for office, that's not too hard. If that's how you feel, then quit whining when the politicians that you elect don't give you what you want.

Just because you have never seen communists and socialists run for office doesn't mean they haven't

2010 Election:

Socialist Party Candidates

Todd Vachon US Senate (CT)

Marc Luzietti for US Congress (20th District, FL)

Dan La Botz for US Senate (OH)

Nicholas Nix for US Congress (4th District, TX)

Jane Newton for US Congress (VT)

Greg Pason for Governor and Tino Rozzo for Lieutenant Governor (NJ)

 

[George Harris]

LOL George, I did some quick research on this one and it is recreating the Frisco's KC-Florida special, which did go through Atlanta. It left Memphis at 10:25am, Birmingham at 4:25pm and Atlanta at 10:25pm. Arriving at Jacksonville at 7:30am. West/north bound it left Jacksonville at 9:20pm, Atlanta at 7:30am, Birmingham at 12:05pm and arrived in Memphis at 6:45pm. It's a perfect fit with the CONO's current schedule and connects with the existing Florida trains. You would probably have to run it down to Orlando(three more hours only) and turn it there since Amtrak is so much against doing switching on it's Florida trains. We need you to head up the LD division at Amtrak.

Rode the KC-Florida special by myself just after I got out of high school (1962) took the overnight Sunnyland south to B'ham, wandered around till noon and took the KC Fla north. Had my first meal in a dining car.

It could go through Atlant, but the problem is the excruciatingly slow line between B'ham and Atlanta. A connection to the current CNO schedule, assuming about the same 6.5 hour time on the ex-Frisco, should get it into B'ham about 2:00 or a little earlier, makeing for a good connection to the Crescent. Following the ex South Wind Route would give service to Montgomery AL and should get it into Jacksonville about 3:00am, and give an early morning arrival into Orlando. Likewise, the NB train would be about 4 hours later than the KC-Fla.

Well George, yesterday we appointed you the head of the LD train dept. Today your fired. :wacko: Reason....Atlanta pop = 5million+, Montgomery, Al pop = 375k. Track time B'ham to Atlanta for the Crescent is 4 hours not 6. And finally, no one wants to arrive in Jacksonville at 3 in the mornning. Stick to the old KC - Florida Special schedule. It makes more sense. Also gives Chicago and Atlanta passengers access to each other. One little interesting note on this for Florida fans. If this train ever came about you could now get from Florida to NOL without going through DC and without running the Sunset east or the former Gulf Wind. So the train would serve multiple purposes just like Amtrak likes it.

And if they restored the Eagle connection between Little Rock and Memphis you would have the equivalent of the 'Meridian Speedway' connection to the Crescent, thus DFW could now connect to either Atlanta, Florida or DC and New York without going through Chicago.

I think you missed what I said. The 6.5 hours was the Birmingam - Memphis time of the KC-Fla Spec. I know the B'ham-Atlanta time is for the Crescent is 4 hours. In the 50's & 60's the KC-Fla Special time B'ham-Atl was aroud 4.5 to 5 hours. The access to Atlanta from Memphis was via the Crescent out of B'ham. It was not left out. The southbound KC-Fla Special Memphis-B'han schedule was around 5h45m, but that was near impossible to achieve. That I know first hand.

 

[The Journalist]

It apparently all works out as we are not broke like a lot of states.

:venn diagram:

Venn diagrams are fun! Though it would seem that the reason Pawlenty dropped out was because he wasn't electable? And wouldn't make it though the primaries due to not being conservative enough?

Funny to see Trump outside of all of them. I'm pretty sure his "candidacy" was him milking the election for free publicity, which he did brilliantly.

Wow, this has gone off topic. Uhh, how about that Sunset?

 

[Donctor]

Uhh, how about that Sunset?

Crying shame, eh?

 

[jis]

The crying shame is that people expend all their energy venting here, and apparently too few have any energy left to vent on those that might make a difference, namely the Congress-critters.

