Additional Wolverine Thanksgiving Service

[Eric S]

Just noticed that Amtrak has posted a notice that additional trains will be operated on the Wolverine corridor over the Thanksgiving weekend. Here is the announcement: http://www.amtrak.com/ccurl/279/931/Amtrak-Chicago-Thanksgiving-ATK-12-094a.pdf

There is an early morning KAL-CHI train, a morning CHI-ARB train, a late afternoon ARB-CHI train, and a late night CHI-KAL train. The additional trains operate Wed, Thu, Fri, Sat, Sun, Mon, with all trains on Fri, Sat, Sun, and only some of them on Wed, Thu, Mon. Looking at the schedule, it appears that Amtrak may be cobbling together one additional trainset to operate the additional services.

I believe Amtrak operated some additional trains (I want to say early morning KAL-CHI and late night CHI-KAL) over a holiday weekend (Memorial Day or Labor Day) a year or two ago.

 

[lepearso]

The early morning train from Kalamazoo to Chicago and that the late night return trip were recently discussed as being a permanent, year round addition to Amtrak's Michigan services. Funding would be a big issue and freight congestion between Porter and Chicago would be another. The market is certainly there.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

The early morning train from Kalamazoo to Chicago and that the late night return trip were recently discussed as being a permanent, year round addition to Amtrak's Michigan services. Funding would be a big issue and freight congestion between Porter and Chicago would be another. The market is certainly there.

Market would be there for a 1:30am arrival in Kalamazoo? I can see the morning train, and I could see the late night train with a departure two hours earlier, for an 11;30 Kalamazoo arrival, but when the train is travelling such a short distance, I would think that it should be more convenient. If it is going to be that light, it might as well depart Chicago at midnight to have an early morning Detroit arrival.

 

[Anderson]

The early morning train from Kalamazoo to Chicago and that the late night return trip were recently discussed as being a permanent, year round addition to Amtrak's Michigan services. Funding would be a big issue and freight congestion between Porter and Chicago would be another. The market is certainly there.

Market would be there for a 1:30am arrival in Kalamazoo? I can see the morning train, and I could see the late night train with a departure two hours earlier, for an 11;30 Kalamazoo arrival, but when the train is travelling such a short distance, I would think that it should be more convenient. If it is going to be that light, it might as well depart Chicago at midnight to have an early morning Detroit arrival.

Well, this might be a case of "When can we get the slot for a few days?" whereas a longer-term operation would be more worked-out. It's sort of like the "Midnight Express" that Amtrak has run on the Cascades the last few years (a train that I'd like to experience at some point, I would note).

 

[Eric S]

I would agree that a permanent addition of an early morning westbound run and a late evening eastbound run would be a great addition to the Wolverine corridor service. The time change somewhat complicates the schedule, making it easier to construct a palatable westbound morning run, but making it more difficult to craft the eastbound evening train. Something like 2 hours earlier does seem to make more sense if this ever became a permanent addition.

Likewise, a similar morning northbound and evening southbound run (perhaps to/from BNL or SPI) would be a useful addition to the Lincoln corridor as well, at least until the service can be ramped up with additional full CHI-STL roundtrips. And, somewhat selfishly, I've often wished there were an earlier southbound and later northbound Hiawatha as well, to permit connections to/from more trains at CHI.

 

[SarahZ]

Just noticed that Amtrak has posted a notice that additional trains will be operated on the Wolverine corridor over the Thanksgiving weekend. Here is the announcement: http://www.amtrak.co...ATK-12-094a.pdf

There is an early morning KAL-CHI train, a morning CHI-ARB train, a late afternoon ARB-CHI train, and a late night CHI-KAL train. The additional trains operate Wed, Thu, Fri, Sat, Sun, Mon, with all trains on Fri, Sat, Sun, and only some of them on Wed, Thu, Mon. Looking at the schedule, it appears that Amtrak may be cobbling together one additional trainset to operate the additional services.

I believe Amtrak operated some additional trains (I want to say early morning KAL-CHI and late night CHI-KAL) over a holiday weekend (Memorial Day or Labor Day) a year or two ago.

It was Labor Day weekend. I remember waking up to the train around 7:30 AM and wondering what on earth was going on. I thought it was an extremely late Wolverine from the night before.

I would be REALLY HAPPY if they made that late train permanent. I have zero issues getting into KAL around 1:30 if it means spending more time in Chicago during a weekend trip. Considering the college crowd from WMU, Kalamazoo College, and KVCC, I can see where there may be some demand. I see a lot of long-distance couples hugging each other goodbye in KAL and CHI every weekend. I'd be happier if they moved the KAL arrival time to midnight, but 1:30 could work on occasion.

