Amtrak's Cardinal

[the_traveler]

Also, I don't think a lot of people realize that the Capitol Limited/Pennsylvanian is the only train from Chicago that will give a same day connection to Connecticut and Rhode Island.

While it's true that you will not arrive the same day in RI or CT that you would depart WAS, but #66 departs WAS at 10 PM and arrives between 5 and 7 AM.

I would call a 10 PM departure "the same day", and I personally would rather arrive in KIN @ ~6:30 AM than ~midnight! And I would welcome the "stopover" in DC for a few hours!

Thats interesting - I consider a "same day connection" as one where you step onto your connection the same day in which you arrived at the connecting hub and you arrive home (or your destination) the same day. That is to say, I've always thought of a "same day connection" one in which it wouldn't require another overnight to get you home.

Not to say that either view is right or wrong, just interesting to see a difference of opinions.

Just using the infamous SDL-WAS-CHI-PDX-LAX 2 zone AGR award as an example:

1) You have a "same day connection" in WAS, but it's not the same day that you left SDL

2) You have a "same day connection" in CHI, but it's not the same day that you left WAS

3) You have a "same day connection" in PDX, but it is not the same day that you left CHI

4) You do not arrive in LAX (your destination) on the same day that you left from SDL - but you did not stay in any other city overnight, all connections were within a few hours of arrival!

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

I'm wondering. Is it possible that one of the reasons they are creating more CCCs is that they intend to put the Cardinal back to Superliner with a CCC?

Methinks you just might be on to somethin' there Magee!

I ran across a Sleeper Car Attendant I knew at Baltimore Penn a while back, and he mentioned that he heard that they were exploring changing the Cardinal to WAS-CHI train using Superliners. CCCs would be an ideal method of carrying this out, particularly if they were Lounge-Diners retaining the wrap around windows.

Of course, this then begs the question of just what trains would the 28000 series Amlounge Diner-Lite conversions go to. Candidates would include the Palmetto, Pennsylvanian, Carolinian, and Maple Leaf, and of course this is hoping that management realizes these cars are insufficient for overnight LD trains like the LSL.

True this is a lot of speculation, but it won't be long before Fall arrives.

Is there just one Cardinal trainset currently?

(If they were going to put one Viewliner on #66 and another on #67, they'd need two Viewliners, but I'd hope that the Twilight Shoreliner would be something they'd keep in mind if they free up Viewliners from trains such as the Cardinal.)

 

[AlanB]

Is there just one Cardinal trainset currently?
(If they were going to put one Viewliner on #66 and another on #67, they'd need two Viewliners, but I'd hope that the Twilight Shoreliner would be something they'd keep in mind if they free up Viewliners from trains such as the Cardinal.)

No, the Cardinal requires two trainsets to cover its runs. Therefore converting it to Superliner cars would free up to Viewliner sleepers.

 

[Chessie Hokie]

Wow...hard to understand some of the perspective with the "same day connection" thread. Remembering that the context is rail travel, it really is simple:

If you are on a trip that requires changing from one train to another in a particular city and if arrival on one train and departure on the other train take place on the same calendar date...then you have a same day connection. If the other train departs after midnight on the date of your arrival, then you would have a next day connection.

Where and when your trip originated and where/when you arrive at your destination has nothing to do with the connection between trains in that city.

The caveat here, though, is that we are talking same day connections between trains, not cities. Saying you have a same day connection to a city muddles it all up and makes one sound like an airline passenger (heaven forbid! ) Trains simply can't leap across the continent in a single bound like planes...thank goodness. Because air travel has neither the scheduling constraints nor the mystique, nor the nostalgic train names of long-distance rail travel (it's simply boring, unimaginative flight numbers), you won't often hear sheep-like, bruttish air travelers talking about connecting from DL 1437 to DL 456 (boring!)...they say "Bubba had a connection from RIC through DCA for DFW to attend the world tractor-pull championships", or a connection in Charlotte for Savannah, or whatever...it is simply understood that they are going to arrive at DFW or Savannah the same day unless they specifically utter those dreaded words: Red Eye (or are flying overseas).