The success of the Eagle is attributed to a grassroots movement - TEMPO. How about all those that can run up a thread half a dozen pages long here every month on this subject get together and form a grassroots organization to promote the Louisiana - Florida service and work diligently at it for a year or two. You never know, one might even succeed! But one thing is for sure, just venting here will not cause anything to change.

 

[Ryan]

Now, don't you want to be a part of this "miracle" we've created?

Absolutely not. In fact, if Gov Perry wants out, I'd be inclined to let TX go.

Jis, I think the missing piece is the "how to get started". I'd gladly work towards such a goal.

 

[jis]

Jis, I think the missing piece is the "how to get started". I'd gladly work towards such a goal.

The leadership has to come from the local area. What one can do from afar is to possibly go there spend a few weeks and try to get the ball rolling provided one can find a few sufficiently motivated individuals locally. Otherwise it just won't work.

Then it just boils down to what I said earlier in the thread. If there is zero local political will and support it won't happen given the current political climate.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

LOL George, I did some quick research on this one and it is recreating the Frisco's KC-Florida special, which did go through Atlanta. It left Memphis at 10:25am, Birmingham at 4:25pm and Atlanta at 10:25pm. Arriving at Jacksonville at 7:30am. West/north bound it left Jacksonville at 9:20pm, Atlanta at 7:30am, Birmingham at 12:05pm and arrived in Memphis at 6:45pm. It's a perfect fit with the CONO's current schedule and connects with the existing Florida trains. You would probably have to run it down to Orlando(three more hours only) and turn it there since Amtrak is so much against doing switching on it's Florida trains. We need you to head up the LD division at Amtrak.

Rode the KC-Florida special by myself just after I got out of high school (1962) took the overnight Sunnyland south to B'ham, wandered around till noon and took the KC Fla north. Had my first meal in a dining car.

It could go through Atlant, but the problem is the excruciatingly slow line between B'ham and Atlanta. A connection to the current CNO schedule, assuming about the same 6.5 hour time on the ex-Frisco, should get it into B'ham about 2:00 or a little earlier, makeing for a good connection to the Crescent. Following the ex South Wind Route would give service to Montgomery AL and should get it into Jacksonville about 3:00am, and give an early morning arrival into Orlando. Likewise, the NB train would be about 4 hours later than the KC-Fla.

Well George, yesterday we appointed you the head of the LD train dept. Today your fired. :wacko: Reason....Atlanta pop = 5million+, Montgomery, Al pop = 375k. Track time B'ham to Atlanta for the Crescent is 4 hours not 6. And finally, no one wants to arrive in Jacksonville at 3 in the mornning. Stick to the old KC - Florida Special schedule. It makes more sense. Also gives Chicago and Atlanta passengers access to each other. One little interesting note on this for Florida fans. If this train ever came about you could now get from Florida to NOL without going through DC and without running the Sunset east or the former Gulf Wind. So the train would serve multiple purposes just like Amtrak likes it.

And if they restored the Eagle connection between Little Rock and Memphis you would have the equivalent of the 'Meridian Speedway' connection to the Crescent, thus DFW could now connect to either Atlanta, Florida or DC and New York without going through Chicago.

I think you missed what I said. The 6.5 hours was the Birmingam - Memphis time of the KC-Fla Spec. I know the B'ham-Atlanta time is for the Crescent is 4 hours. In the 50's & 60's the KC-Fla Special time B'ham-Atl was aroud 4.5 to 5 hours. The access to Atlanta from Memphis was via the Crescent out of B'ham. It was not left out. The southbound KC-Fla Special Memphis-B'han schedule was around 5h45m, but that was near impossible to achieve. That I know first hand.

Yes,to George. To elaborate, the KC Florida Special made two firm stops between BHM and ATL,that was Anniston and Bremen. And there were seven flag stops. Another train on that route, the Sunnyland, made similar stops. And there was an over night coach only local which made about 22 stops, most of them flag. The train we know today as the Crescent, was, keeping it simple,---the train then known as the Southerner----making just the one stop in Anniston.