We're coming back from ABQ on the SWC that Saturday, so I'm a bit relieved there's a 10:00 option in addition to the 6:00 Wolverine. If the SWC is delayed a couple hours or more, we won't have to worry about missing our train home. I can always call and change the reservation from the train.

 

[Anderson]

Truncated trains like that are always going to be a sticky issue...the question becomes whether it makes more sense to just bite the bullet and have a super-late arrival at a major endpoint (where you'll likely get at least some through ridership but where it will be pretty paltry) or to cut the train back. VA has a situation like that developing...do you just run all of the trains through to NPN/NFK so you can consolidate the crew base, even if one of them is leaving at 3 AM and another is potentially getting in past midnight? Or do you cut some back to RVR and deal with stationing trains and a few OBS folks in different cities?

Edit: And giving a bit more thought to this, I do have to wonder what the effects of "around the clock" train service in some places would be on ridership. I know that odd-hours trains will, on their own, only attract but so much ridership, but when major destinations are 6-8 hours away I do suspect that trains leaving at absurdly early times will still attract riders. Most of my criticism of such trains is when they're the only trains at a station.

In the case of Virginia, I can't help but wonder if extending 190, 110, or 170 further south wouldn't generate business (especially as a candidate for extension to Raleigh or Charlotte). Obviously, extending all of them south would be a bit silly, but I could see there being a market for a late night departure from RVR, NFK, and/or RGH that gets you to the New York area by morning (and for a SB departure from NYP that gets you into those areas by an early-but-respectable hour). Particularly in the case of a pair of trains like 190/177, the "backwards team" for 66/67 between WAS and NYP, (which seem to be pretty close to ghost towns south of NYP), you'd probably have a shot at filling seats.

 

[fairviewroad]

It's sort of like the "Midnight Express" that Amtrak has run on the Cascades the last few years (a train that I'd like to experience at some point, I would note).

Well, it's loaded into the system again this year and is the only SEA-PDX train on 11/21 that's still selling at low bucket. So come on out to the great northwest!

As a local, I'd have to say the idea of arriving into PDX at 4 AM on Thanksgiving morning isn't on my bucket list.... :mellow:

I'm guessing the train is typically full of college students sprawled out over every available space. It's really too bad they don't offer the "express"

as one of the mid-day departures on the day before T-giving...I'm sure they'd have no trouble selling it out.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Where's Amtrak getting the equipment? New corridor cars ain't here yet.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

Where's Amtrak getting the equipment? New corridor cars ain't here yet.

Amtrak has plenty of single level coaches for short haul like horizon and amfleet 1s.

 

[Anderson]

It's sort of like the "Midnight Express" that Amtrak has run on the Cascades the last few years (a train that I'd like to experience at some point, I would note).

Well, it's loaded into the system again this year and is the only SEA-PDX train on 11/21 that's still selling at low bucket. So come on out to the great northwest!

As a local, I'd have to say the idea of arriving into PDX at 4 AM on Thanksgiving morning isn't on my bucket list.... :mellow:

I'm guessing the train is typically full of college students sprawled out over every available space. It's really too bad they don't offer the "express"

as one of the mid-day departures on the day before T-giving...I'm sure they'd have no trouble selling it out.

The rub is that they have to time it when the set isn't in use with regular service...which basically means late night, early morning, etc. Get them another couple of trainsets or another batch of equipment and an express would actually make sense (VIA's got something like this from TWO-MTR via Ottawa).

 

[Trogdor]

Where's Amtrak getting the equipment? New corridor cars ain't here yet.

Amtrak's standard practice is to increase equipment availability during the Thanksgiving holiday week by halting all non-essential maintenance for several days. This works because the period before and after Thanksgiving tend to be slow periods for travel, and so extra cars are out of service for maintenance during the low periods to make up for it.

 

[Trogdor]

It's sort of like the "Midnight Express" that Amtrak has run on the Cascades the last few years (a train that I'd like to experience at some point, I would note).

Well, it's loaded into the system again this year and is the only SEA-PDX train on 11/21 that's still selling at low bucket. So come on out to the great northwest!

As a local, I'd have to say the idea of arriving into PDX at 4 AM on Thanksgiving morning isn't on my bucket list.... :mellow:

I'm guessing the train is typically full of college students sprawled out over every available space. It's really too bad they don't offer the "express"

as one of the mid-day departures on the day before T-giving...I'm sure they'd have no trouble selling it out.