An engagingly witty, handsome and astute rail traveler, on the other hand, speaks of connections between trains (often speaking of named trains in almost reverent tones): "Mr. Reginald Smythe-Jones had a same day connection in Chicago from the Zephyr to the Capitol Limited on his way to attend a Mensa convention"...not a same day connection in Chicago from Sacramento to Washington. That just doesn't work...

It is simply a question of understanding the nuances between modes of transport and using the correct terminology in context. Forget that air context lingo. We are talking about trains here, not airplanes! Sheesh! :blink:

 

[mikerd5522]

So I've finished my trip on Memorial Day weekend and it was great! Here are some of my general impressions and observations.

The Cardinal - Train 51

Passengers and Crew

We boarded from Penn Station at about 6:30 am and were directed to the approperiate car (People heading to Chicago were seated in the last coach car - in front of the Diner-Lounge). To my surprise there were about 4 or 5 people heading straight to Chicago. We gradually picked up more people along the route before we got to Washington - most were for points in Virginia and West Virginia.

Interesting note - the train was not fully staffed until we reached DC - only a conductor, assistant conductor, and SA for the snack portion of the lounge car. The snack portion of the lounge car did not open till Baltimore (no food available from NYP to BAL) and full meal service started for lunch, after we left DC. Following our departure from DC, a coach attendant and the dinner car server (LSA?) joined the train.

We were sold out for most of the trip - each coach was jammed packed. And just as many of you predicted, the train turned over quite a bit. The first large turnover was in Charlottesville, Second in Cincinnati, Third in Indianapolis. As for sleeping in coach - I was shocked to find out it was one of the best night sleeping I've ever had on a train (and those other times have been in a sleeper!)

Scenery

Quite impressive - Climbing through the foothills of Virginia and West Virginia leading into the New River Gorge is a trip that I recommend for all. And even though I was heading westbound, I think I got in a good majority of the scenery before darkness hit. We were just coming into the outskirts of Charleston WV when it was difficult to see outside. There were definitely a few jaw dropping moments.

Amfleet Diner-Lite

This was my first experience with this setup and I must say, overall I was impressed. I ordered the ravioli, which was actually quite good. It was served piping hot and was very tasty. I had a chocolate bundt cake for desert which was pretty good - all though I did watch the server take the bundt cake directly out of a card board box and place it on a plate

The design and space available for the car was a little bit cramped. I wouldn't say it was poorly designed - everything seemed to "fit where it was placed" but there was a huge lack of space. The server had her supplies and such placed on a half table in the dinning section and another table in the cafe section was used for storage. There was a liquor cabinet at one end of the car and a large freezer towards the other end. The preparation area also seemed to be lacking a significant amount of space.

But overall, I came to eat the food and to be served in a timely manner (which I was).

An "On-Time" Trip

We left NYP on time and arrive into WAS on time as well. We lost about 20 minutes getting to Alexandra and stayed about 20 - 30 minutes down until we hit Indianapolis. From here we departed on time (630 am) but had to wait to enter and leave the Lafayette IN station - which costs us 20 minutes. Following this, we arrive into CHI at 10:45, 10 minutes late.

The Capitol Limited - Train 30

When I had checked in at the Metropolitan Lounge, they had asked me to make dinner reservations and told me to return by 6pm. I chose the earliest reservations at 6:30.

I had the steak for dinner - which was pretty good, although I don't know if I'd pay 21 dollars for it. It was served with beans and a baked potato. The rolls served were excellent - as they were a bit warm and seasoned nicely. The salads have definitely improved - a wider selection of greens, croutons, and vegetables.