Not to be left out, the Seaboard had a different route from BHM to ATL. It had three trains a day, the most well known being the Silver Comet. There is a "trail" named for that today.

Every time I stop at Anniston on the Crescent these days I am reminded that at one time one could reach Kansas City and Miami(in pullman, winter season)straight through from there as well as New York and New Orleans.

 

[Big Iron]

Jis, I think the missing piece is the "how to get started". I'd gladly work towards such a goal.

The leadership has to come from the local area. What one can do from afar is to possibly go there spend a few weeks and try to get the ball rolling provided one can find a few sufficiently motivated individuals locally. Otherwise it just won't work.

Then it just boils down to what I said earlier in the thread. If there is zero local political will and support it won't happen given the current political climate.

Jis is correct, start locally. A good place to start is with regional economic development groups. These entities work to attract new business, create jobs, and sustain exisitng businesses. If these groups nationwide work in a similar fashion as in Virginia, the ones I'm familiar with have a direct line to the Governor, Congressmen and Senators. Local/State Legislators as well. A position paper of support from them to their cluster of State/Local Legislators can carry some weight as these groups help create jobs and bring in new businesses to increase the tax base. Frequent and multiple forms of transportation are important factors companies consider when deciding where to locate.

These economic development groups also tend to be apolitical. Both major parties support their efforts as it increases economic activity and creates new tax revenue. Said another way, both sides of the aisle respect their efforts and are willing to listen.

I'm not aware how other States are set up, again in VA, there are regional planning districts that are mainly Govt funded. One of their functions is to develop and promote regional transportation plans. One effort that I'm aware of is support of an Amtrak line from Richmond, through Petersburg, down to Norfolk on the existing NS line.

 

[had8ley]

LOL George, I did some quick research on this one and it is recreating the Frisco's KC-Florida special, which did go through Atlanta. It left Memphis at 10:25am, Birmingham at 4:25pm and Atlanta at 10:25pm. Arriving at Jacksonville at 7:30am. West/north bound it left Jacksonville at 9:20pm, Atlanta at 7:30am, Birmingham at 12:05pm and arrived in Memphis at 6:45pm. It's a perfect fit with the CONO's current schedule and connects with the existing Florida trains. You would probably have to run it down to Orlando(three more hours only) and turn it there since Amtrak is so much against doing switching on it's Florida trains. We need you to head up the LD division at Amtrak.

Rode the KC-Florida special by myself just after I got out of high school (1962) took the overnight Sunnyland south to B'ham, wandered around till noon and took the KC Fla north. Had my first meal in a dining car.

It could go through Atlant, but the problem is the excruciatingly slow line between B'ham and Atlanta. A connection to the current CNO schedule, assuming about the same 6.5 hour time on the ex-Frisco, should get it into B'ham about 2:00 or a little earlier, makeing for a good connection to the Crescent. Following the ex South Wind Route would give service to Montgomery AL and should get it into Jacksonville about 3:00am, and give an early morning arrival into Orlando. Likewise, the NB train would be about 4 hours later than the KC-Fla.

Well George, yesterday we appointed you the head of the LD train dept. Today your fired. :wacko: Reason....Atlanta pop = 5million+, Montgomery, Al pop = 375k. Track time B'ham to Atlanta for the Crescent is 4 hours not 6. And finally, no one wants to arrive in Jacksonville at 3 in the mornning. Stick to the old KC - Florida Special schedule. It makes more sense. Also gives Chicago and Atlanta passengers access to each other. One little interesting note on this for Florida fans. If this train ever came about you could now get from Florida to NOL without going through DC and without running the Sunset east or the former Gulf Wind. So the train would serve multiple purposes just like Amtrak likes it.

And if they restored the Eagle connection between Little Rock and Memphis you would have the equivalent of the 'Meridian Speedway' connection to the Crescent, thus DFW could now connect to either Atlanta, Florida or DC and New York without going through Chicago.