The rub is that they have to time it when the set isn't in use with regular service...which basically means late night, early morning, etc. Get them another couple of trainsets or another batch of equipment and an express would actually make sense (VIA's got something like this from TWO-MTR via Ottawa).

The express train is simply an equipment move that Amtrak decided to sell tickets on instead of having it run empty. There really isn't a market for a midnight-4 am train on a bunch of Amfleets/Horizons, nor are the loads ever very high, but selling a dozen or so tickets gets you a couple hundred extra bucks for, really, no extra cost.

 

[fairviewroad]

For those interested, Amtrak has started to post Thanksgiving week timetables on its Timetables page.

The current ones available are NEC, Empire Service, and Keystones.

 

[Mackensen]

When Amtrak did this a few years ago for Labor Day the equipment set was parked opposite Western Michigan University's football stadium after the late night/early morning arrival. It's double-track there and of course there isn't any local traffic to worry about.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Where's Amtrak getting the equipment? New corridor cars ain't here yet.

Amtrak's standard practice is to increase equipment availability during the Thanksgiving holiday week by halting all non-essential maintenance for several days. This works because the period before and after Thanksgiving tend to be slow periods for travel, and so extra cars are out of service for maintenance during the low periods to make up for it.

OK, that makes sense. Guess I'm not travelling during Thanksgiving, I'm not taking any risks with safety.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

Where's Amtrak getting the equipment? New corridor cars ain't here yet.

Amtrak's standard practice is to increase equipment availability during the Thanksgiving holiday week by halting all non-essential maintenance for several days. This works because the period before and after Thanksgiving tend to be slow periods for travel, and so extra cars are out of service for maintenance during the low periods to make up for it.

OK, that makes sense. Guess I'm not travelling during Thanksgiving, I'm not taking any risks with safety.

All required maintenance is completed. Amtrak gets it all done. They time it so that maintenance is done in the slower periods, but it is still done. To say that you will not travel for safety issues here is quite ridiculous.

 

[AlanB]

Amtrak's standard practice is to increase equipment availability during the Thanksgiving holiday week by halting all non-essential maintenance for several days. This works because the period before and after Thanksgiving tend to be slow periods for travel, and so extra cars are out of service for maintenance during the low periods to make up for it.

OK, that makes sense. Guess I'm not travelling during Thanksgiving, I'm not taking any risks with safety.

All required maintenance is completed. Amtrak gets it all done. They time it so that maintenance is done in the slower periods, but it is still done. To say that you will not travel for safety issues here is quite ridiculous.

Amtrak isn't putting unsafe equipment out on the road. It's a matter of cancelling refurbishments of cars, doing some 92 day inspections 5 days early, and stuff like that. If a car needs safety work, then it will stay in the shop or the yard.

 

[Trogdor]

Amtrak isn't putting unsafe equipment out on the road. It's a matter of cancelling refurbishments of cars, doing some 92 day inspections 5 days early, and stuff like that. If a car needs safety work, then it will stay in the shop or the yard.

Right. It's really more along the lines of seat cushions not getting replaced, reading lights not getting fixed, etc. That's why I said non-essential. Why some people want to translate that to being unsafe is beyond me.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Amtrak's standard practice is to increase equipment availability during the Thanksgiving holiday week by halting all non-essential maintenance for several days. This works because the period before and after Thanksgiving tend to be slow periods for travel, and so extra cars are out of service for maintenance during the low periods to make up for it.

OK, that makes sense. Guess I'm not travelling during Thanksgiving, I'm not taking any risks with safety.

All required maintenance is completed. Amtrak gets it all done. They time it so that maintenance is done in the slower periods, but it is still done. To say that you will not travel for safety issues here is quite ridiculous.

Amtrak isn't putting unsafe equipment out on the road. It's a matter of cancelling refurbishments of cars, doing some 92 day inspections 5 days early, and stuff like that. If a car needs safety work, then it will stay in the shop or the yard.

OK, good to know.

 

[Anderson]

One thing to remember is that there's a little bit of "wiggle room" in the maintenance schedules, especially as Thanksgiving is reasonably close to the slow periods in Sep/Oct and Jan/Feb. So what Amtrak likely does is run a few more cars through their inspections during these "off" periods once they draw down a few trains' lengths from summer status so that they don't have to do any inspections over the week surrounding Thanksgiving (as well as minimizing inspection needs at Christmas, too, I suspect). This has an incidental benefit since those are times that I suspect a lot of people at the shops want off, too. But anything unsafe isn't going to be on the road, period.