The Capitol Limited was jammed packed and the dinning car was hopping. Each seating was filled and they had to add a few extra on. There were at least 4 servers and the sleeping car/coach attendants came into help as well. What was really interesting was that there were a 5 managers on board, heading home from a meeting. Each of these managers helped out in the dinning car - wether it was setting tables and bringing out food. One of the managers, who turned out to be a supervisor for food services, did not stop working throughout the entire trip. Whether it was taking orders, bringing out food, clearing plates, ringing up bills. It was quite impressive to see her (an all other managers) devotion and work ethic. Additionally, it was evident that there was a mutual respect between the staff and the managers - as they would joke around and also talk casually to each other. It was very impressive to watch.

The Capitol ran on time for most of the trip and arrived into DC around 1:41 pm, for a scheduled 2:00 pm arrival time.

While both of these trains are different - with the Cardinal being the runt of Amtrak's LD litter, I found the service to be great and similiar across both trains. Never have I met more friendly people - staff or passengers - on each train. I would do this trip again tomorrow if I could!

If anyone has any additional questions, please ask!

 

[travelerpaul]

I thought the trip was the best scenery east of the Mississippi, but the trip on the Cardinal seemed to drag a bit between Chicago and Washington --- very very slow in some parts... like through Indiana and West Virginia. Maybe it was just me though... I am used to taking western trips with a Sightseer lounge... it just got very boring being in my roomette all day. I wish there was a better lounge on the car -- and it wasn't a diner/lounge.
The sleeper rates are expensive... I think I paid $416. (granted it was the week before Christmas last year)

I don't know if I would do that again. I'd rather spend $416 on a roomette on 421 or 422 and get 3 nights on the train for the price of 1.

What's the difference between a sleeper and a roomette? The size?

 

[AlanB]

I thought the trip was the best scenery east of the Mississippi, but the trip on the Cardinal seemed to drag a bit between Chicago and Washington --- very very slow in some parts... like through Indiana and West Virginia. Maybe it was just me though... I am used to taking western trips with a Sightseer lounge... it just got very boring being in my roomette all day. I wish there was a better lounge on the car -- and it wasn't a diner/lounge.
The sleeper rates are expensive... I think I paid $416. (granted it was the week before Christmas last year)

I don't know if I would do that again. I'd rather spend $416 on a roomette on 421 or 422 and get 3 nights on the train for the price of 1.

What's the difference between a sleeper and a roomette? The size?

Sleeper generally refers to the sleeper car, which offers roomettes (the smallest accomodation), bedrooms (much larger), and a handicapped room. On the double decker Superliner cars, there is also a Family room that is available. It contains 2 adult beds and two child beds.

 

[jackal]

[snip]While both of these trains are different - with the Cardinal being the runt of Amtrak's LD litter, I found the service to be great and similiar across both trains. Never have I met more friendly people - staff or passengers - on each train. I would do this trip again tomorrow if I could!

Great report--thanks for writing! I did the same trip as you back in August. Unfortunately, I missed much of the New River Gorge scenery, as I had just arrived from being at work for 10 hours followed by 20 hours of sleepless flying from Alaska into CLT followed by a five-hour train ride from CLT-CVS and a several-hour layover in CVS, and I fell asleep within a half an hour of boarding the train.

I don't recall eating on the Cardinal, so it was interesting to read your review of Diner-Lite, especially as I'm still a bit confused on the difference between all of the Amtrak dining options (full-service, SDS, CCC, Diner-Lite, etc.--I know someone compiled a list for me upon my request in another thread some time back, but goodness knows where that thread's disappeared to...).

Thanks again for writing!

 

[printman2000]

The Cardinal - Train 51We boarded from Penn Station at about 6:30 am and were directed to the approperiate car (People heading to Chicago were seated in the last coach car - in front of the Diner-Lounge).

Last coach in FRONT of the diner-lounge? Does that mean the sleeper was on the rear of the train?

 

[Rafi]

The Cardinal - Train 51We boarded from Penn Station at about 6:30 am and were directed to the approperiate car (People heading to Chicago were seated in the last coach car - in front of the Diner-Lounge).