I think you missed what I said. The 6.5 hours was the Birmingam - Memphis time of the KC-Fla Spec. I know the B'ham-Atlanta time is for the Crescent is 4 hours. In the 50's & 60's the KC-Fla Special time B'ham-Atl was aroud 4.5 to 5 hours. The access to Atlanta from Memphis was via the Crescent out of B'ham. It was not left out. The southbound KC-Fla Special Memphis-B'han schedule was around 5h45m, but that was near impossible to achieve. That I know first hand.

Yes,to George. To elaborate, the KC Florida Special made two firm stops between BHM and ATL,that was Anniston and Bremen. And there were seven flag stops. Another train on that route, the Sunnyland, made similar stops. And there was an over night coach only local which made about 22 stops, most of them flag. The train we know today as the Crescent, was, keeping it simple,---the train then known as the Southerner----making just the one stop in Anniston.

Not to be left out, the Seaboard had a different route from BHM to ATL. It had three trains a day, the most well known being the Silver Comet. There is a "trail" named for that today.

Every time I stop at Anniston on the Crescent these days I am reminded that at one time one could reach Kansas City and Miami(in pullman, winter season)straight through from there as well as New York and New Orleans.

The track onm the north side of the Anniston depot appears to be what was the main line to KC...how far does it run now and is it used often ?

 

[George Harris]

the KC Florida Special made two firm stops between BHM and ATL,that was Anniston and Bremen. And there were seven flag stops. Another train on that route, the Sunnyland, made similar stops. And there was an over night coach only local which made about 22 stops, most of them flag. The train we know today as the Crescent, was, keeping it simple,---the train then known as the Southerner----making just the one stop in Anniston.
Not to be left out, the Seaboard had a different route from BHM to ATL. It had three trains a day, the most well known being the Silver Comet. There is a "trail" named for that today.

Every time I stop at Anniston on the Crescent these days I am reminded that at one time one could reach Kansas City and Miami(in pullman, winter season)straight through from there as well as New York and New Orleans.

The track onm the north side of the Anniston depot appears to be what was the main line to KC...how far does it run now and is it used often ?

The track on the nroth (actually compass east) side of the Anniston depot was the Southern Railway branch to Piedmont AL. I think that at one time it went beyond there all the way to Rome GA. In the other direction this line went to Talladega - Childrsburg - Calera and on ot meet the Southern's B'ham to Mobile line. The part south of Anniston is still in operation. The line to Piedmont appears to be gone.

In teh past teh L&N also had a line through Anniston and its own station. Their line came in from Claera through Sylacauga adn Talladega. it went north out of Talladega and paralleled the Southern line west of Anniston for its last few miles into town. It turned north to go to Gadsden adn did not go past the Southern station. All this line is now gone. It appears that Talladega to Sylacauga is still in place as a short line and from Wellington (junction with the former Seaboard) to Gadsden is, along with the SAL west of that point, still in place as another short line.

 

[TWA904]

It is my understanding that the SL could run from LA to Orlando with no additional equipment.

But could it run 4 days LA to Orlando with no additional equipment.

 

[henryj]

It is my understanding that the SL could run from LA to Orlando with no additional equipment.

But could it run 4 days LA to Orlando with no additional equipment.

NO.

 

[VentureForth]

I just want to know if someone figured out why the Station in Houston points to Kansas City.

 

[cirdan]

The crying shame is that people expend all their energy venting here, and apparently too few have any energy left to vent on those that might make a difference, namely the Congress-critters.

The success of the Eagle is attributed to a grassroots movement - TEMPO. How about all those that can run up a thread half a dozen pages long here every month on this subject get together and form a grassroots organization to promote the Louisiana - Florida service and work diligently at it for a year or two. You never know, one might even succeed! But one thing is for sure, just venting here will not cause anything to change.

Too true. Things change because people demand they change, and demand it visibly and demand it from the right people.

Things don't happen because of some invisible process that is beyond anybody's control. Or if it does it's only because people let it happen.