Last coach in FRONT of the diner-lounge? Does that mean the sleeper was on the rear of the train?

Correct, because there's no baggage car on the Cardinal, the horn noise was loud enough that Amtrak moved the sleeper to the rear about a year and a half ago.

Rafi

 

[MrFSS]

The Cardinal - Train 51We boarded from Penn Station at about 6:30 am and were directed to the approperiate car (People heading to Chicago were seated in the last coach car - in front of the Diner-Lounge).

Last coach in FRONT of the diner-lounge? Does that mean the sleeper was on the rear of the train?

Correct, because there's no baggage car on the Cardinal, the horn noise was loud enough that Amtrak moved the sleeper to the rear about a year and a half ago.

Rafi

The sleeper was on the rear three years ago when I rode it. I have ridden it in coach in the car right next to the engine - take ear plugs!

 

[Green Maned Lion]

[snip]While both of these trains are different - with the Cardinal being the runt of Amtrak's LD litter, I found the service to be great and similiar across both trains. Never have I met more friendly people - staff or passengers - on each train. I would do this trip again tomorrow if I could!

Great report--thanks for writing! I did the same trip as you back in August. Unfortunately, I missed much of the New River Gorge scenery, as I had just arrived from being at work for 10 hours followed by 20 hours of sleepless flying from Alaska into CLT followed by a five-hour train ride from CLT-CVS and a several-hour layover in CVS, and I fell asleep within a half an hour of boarding the train.

I don't recall eating on the Cardinal, so it was interesting to read your review of Diner-Lite, especially as I'm still a bit confused on the difference between all of the Amtrak dining options (full-service, SDS, CCC, Diner-Lite, etc.--I know someone compiled a list for me upon my request in another thread some time back, but goodness knows where that thread's disappeared to...).

Thanks again for writing!

Link

We had that discussion here, I think.

 

[Chatter163]

The sleeper was on the rear three years ago when I rode it.

Ditto four years ago when I rode.

 

[Rail Freak]

Well one problem is you will be taking the Cardinal west, so you will probably miss the New River Gorge as it will be dark.

Actually, you should be okay as long as the train is reasonably on time, which isn't much of a problem on the westbound at that point (the eastbound is another story, though). Sunset in Charleston on Memorial Day will be at 8:40 PM...you should be well past both the Gorge and Charleston by then. If on schedule you should be going through the Gorge from about 6 PM through 7 PM. Of course there will be shadows by then.

I always make a point of checking sunrise/sunset in preparation for my travels, specific to each date and location, which can be found at the U.S. Naval Observatory website here.

I'll be interested to read your trip report. I'll be taking the Cardinal to Chicago in July...in coach!

Amtrak won't book the eastbound Cardinal/Meteor same day connection because of OTP of the Cardinal apparently, meaning overnight in D.C.! <_<

 

[AlanB]

Well one problem is you will be taking the Cardinal west, so you will probably miss the New River Gorge as it will be dark.

Actually, you should be okay as long as the train is reasonably on time, which isn't much of a problem on the westbound at that point (the eastbound is another story, though). Sunset in Charleston on Memorial Day will be at 8:40 PM...you should be well past both the Gorge and Charleston by then. If on schedule you should be going through the Gorge from about 6 PM through 7 PM. Of course there will be shadows by then.

I always make a point of checking sunrise/sunset in preparation for my travels, specific to each date and location, which can be found at the U.S. Naval Observatory website here.

I'll be interested to read your trip report. I'll be taking the Cardinal to Chicago in July...in coach!

Amtrak won't book the eastbound Cardinal/Meteor same day connection because of OTP of the Cardinal apparently, meaning overnight in D.C.! <_<

That is true, but they will book a same day bus conection between the Cardinal at Charlottesville and the Meteor at Richmond.

 

[Rail Freak]

Well one problem is you will be taking the Cardinal west, so you will probably miss the New River Gorge as it will be dark.

Actually, you should be okay as long as the train is reasonably on time, which isn't much of a problem on the westbound at that point (the eastbound is another story, though). Sunset in Charleston on Memorial Day will be at 8:40 PM...you should be well past both the Gorge and Charleston by then. If on schedule you should be going through the Gorge from about 6 PM through 7 PM. Of course there will be shadows by then.

I always make a point of checking sunrise/sunset in preparation for my travels, specific to each date and location, which can be found at the U.S. Naval Observatory website here.

I'll be interested to read your trip report. I'll be taking the Cardinal to Chicago in July...in coach!

Amtrak won't book the eastbound Cardinal/Meteor same day connection because of OTP of the Cardinal apparently, meaning overnight in D.C.! <_<

That is true, but they will book a same day bus conection between the Cardinal at Charlottesville and the Meteor at Richmond.

Hmmmmm,

Would I miss any of the good scenery I'll be taking the eastbound Cardinal for in the 1st place? Woul I still be able to book a sleeper on the Meteor? Could I make the 5:09 Star?

 

[Rail Freak]

Well one problem is you will be taking the Cardinal west, so you will probably miss the New River Gorge as it will be dark.

Actually, you should be okay as long as the train is reasonably on time, which isn't much of a problem on the westbound at that point (the eastbound is another story, though). Sunset in Charleston on Memorial Day will be at 8:40 PM...you should be well past both the Gorge and Charleston by then. If on schedule you should be going through the Gorge from about 6 PM through 7 PM. Of course there will be shadows by then.

I always make a point of checking sunrise/sunset in preparation for my travels, specific to each date and location, which can be found at the U.S. Naval Observatory website here.

I'll be interested to read your trip report. I'll be taking the Cardinal to Chicago in July...in coach!

Amtrak won't book the eastbound Cardinal/Meteor same day connection because of OTP of the Cardinal apparently, meaning overnight in D.C.! <_<

That is true, but they will book a same day bus conection between the Cardinal at Charlottesville and the Meteor at Richmond.

Alan, You are A Life Saver,

SM - WAS -Regional 184 -NYP- LSL - CUS- Card (to Charlottesville) - bus - Richmond- SM-Orl

 

[AlanB]

That is true, but they will book a same day bus conection between the Cardinal at Charlottesville and the Meteor at Richmond.

Alan, You are A Life Saver,

SM - WAS -Regional 184 -NYP- LSL - CUS- Card (to Charlottesville) - bus - Richmond- SM-Orl

Why not just stay on the SM to NY?

No need to transfer trains in DC to Regional 184, unless you want the thrill of riding a Regional.

 

[Rail Freak]

That is true, but they will book a same day bus conection between the Cardinal at Charlottesville and the Meteor at Richmond.

Alan, You are A Life Saver,

SM - WAS -Regional 184 -NYP- LSL - CUS- Card (to Charlottesville) - bus - Richmond- SM-Orl

Why not just stay on the SM to NY?

No need to transfer trains in DC to Regional 184, unless you want the thrill of riding a Regional.

Man, I've got a lot to learn!

I'll have to think about it. Think it would break up a longer wait in NYP?

:unsure:

 

[AlanB]

That is true, but they will book a same day bus conection between the Cardinal at Charlottesville and the Meteor at Richmond.

Alan, You are A Life Saver,

SM - WAS -Regional 184 -NYP- LSL - CUS- Card (to Charlottesville) - bus - Richmond- SM-Orl

Why not just stay on the SM to NY?

No need to transfer trains in DC to Regional 184, unless you want the thrill of riding a Regional.

Man, I've got a lot to learn!

I'll have to think about it. Think it would break up a longer wait in NYP?

:unsure:

It would do that, assuming that you're on time. If you're running late, it could complicate things.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

I wouldn't take the New Yorker in that context, RF. If you want to self book, you can try an Acela, but otherwise, I'd just stay on the Silver. (New Yorker is the former name of Regional 184)